AIBU to ask you who started the Troubles in the North of Ireland?

[1FineDane]

If you watch this new BBC documentary, what is your answer?
I know British people think the IRA started the whole shit, but this is a BBC documentary and fairly unbiased.

I hope you watch it to realise what history there is in Northern Ireland.

www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m0008c47/spotlight-spotlight-on-the-troubles-a-secret-history-episode-1

The troubles spilled over onto mainland Britain and many innocent people with no direct involvement with the conflict were killed. I lived through those times.

Wtf does this even mean? That everyone who died in NI wasn't innocent? Do you know why it spilled over to the mainland? Was it only problem once it did so?

Wtf does this even mean? That everyone who died in NI wasn't innocent? Do you know why it spilled over to the mainland? Was it only problem once it did so?

That definitely seems to be the opinion of a lot of British people, only an issue when it hits their shores and everyone "over there" obviously caused it. It's like how we look at "those middle eastern countries" no thought to how many innocents have been killed "over there" but Twin Towers are attacked and those savages (all of them) are evil (I'm not speaking about the terrorists here btw obviously, I mean the innocent ordinary people who are living everyday in terror)

**I am in no way belittling terrorist attack victims in Britain or the USA, I'm simply saying ALL innocent victims are worth the same

I am in no way belittling terrorist attack victims in Britain or the USA, I'm simply saying ALL innocent victims are worth the same

I agree totally.
Most people in Britain’s knowledge of the troubles consists solely of the actions of the IRA on English soil.

Exactly & I seen that ignorance all the time.

Most people in Britain’s knowledge of the troubles consists solely of the actions of the IRA on English soil.

You've hit the nail on the head right there.

Giving Ireland back to the Irish is the only solution but I know that won't please many.

Cromwell was one evil bastard.

Giving Ireland back to the Irish is the only solution but I know that won't please many.

In what way would you consider that a solution? In the sense that it would no longer be the UK's problem?

It belonged to Ireland. There's a fecking clue in the name.

It belonged to Ireland. There's a fecking clue in the name

If course it did. But if you suddenly hand Northern Ireland back to Ireland and tell them to get on with it then Irish people will most likely die as a result. So that doesn't make it a solution for Ireland, only a solution outside of Ireland.

Most people in Britain’s knowledge of the troubles consists solely of the actions of the IRA on English soil

Probably depends on their age. I remember it all - bluddy depressing, on the news constantly, no one seemed to have any solution.

Incomprehensible cruelty to other people just like you.

@aquashiv What do you suggest they do with the 1000's of British loyalists in NI. Maybe ship them across the water with the DUP to the mainland. 🤣 It is about as feasible as your suggestion.
A huge part of the troubles were loyalist terrified of a united Ireland.
What makes you think they'd agree now.

Looks like Arlene is willing to look at a NI only backstop.........

Brave and generous lady.......

I saw that. I think she knows she has no choice, many DUP representatives wanted to have the best of both worlds with the backstop, their fear was losing their identity.
They know it can't work against it for agriculture and trade, there is no point in biting if your nose.
Scotland will want similar.

@59EmeraldShamrock what do you suggest then? I said it would not please many.
Rather crude argument talking about shipping off to the UK.
Asking me is a waste of time ask the people of NI.

The loyalists have just as much right to be in Ireland rediculous to suggest they leave.
Or to repeat the oppression suffered by Catholics for centuries.
It's not about religion now so few go to church. Give the land back no need for any border ever again. Give the people a referendum let them decide. The last one was nearly 50 years ago and was a sham.

I think aquashiv the majority of people were happy with the status quo before Brexit. The GFA gave people peace and a right of identy, whether that was Irish or British. Unfortunately Brexit has brought old issues to the forefront again. A lot of Irish in NI feel they will be abandoned and their connection to ROI will be lost. A lot of British in NI fear a United Ireland and that they will be left living in a foreign land with a foreign government. Then there are those in the middle who probably have no connection to either country. It's really is a balancing act. A border between NI and ROI will cause major issues but so too will the border in the sea. It really boils down to which one will cause the least problems, which one the majority wants and going with that one. I hope that now the DUP and Boris Johnson seem to be recognising that the GFA needs to be protected that progress will be made. I genuinely believe that Leo Varadkar is open to any suggestion that will actually work.
I don't think giving people the vote for uniting Ireland would be right for now, the Troubles weren't that long ago, a lot of people suffered and lost loved ones. Progress has being made in the last 20 years but so much more has to be done. A vote now would only cause an eruption of violence and unrest.

@aquashiv I suggest an agreement between parties on the backstop that benefits NI as a country not its differences. I suggest major investment in NI.
NI was really thriving and buzzing with investors before Brexit.
It is a beautiful place where most people want the same thing, respect peace and equal rights.
It is the least it deserves.

The loyalists have just as much right to be in Ireland rediculous to suggest they leave
Nobody suggested they leave but why would they want to be Irish in a united Ireland.
It isn't possible.
Leave them as they are in peace, respect the GFA and invest.

If they could get away with it the UK would hand back NI in a heart beat. It would save them a fortune.

It would save them a fortune.

Indeed & why many friends & family I know in the Republic aren't so keen on "taking it back".

47leaserspottedmummybird I agree. The GFA is not a permanent solution.
38EmeraldShamrock is not a country!
Your argument that there was peace is false and patronising. There is still violence and unrest. It did not just stop. Many knew that it was just a plaster over the wound.

but why would they want to be Irish in a united Ireland.

It isn't possible.

Really? Where is your evidence? If you look at latest stats for those seeking an Irish passport not with withstanding the dual nationality option , some indication that being " Irish" is a rather attractive identity.

39eeksville very true!

@aquashiv The latest stats increase for the Irish passport were mainly mainland UK applying due to brexit.
Why wouldn't you take dual Nationality. My DD born in Belfast has dual Nationality, doesn't mean she ever wants to be considered British.
What about the NHS and PIP payments transport grants for cars for disability all available in NI. We don't have those things here.
Are you fron NI it was hardly fake peace when the younger generation have known peace and integration for decades.

Different religious beliefs