I've been told I dress too smartly at work...

[Appletina]

and I've been told I need to dress more casually.

I tend to wear smart day dresses, or skirts with a top or blouse, from places like Hobbs, Reiss, Jaeger. I don't wear jackets or blazers or full on suits. I wear low heels.

I work with the public and apparently my dress sense could be perceived as intimidating and so I am to dress more casually... I think that's a ridiculous and patronising thing to say about the great British public!

AIBU to continue to keep dressing as I am?

Do we know vaguely what her role is? I’m pretty certain it’s not with vulnerable people from the the OP, just the way she phrased the last para re ‘the Great British public’ makes it sounded like it’s a broader more random cross section than vulnerable groups.

Agree with @LolaSmiles @Appletina if it’s come from your boss I would still question it further - why now, is there a background to it, i.e has a customer/client complained or has it come from another member of staff. I very much suspect the latter and it most definitely could be a form of bullying. I have a good idea what your personal style is and I have know doubt you always look lovely and can pick clothes well, the brands are important for those people who’ve called that out because clothes from those places tend to look very chic and timeless, you can spend a similar amount and not get as nice an end result. We’ve all worked with women who for whatever reason don’t make an effort but then feel threatened by people that do and feel the need to act out on it. I could cite so many examples from across the years but don’t have time. One of my first bosses used to be a f*cker for this though, she had no personal style and wore some horrendous things despite probably earning 3 time’s as much as me and I used to continually get snide comments dressed up as trying to make me adhere to her imagined dress code. I.e something which didn’t make her look even worse - harsh but true. There have been so many others over the years both at me and between other people.

Obviously if your digging makes it clear it has come from a customer/client then it might be worth heeding the advice. But I certainly think if it was your manager they have a duty to justify their comments if they are going to criticise you on such a personal level.

How can anyone know whether your attire is suitable for a task if they don't know what the task is?

This

And how the conversation went.
It could have been a passing comment in the middle of a conversation about how people dress in the office.
Or it could have been an instruction-sounding pointed remark.

Having just wasted 15 minutes of my life scrolling through to see what her job is in order to give an informed reply I m now wishing I hadn’t bothered.
Speculation now follows GP/ Dr smart casual, posh frocks may intimidate and folks may not feel comfy opening up.
Counsellor ( of any sort) ditto
Vet... not sensible to stick your hand up a cows bum with a dress and cardi on
Waste disposal operative .... dress will get mucky
Olympic athlete.... vest and shorts more appropriate
Office worker... dress code + whatever you fancy generally
Lawyer/solicitor.... we pay you enough so I expect you to look smart and show me you re spending enough to impress me
Teacher... just turn up and teach my kids, don’t care what you wear
Sex worker..... dresses don t work... just saying 😂
Estate agent.... it ll take more than a dress and cardi to intimidate me

Apologies for any group of workers missed here but hope you get the drift..... now back to me getting a life x

This thread is awesome for demonstrating the different approaches of PP and in house advice. Do you want the theory or the practical / pragmatic advice that keeps the business ticking?

WelcomeToShootingStars It's a pointless thread.

Its actually a really useful thread. This is one of the areas of work where women and sometimes men may face very real discrimination, and in which we have made vast progress in recent years. Its no longer considered acceptable for employers to demand that female employees wear high heels, for instance.

I think this discussion has raised loads of useful issues and hopefully given people a chance to think about what is acceptable that may be demanded of them in the workplace.

And, like it or not, employment law is an area on which employers are willing to spend large sums of money avoiding potential law suits. It is one of the busiest areas of law out there, and much of it is non-contentious (not involving court). Its also an area in which the Government and the Equalities and Human Rights Commission have published recent guidance, its considered that important.

655 messages and still don't know what the job is / or even industry it is in, which is so relevant. I am surprised there are 655 messages of a discussion without knowing it. Hate these kind of OP's.

Where field do you work in, WelcomeToTheShootingStars? Saying wearing a Hobbs dress would be “utterly inappropriate” in your case is kind of useless information without context.
If you’re a steeplejack, for example, it would be understandable.

If you all dressed in designer wear and working with some people who are struggling. It can be quite intimidating and make you look unapproachable.
Or have you just started this thread to show off about your designer wardrobe,
Lightheaded hence the wink and grin, before I get eaten for breakfast

It strikes me that some teachers, for instance, dress far too informally.
Some schools like their teachers to dress down so that the students can relate better to them.
I had a friend who worked in a very deprived area of London and all the teachers were expected to be quite casually dressed so that they looked like the kids parents and neighbours and made the kids more likely to trust and listen to them.
It's not patronising to try to win a groups trust and confidence if you are in a supportive role.
Sometimes super smart is intimidating when children have never seen peers dressed in that way.
Anyway sorry for going off topic because the OP isn't a teacher.

I'm impressed if your shirt and overweight that you can get clothes to fit in Hobbs and Jaegar.

*short

BarbaraOfSeville Would it be discriminatory if the dress code/uniform for all employees was trousers?

Skirts are impractical for some jobs, so there's bound to be certain sectors where trousers are required. Eg where protective clothing over all the body is required, such as fire fighter or sewerage worker, or where skirts might cause trip hazards (if long and flowy) or restriction of movement (if quite tight).

The published Government advice from 2017 actually discusses this as a comparator (against a requirement to wear high heels) and says it would likely be reasonable and justifiable if required on health and safety grounds. I think h&s grounds would include a high degree of practicality within that definition.

But colleagues nit picking someone's choice of very standard day to day clothing is difficult to justify. Where would it stop? Would all employees be lined up for a cool clothing check daily? What if they obeyed the commandment, purchased an entirely new set of outfits from H&M and had forgotten to do their laundry one night, so teamed an H&M skirt with a smart Reiss blouse? Would they be sent home to change/out to buy something more casual? What if they somehow managed to buy something smart and tailored from H&M? Would they have to ensure they buy particularly shapeless clothing?

Its all nonsense!

Postmanwatcher was that necessary or relevant.

In any case their sizes go up to at least 18.

I am Blind and so, therefore, I have to use assistive technology in order to use the computer I don't understand why you have posted this.

I had this at work once too... I think it’s usually (not always) an admission of how it makes your boss/colleague (if they are the complaining sort) feel. Are you noteably more efficient than your colleagues or better qualified? I did listen because ultimately I don’t want to make my colleagues feel rubbish, but I do think it was more about that than those from the public I actually worked with.

If outward appearance doesn’t matter then why does it matter what the op wears? Warning -always speaking your mind frequently means being rude and opinionated with a false sense of superiority.

@BarbaraofSeville

..and not everything in Hobbs is nice/expensive looking...

True. I found the OP’s name dropping of a trio of brands a bit odd. Hobbs, for instance, I find too predictable - has the styling and colour choices ever changed at all?!

Having just wasted 15 minutes of my life scrolling through to see what her job is in order to give an informed reply
😂

If you “dress down” for some people but wouldn’t for others, you are being condescending. You have judged certain people and decided that they need to be catered for differently.

This happened to a colleague of mine the boss worded it nicely as in you’re dressing too smart for work but it was actually because she went on about her branded clothes in anyway she could ALL the time for example
Colleague 1 (told to dress down)
Colleague 2 (just a colleague)

Colleague 1 would say “oh that tops different where is it from?”
Colleague 2 “primark”
Colleague 1 “oh I have never been in I only buy branded! this dress is Ralph Lauren cost £300”

She should have been told to shut up rather than dress down.

I honestly cannot be bothered to read the hundreds of comments where inevitably you won’t have revealed your actual role and therefore it’s impossible to pass judgement.

From my own experience, I know I have to adjust my overall appearance and approach depending what I’m looking to achieve in my role.

I’m an experienced healthcare professional, I work within two private organisations who employ me for my expertise. My therapeutic relationship with my clients is vastly influenced by what I wear for work during their initial consultation; if it’s board meeting day and I’m in a smart dress and a cardigan, I might as well not book any consultations with new clients as I’ll get monosyllabic answers or such nonsense as me being there to catch them out so the business can dismiss them. On a regular day, I wear either black jeggings or yoga pants, a T-shirt/casual top and a fleece or a jumper; I get full answers, good engagement with lifestyle advice, requests for further support etc.

I do find it incredibly interesting; I even have feedback forms I issue to all those who visit.
When I’m smartly dressed I tend to get spoiled forms, refusals, and tetchy comments about “management”. When I’m dressed casually I get excellent feedback.

Conversely my colleague only dresses smart; we get the youngsters and many of the old hands refusing to see her as they feel she looks down her nose at them.... she doesn’t at all, but it’s how they perceive her as “a snooty cow”. We both find it absolutely hilarious to a certain extent as it’s me who speaks with an RP accent, was privately educated and won academic awards at university; my colleague is from a working class background, speaks with a twang of the local (broad Yorkshire) accent, and attended a local catholic school, so it’s absolutely nothing to do with our backgrounds!

Disclaimer: I have RTFT but possibly skim read a bit as there was a lot of it!

YANBU to resent this suggestion as your style sounds perfectly sensible, and I can relate to you liking to dress that way. (I am currently very happy that I have changed jobs to a place where I can dress up a bit if I like, whereas in my old job I needed to be relentlessly practical as I quite often ended up crawling about on the floor or getting covered in mud/paint/people's dinner. I've chosen to make a slightly retro/vintage feminine look my signature look at my new job - longish dresses, Mary Janes and, yes, sometimes cardigans! - and nobody seems to mind.) But if someone who is senior to you has requested it, I think you might just have to accept it and change your work look slightly if you don't want to be perceived as deliberately uncooperative. I like the suggestion of asking your immediate boss what they think - you may find that they back you up. (But I wouldn't mention the women with visible tights tops as a justification for doing what you do .)

I would probably feel differently if they were asking you to wear something physically uncomfortable (high heels if you don't like them) or semi-permanently change your appearance (dye or straighten/curl your hair). But I can't get all that excited about being asked to dress just slightly less formally.

Genderfree. Yes. I'm a size 18 and five foot six. Those shops do not cater for "overweight" ladies. I know from experience.