to dislike Extinction Rebellion

[Azeema]

I live in farming village. We are getting in harvest.
But today on village green extinction rebellion has decided to have a party with drums, loud music and a megaphone. Green is right opposite care home for elderly.
I asked them, who are you protesting? There are no corporations here. Everyone is aware of environment as we grow your food.
They have been very rude, refusing to turn down noise despite disabled residents with migraines suffering.
They made me very upset talking about how England could grow own food and have lower footprint if not so many people (I’m an immigrant) looking at me like I should leave country.

In their defence, one of XRs key demands is the creation of Citizen's Assemblies, which - in theory - would give a voice to groups / individuals representing different communities and places in the process of deciding how to address climate change.

I guess I wonder what would happen if these Assemblies demonstrate that the radical actions needed (like the possible ones I suggested above) are not acceptable to wider society and that the majority of people really aren't willing or able to sacrifice money or lifestyle to address climate change. Where do we go then?

I guess I wonder what would happen if these Assemblies demonstrate that the radical actions needed (like the possible ones I suggested above) are not acceptable to wider society and that the majority of people really aren't willing or able to sacrifice money or lifestyle to address climate change. Where do we go then?

Like all good authoritarians, they will propose to “dissolve the People, and elect another”!

In their defence, one of XRs key demands is the creation of Citizen's Assemblies, which - in theory - would give a voice to groups / individuals representing different communities and places ...

Actually, we already have a system which allows exactly that - it's called democracy

Trouble is, it involves public ballots and the ghastly possibility that voters might not want whoever the latest blowhole happens to be

... and our parliamentary system is basically a popularity contest held every 4-5 years. No aspiring MP is going to put forward a manifesto that proposes raising taxes, restricting development, anything that would radically restrict individual choices... they’d never get voted in. Whereas a CA doesn’t need to be elected, and can directly represent different views to parliament, and can look way beyond the next election.

All that's perfectly true Wally, and I agree about the "popularity contest" thing, but that's the public will within a democracy for you

Granted there are exceptions, but broadly speaking, if the public can't be persuaded to get behind something then it probably won't happen. Citizens' Assemblies could use their unelected positions to rant and demand, but they wouldn't be in a position to actually DO anything - especially if they became infested by the noisier, more mindless type of protester

Given that the electorate have voted for Brexit, Trump etc id say we have zero chance....our fault though for prioritising money over all.

Jilly "they haven't read around the subject"
Helen "they don't understand the cycle of poverty"
Who are you talking about? XR is founded by people who have made it their business to know and understand, whose backgrounds are as academics, scholars and activists in related fields. XR is widely supported by climate scientists; the demands are not based on some kind of 'fringe' niche of debatable information: most scientists now say climate breakdown is imminent, and that it is happening as a result of global heating. Which in turn is occurring at an unprecedented rate on account of human activity. Fact. What to do about it? All XR is asking for is: (unparaphrased from manifesto)

1. Government must tell the truth by declaring aclimate and ecological emergency
2. Government must act now to halt biodiversity lossand reduce greenhouse gas emissions to net-zero by 2025.
3. Government must create, and be led by the decisions of, a citizens' assembly on climate and ecological justice.

Straight up, that's it. #1 has already happened. XR are not about prescribing set solutions, or imposing restrictions on individuals, it is about creating the political and social space in which the climate emergency becomes a real political agenda, so due democratic process can take place through a Citizens' Assembly. Some PPs are ascribing all sorts of claims to XR which really have nothing to do with the three demands it's almost as if they're making it up.

Oh dear Im really going to have to explain the cycle of poverty? WOW

Ok i will start simple .....................Quite a while ago there was a Dispatches programme about fast fashion. While watching it i clicked on the # hashtag. FULL of middle class people berating working class women (misogyny AND classism) for shopping at places like New Look and Primark.

Working class women who work in supermarkets and care homes and are on UC (which is NOT only an out of work benefit) and/or women on a low income being berated ridiculed and guilt tripped for not shopping at fucking People Tree or Karen Millen.

People in this situation cant afford to shop ethically. Are victimised for not doing so . I wonder what the reaction would be if a woman had to go to a food bank because she had shopped ethically that week and couldnt afford food.

Where would XR be if something like this got into the press. You wouldnt see their backsides for dust.

I STILL havent had an answer to the question about schools changing their school uniform every five minutes which leads to clothing waste.

Working class women having to shop for clothes cheaply keeps fast fashion going so the factories keep producing it then working class women having to buy it because they cant afford to shop ethically and round and round we go The cycle of poverty.

Im bloody sick of poorer individuals especially women being targeted over this.

Its beginning to look a lot like the targeting of individual groups of people for their cause rather than corporations

And as i have had to explain the cycle of poverty to you i sincerely hope you havent had a university education.

Cos it doesnt say much for it if you have.

YANBU at all.

Its beginning to look a lot like the targeting of individual groups of people for their cause rather than corporations

I think it's both sad and incredibly telling that you've had to do that Helen. Explain the basics of the cycle of poverty.

Although it was clear they didn't get it when they thought shutting down london and preventing poor people getting to work, and their NHS appointments - all whilst having booked holiday time ahead for themselves so as not to risk their own jobs was actually a virtue.

@CatherineOfAragonsPrayerBook Yes i agree. There seems to be an alarming increase in the amount of people who cant think critically these days.

I guess its a good thing that left winger/"liberals"/control freaks now busy themselves with stuff like this rather than supporting communism and organisations such as the KGB or Stasi.

If you think this is a harsh viewpoint, then see HelenaDove's wise words above.

I also say this as someone who lives their life as environmentally friendly as possibly, and probably more so than the average XR supporter.

1. Government must tell the truth by declaring aclimate and ecological emergency
So if the government declares a "climate emergency", what does that achieve? What does it change?
2. Government must act now to halt biodiversity lossand reduce greenhouse gas emissions to net-zero by 2025.
And just how are XR proposing they achieve that? It's six years away.
3. Government must create, and be led by the decisions of, a citizens' assembly on climate and ecological justice.
We have that. It's called "parliament".

So if the government declares a "climate emergency", what does that achieve?

Maybe it helps the doom-mongers to feel better, suggesting that their last protest was "right" and that other enjoyable days out should follow?

As for "2025 targets", let's look on the bright side; when they're missed, that'll be a chance for a few more jollies summits to decide the next ones, complete with all those lovely expenses. Plus, of course, the handy excuse for creating a few more taxes which can be diverted to other vanity projects when no-one's looking

And in case it's of some passing interest, here's the link I posted elsewhere to countless other, mostly inaccurate warnings of doom we've already heard from experts over the years: www.climatedepot.com/2015/11/06/every-un-climate-summit-hailed-as-last-chance-to-stop-global-warming-before-its-too-late/

Government must act now to halt biodiversity lossand reduce greenhouse gas emissions to net-zero by 2025.
And just how are XR proposing they achieve that? It's six years away.

XR never has to work out how to do something. They just demand stuff and someone else is supposed to do the details. They’re absolute children.

As for the government being led by the citizens assembly of blue-haired social justice warriors, or whatever it is. Are you fucking kidding? It sounds like something Stalin would have been proud of.

It’s all about increasing state control over individuals. Grim.

I guess its a good thing that left winger/"liberals"/control freaks now busy themselves with stuff like this rather than supporting communism and organisations such as the KGB or Stasi

This!! Useful idiots. Well put @QualCheckBot

I think what xr are doing is great. We have been talking about climate change for decades. They were telling me we had do move away from fossil fuels and invest in renewable energy at my primary school. (This was a long time ago).
I'm now a mum and worried for my son a what sort of a future he will have to face because of our inaction.

XR are not claiming to all be saints. We are all part of a system which has lead to this crisis. By declaring a state of emergency this will bring climate change issues to the fore front. When government are deciding on whether to build the next runway or to use this money for renewable energy infrastructure instead say, or more local public transport so people will need to use their cars less often. The impact on climate change will be taken into account.

This is not up to us as individuals rich or poor. We cant make the change needed on our own. We need government to change policies and legistate a new way forward.

Well I think they’re fab! Love them or hate them, everyone is talking about them and they’ve certainly done a great job of raising awareness. Good for them, I say.

They are crusty, vegan wankers.

They are selfish tossers achieving nothing in the bigger picture. I hope it pisses down with rain and freezes.

The idea is correct, however they are alienating people whose support they need. Climate change etc is being caused by too many humans and destruction of the environment.

They should be targeting places like India, China, etc with massive human populations, building more and more cities and coal fired power stations, Brazil, Indonesia destroying rain forests.

Not screaming at people in small villages

They are crusty, vegan wankers
Agreed.
They’re also taking up massive amounts of police time, time that could be better spent elsewhere.

I can see I'm not going to change your opinion on xr Ringdonna.
You do not have to like xr as individuals but as a group what the stand for is admirable.

They are doing this for us all, including you.
They do not want to be camping out in a London park in the October rain or locked up in a cell.

People have busy lives and for lots of us life is a struggle to get by we can't drop everything and go down there but we can give them our support.

I think history will look back on them with fondness and admiration ....and ask why the rest of us did not go out and support them?, when we could have made a difference, before it was too late.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7564955/Scantily-clad-Extinction-Rebellion-protesters-bare-streets-Melbourne.html?ito=australia-news-newsletter&utm_source=cvdb&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Australia_News_Newsletter%202019-10-12

Mardi gras or a protest?
Yeah they got attention but do you actually think it was attention for the message or the tits and ass on display?