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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that No Deal Brexit is the only option now

493 replies

Bearbehind · 25/08/2019 09:21

I’m a staunch Remainer, I think Brexit is absolute madness but I can’t see any way out of this mess except No Deal now - the division is too great and views are too entrenched

Leavers insist it will all be fine so the
only option is to do it and see what happens

The way I see it, anything less will just lead to the uprise of the Brexit Party until we ‘leave properly’ anyway.

We might as well just jump of the cliff now. If it’s all rosey then great.

If it’s not at least we can start to repair the damage sooner rather than later

OP posts:
chomalungma · 25/08/2019 16:45

id Johnson's team vote for or against the deal on the table

I think it depends which vote you look at. There were 3.

If you read Hansard, you'll see lots of contradictory speeches from politicians about the deal.

Kplpandd · 25/08/2019 16:48

@lightsinotherpeopleshouses I dont believe there will be an issue. If I did I would feel differently. Of course I care, it's not very nice to assume I am uncaring. OR perhaps you are one of those who accuses everyone with a different opinion to yours of being horrible?

Original poster
Bearbehind · 25/08/2019 16:49

The EU were never going to give the UK a good deal.

The EU could only ever give us the best deal possible based on our red lines

The fact TM ruled out any other option with what she decided were the red lines is not the EUs fault

OP posts:
Havanananana · 25/08/2019 16:55

The EU were never going to give the UK a good deal. Although the politicians selected to handle the deal were never up to the job.

Correct - the EU is never going to give a country that leaves the Union a better deal than they enjoyed while they were a member, and nor can the UK have a better deal than any member enjoys.

But we're getting ahead of ourselves here.

A 'No Deal' Brexit means leaving without a Withdrawal Agreement.

There is no 'Deal' or even any discussion about a deal until three items have been clarified in a Withdrawal Agreement:

  1. The rights of EU citizens in the UK - which was going fairly well until Patel showed up and the Home Office seemingly started to randomly select who can have settled status and who cannot;
  2. The payment of the outstanding commitments - which Johnson is now saying he won't be paying;
  3. The resolution of the Ireland/UK border - which is still stuck in stalemate with Parliament rejecting the UK's own proposal.

Note that Johnson has changed the point of attack - today he's talking about the money rather than about the Backstop.

Havanananana · 25/08/2019 17:06

I dont believe there will be an issue [with medicines] If I did I would feel differently. Of course I care, it's not very nice to assume I am uncaring. OR perhaps you are one of those who accuses everyone with a different opinion to yours of being horrible?

Your opinion is of course your own, but what evidence do you have that there will be no issue with medicines after a 'No Deal' Brexit? 90% of the medicines used in the UK come from the EU, as does a large percentage of medical equipment, isotopes for cancer treatment etc. Any disruption at the ports will have an impact on these supplies. Severe disruption and 5-day/50km queue at the border will have a severe impact.

MoreProseccoNow · 25/08/2019 17:14

I find the idea of a no deal Brexit horrific. I've signed the petition mentioned earlier in the thread - but there are only 8K signatures on it - there doesn't seem to be a hope in hell here.....

Original poster
Bearbehind · 25/08/2019 17:15

I dont believe there will be an issue [with medicines] If I did I would feel differently.

As hava said, what makes you believe it will be fine

We don’t produce this stuff so what makes you think supply won’t be disrupted?

OP posts:
Original poster
Bearbehind · 25/08/2019 17:34

moreprosecconow I suspect your username is actually the answer!

As this thread has demonstrated, there’s still way too many of the ‘they need us more than we need them’ brigade for this to end well.

We need to no deal now and start to repair the damage

OP posts:
PostNotInHaste · 25/08/2019 17:36

‘I dont believe there will be an issue [with medicines] If I did I would feel differently. Of course I care, it's not very nice to assume I am uncaring. OR perhaps you are one of those who accuses everyone with a different opinion to yours of being horrible?’

Can you 100% guarantee that you are right ? Because if you can’t you are basically prepared to gamble the lives of both my DH and the DH of another poster on this thread. Matt Hancock said he couldn’t guarantee no one would die.

Kplpandd · 25/08/2019 18:04

@Havanananana thank you for not jumping down my throat. My cousin is a director at BD and they have worked hard to ensure that at a 'Worst case scenario' (which to them is a no deal brexit) there will be no disruption to medical supplies. They currently believe (they do regular assessments on this) the likelihood of any disruption is almost nil.

I know for a fact that people will jump on me here and I've already been accused of not caring about people, others may accuse me of lying.

It's a shame when you cant put your opinion about Brexit without being attacked on a personal level.

I cant guarantee anything 100% nobody can. But I have more trust in BD and other pharmaceutical companies than I do in scaremongering newspaper stories.

I do not wish anybodies DH harm thanks for that though and by the way it's not me gambling, I voted remain.

PostNotInHaste · 25/08/2019 18:09

Sorry, you’re right. It’s just sitting at the sharp end is somewhat at looking down the barrel of a gun. It’s very bloody stressful. Even though logically you know it’s unlikely, reading leaking documents from Operation Yellowhammer where is says they can not guarantee no interruption eats away a bit. If it were my blood pressure pills I wouldn’t worry so much.

Kplpandd · 25/08/2019 18:16

@postnotinhaste I often interrogate my cousin about this. Not his fault he just works for them, but what I do 100% know is that these pharmaceutical companies do not allow anything to disrupt their profit making.

PostNotInHaste · 25/08/2019 18:23

Actually , that is a helpful way of looking at it. Thank you.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 26/08/2019 07:17

Well, if the press reports are to be believed, Boris the great saviour said nothing of any interest to Tusk, and didn’t even mention the £39bn

I am convinced he’s going to avoid no deal this time, which is good in the short term, but then what?

OP posts:
worlybear · 26/08/2019 08:09

No deal Brexit= we're fucked.😨

PooWillyBumBum · 26/08/2019 08:20

I kind of agree with you, but perhaps because I’m just fatigued by all the uncertainty. My Irish passport came through this week and DH works for a French bank with offices everywhere so I kind of just want to see - quickly - if the UK is going to sink or swim so we can make our plans accordingly. We didn’t vote for this madness and I think Dublin will do quite well out of it all (my husband has helped various UK institutions transfer over operations already) so I’m quite happy leaving.

My poor in laws, who are on the brink of retiring, are replanting their vegetable garden to accommodate things likely to skyrocket in price.

I really feel for those worried about their medication. That’s awful and just so unfair.

Songsofexperience · 26/08/2019 08:55

I am convinced he’s going to avoid no deal this time, which is good in the short term, but then what?

It buys us more time. More time for Labour to get rid of Corbyn for example and that would definitely remove a stumbling bloc in the way of effective opposition.

bear we do not need to no deal under any circumstances! I am convinced that some of the damage will be irreparable if we do. It's irresponsible. Resistance is never futile. If you believe that, you are no better than the other side I'm afraid.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 26/08/2019 09:09

we do not need to no deal under any circumstances

3 years ago I agreed with you, now I think it’s where we will end up anyway so we might as well get on with it and start to repair the damage sooner rather than later

OP posts:
OhYouBadBadKitten · 26/08/2019 09:41

Ok, so following your plan we end up with No Deal. What happens then? Exactly how would we come back from that?

PostNotInHaste · 26/08/2019 09:43

If we have No Deal and it is as predicted you then have a divided nation where one half will see it as the other half having inflicted it on them. How do we come back from that ? It’s bad enough at the moment.

PostNotInHaste · 26/08/2019 09:47

And the narrative will be if Remainers hadn’t of been so obstructive we wouldn’t be in the situation or the situation would have been different so the division will get even bigger as positions become further and further entrenched.

Easy side will see the facts to suit their view point.

PostNotInHaste · 26/08/2019 09:48

Each side, sorry,

noodlenosefraggle · 26/08/2019 09:54

I agree that I think no deal is the only way to go now. My dad is insulin dependent, so I'm hoping that it's true that medication has been prioritised. I suspect either there will be some minor cosmetic change to the WA and enough Labour MP's will support it to get it through or after a couple of weeks of food shortages, we hightail it back to the EU and sign the WA or go back to having a border in the Irish Sea, ignoring the DUP.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 26/08/2019 09:54

Exactly how would we come back from that?

By having proven it was a dreadful idea and taking immediate steps to address the issues

At the moment uncertainty is eroding the economy anyway - it’s like the boiling frog analogy

OP posts:
Leighhalfpennysthigh · 26/08/2019 10:23

Now Boris has put his foot down and is calling their bluff, I think the EU will change the deal and it’ll be rushed through

Yes, because the UK is far more big and powerful than a massive trading bloc.

The they need us more than we need them mentality is totally delusional and generally thought by the hard of thinking gammons who imagine another Empire. Because colonialism worked so well.

We are just a tiny, pathetic island off the coast of France. None of BJs posturing or leavers gleeful plans for trade deals with Trump is going to change that, especially with the strong pro-Irish community in the US.

But hey, why worry about that when the future contains chlorinated chickens and Trump Healthcare in the sunny uplands......