...to think that children should look after elderly parents?

[wheresmymojo]

It's not a TAAT but inspired by another thread.

It seems to be a general trend that people feel like they shouldn't have any duty/obligation to care for their elderly parents anymore.

Partly I recognise that this is because societal trends make it harder to do elder care than it used to be - it's quite common to have two full time workers, be living quite far from your parents, still have DC to care for at the same time due to later births, etc.

I find it odd though that anyone wouldn't want to care for their elderly parents and find a way to make it happen.

So for example, we have just moved to live near to DH's parents who are in their 70s as while they don't need any help now, we know they will at some point in the next 10yrs.

My DM is very young (56!) so definitely doesn't need any help. I live 200 miles away but have already had the discussion that when she is elderly I'd like her to come and live with us.

I feel like I'm in the minority though these days?

I realise there are of course exceptions - any parental abuse and there will always be people who have very complex situations that mean it isn't possible (e.g. can't afford to move, already have children of their own with special needs, etc).

But I think it's sad that the average person either (a) thinks of it as an obligation/burden that they don't want to do or (b) thinks they don't have any obligation at all.

My experience from ‘working in the system’ is that very often children are concerned about their elderly parents and want to make sure they receive the right help, even if they are abroad. Sometimes they are estranged obviously and you just know sometimes stuff has gone on which has made the relationship break down. But in general people want to help.

However that’s not the same as providing the care day to day. And it’s not a case of either help from family or a care home.

Unless the person is self funding their care, the level of care needs someone would need to become eligible for a care home place funded by social services (eg. Can’t be left alone, needs through the night), are not normally those that could be met by family. It’s not realistic for family to provide 24 hour care.

I have also had many a relative on the phone at breaking point because of the burden of caring for their parent or spouse, or even if they are not providing direct care - the stress of the situation.

And also the misplaced guilt because their elderly parent made them promise never to ‘put them in a home’ but it’s reached a point where that’s the only safe option. So sad really.
But in my experience people do care but are not in a position to provide All the care.

I think we’re going to need compulsory insurance from about 50 to pay for our care in old age. I don’t think it’s fair to expect the younger generation with university tuition fees and expensive housing to pay even more in income tax for people my age in the future.

So, what used to happen? I understand that we have an ageing population and more of us are living longer and advances in medicine mean we are existing with conditions that would have killed us decades ago.
But, dementia isn't a new thing. How did people cope previously?

YABU

Children do not/did not ask to be born. Most Parents made the choice to have children, so any sacrifices made to raise those children lay solely at the parents feet. No child should be expected to care for a parent especially on the whole ‘they spent 18+ years of their life raising me, I’ve got to repay them’ idea.

I chose to have my children and my responsibilities are to them not the other way around. I don’t want my children sacrificing ANYTHING to care for me when I’m ill. Not their time, jobs, family, holidays NOTHING. That’s not to say I don’t want them to abandon me, I would still like them to come see me, ring me, email, text whatever.

They may feel differently of course and that’s a bridge we will have to cross if it happens but even at 17 and 14 they know how I feel about it.

Abraid etc is expensive for the over 50s too. They dont all live in Surburbia

Not everyone in low paid work is a Generation Xer or a Millenial

So how would low paid workers pay this compulsory insurance a they cant afford it.

b. a lot in this age group are already taking time off to provide care.

Someone upthread said that 3 jobs were lost in the process.

Fact is Governments knew there was a baby boom and were happy to take advantage of this when it suited but dont want to know now the reckoning is to be paid This is very likely why they are talking about raising the retirement age to 75

• from the same think tank that came up with Universal Credit.

• housing etc is expensive for the over 50s too.

How did people cope previously?
It's true that dementia isn't a new thing but I think the incidence of it is rising..... no?

How did people cope previously?

It was less of an issue because people died.

Now people live so long that they are almost bound to have dementia for the last years of their lives. Previously when life expectancy was lower, there just weren't nearly as many sufferers around.

People with dementia would have died sooner in bygone times. We take such good care of them they live longer. If they'd wandered off there wouldn't have been GPS trackers to locate them. They would have come a cropper. They usually have additional health problems which are carefully medicated. If carers didn't observe changes and balance the medication by liaising with Drs then that would also speed things up.

maybe it will turn out that keeping the body alive for longer is the easy part .....the more difficult challenge being keeping the brain function in properly 😱

I think the Advance Directive is imperative in cases of families with a history of dementia/Alzheimers. You see it first hand you know how it's going to go. Unless there's some miraculous cure in the next 5 minutes.

I think in time we will get a better handle on the causes and will come up with some ways of improving the prognosis so I think there is limited hope

Antibiotics are a pretty recent invention. Pneumonia killed a lot of elderly people - still does these days when it is agreed not to treat it. But generally if you are at the stage where you and elderly and can't be at all active then a chest infection is easy to catch, and without antibiotics often becomes pneumonia.

Ah yes,
old man's 'friend'

It's true that dementia isn't a new thing but I think the incidence of it is rising..... no?

No doubt - but then folk are being kept alive for so long now that inevitably the overall number of seniors has increased and so have the diseases of old age

And sadly, unless they have an Advance Directive, pneumonia isn't always the "old person's friend" any more. My own FIL had it at 95, when clearly in the last weeks of his life, and we were told they had to treat it because it's classed as something that one can recover from

@Puzzledandpissedoff - that's awful. Did your FIL have an LPA? Was the family allowed any say in the decision to give antibiotics?
This is going to come up shortly with my mum, but they (NHS, not a care home) have implied that my sibling and I have some say over whether antibiotics are given. I've asked for the palliative care team to be involved.

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/lifeexpectancies/articles/howhaslifeexpectancychangedovertime/2015-09-09
Life expectancy

It's the medical care which is keeping people alive - inserting stents to improve heart conditions. Antibiotics for pneumonia which many older people might have died of in the past.
Dr Dale Bredesen claims to have found a way of slowing the onset of Alzheimers. It is diet change and exercise, checking hormone levels, vitamin levels etc, you can google this, but no one is interested in this method as it is not as profitable as developing something pharmacological. And it is a pretty strict regime to follow.

My mother has vascular dementia, which started with a stroke not long after my father died. I often think that nature really intended the stroke to be the end, and in many respects medicine hasn't done her any favours as certainly she's been utterly miserable ever since.

t's the medical care which is keeping people alive - inserting stents to improve heart conditions. Antibiotics for pneumonia which many older people might have died of in the past.

My grandfather, a Director of Public Health said three things contributed to improved life expectancy:

1. Clean water and a proper sewer system
2. Vaccinations
3. Antibiotics

With those in place, the main things left to kill us were the three Cs - cancer, strokes and heart attacks!

In societies, where life expectancy was 35, dementia was not a big problem.

I feel like Purplespup. I don't want my children running around me when they should be living their own lives.

Tbh, i hope that by the time it becomes relevant for me, there is an easy, safe, legal way to freely determine the end point of my life.

And I don't expect to retire as such. Dh and I are fortunate in that we have jobs we can theoretically continue doing as long as we have the mental capacity to.

Sorry for serial posts - I had my children selfishly. I wanted them, I enjoy them. I'm not performing some terrible drudge service that then needs to weigh on them for the rest of their lives. The extent of their duty is to be reasonably pleasant and helpful while they are under my roof. And otherwise to be productive and positive members of society in accordance with their capacity.

Means-tested, so poor pay less or zero.

The extent of their duty is to be reasonably pleasant and helpful while they are under my roof. And otherwise to be productive and positive members of society in accordance with their capacity
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