UK lost measles free status

[Stressedout10]

So due to all the anti Vaxers the WHO have stripped us of our measles free status.
What next ?

@herculepoirot2 you are a twat!

@WhatNoNotYouAgain she is never going to get it, you can’t argue with stupid sadly.

@herculepoirot2 you are a twat!

😂

Seriously MumWhoKnocks, that's your contribution to this discussion?
Thinking that bodily autonomy is worth protecting or that a parent has more right than the state to decide how a child is raised/looked after, does not make someone a twat.

You see?

Do pack in patronising, herculepoirot, it simply looks like a deliberate attempt to goad. Likewise the accusations of stupidity you keep slinging around.

Prove it. I don’t think they do. I think restrictions on freedom of movement would have to be court ordered in individual circumstances or a result of an emergency in which the Government took on temporary powers to deal with an emergency.

Exactly. They do have those powers. You claimed that they do not have such powers at all.

The question is whether it should continue to be your right, particularly when the risk is not just to other children but to your own child

If we are going to continue to be compliant with basic medical ethics and the HRA, yes.

As other countries have demonstrated, it is perfectly possible to take steps to maximise uptake of vaccines without infringing the HRA or medical ethics. France and Italy, for instance, have passed laws making vaccination mandatory and are signatories to the ECHR, and the European Court has ruled that this degree of interference with private life is permissible when there are public health considerations.

People aren’t suggesting that any and all chemicals should be kept out of their children’s bodies, are they?

Well, yes, that is precisely the argument that some anti-vaxxers make. That is the level of ignorance about basic scientific facts that they regularly demonstrate.

Exactly. They do have those powers. You claimed that they do not have such powers at all.

That is not correct. We are discussing vaccinations. I am talking about vaccinations. Taking the terms of what I am saying and flinging them into the middle of an Ebola epidemic might make you technically correct, but it has no impact on what I am actually saying: under our current laws, the Government cannot force you to accept a vaccination for your child, or disadvantage that child in the school system.

As other countries have demonstrated, it is perfectly possible to take steps to maximise uptake of vaccines without infringing the HRA or medical ethics.

I don’t believe this to be the case.

the European Court has ruled that this degree of interference with private life is permissible when there are public health considerations.

I am not going to contradict this, but can you post a link to the judgement?

Well, yes, that is precisely the argument that some anti-vaxxers make. That is the level of ignorance about basic scientific facts that they regularly demonstrate.

If you say so. Nobody here is saying that, but I have been accused several times of saying it by people demonstrating a similar level of ignorance about reading my posts.

Any parent that doesn't get their child vaccinated is a fuckwit.

If vaccinations are so safe - why are there some people who can't have them?
(hiding behind the sofa now)

@monstiebags
I view it as the same as anything. Bread is safe but some cannot have it. Pollen is safe but some cannot tolerate it. Penicillin is safe but some are allergic. All of our bodies act differently to different stimuli and vaccines are no different.

*IAmTheMumWhoKnocks

@monstiebags
I view it as the same as anything. Bread is safe but some cannot have it. Pollen is safe but some cannot tolerate it. Penicillin is safe but some are allergic. All of our bodies act differently to different stimuli and vaccines are no different.*

And that is why vaccines should never be mandatory and compulsory.

Well my bold didn't work...

New Zealand is in the same boat. We've also lost our Measles Free Status, because it seems to be rampant this year. In fact, on Friday I got a text from my Doctor's Clinic saying that when I was there the day before I may have been exposed to measles. Luckily I finally seem to have built up an immunity to it. I am one of those people for whom the measles vaccine was less effective. I have been immunised multiple times (into my early 20's) and had measles multiple times (the last time in my 30's; each bout milder than the last). But I had my vaccines, and strongly believe in them. It's just that I (and my mother) have weird immune systems. But people are getting seriously ill. And measles has the potential to kill.

What's worse is that people don't realise the potential serious complications. When mum had measles in her early teens, her doctor was worried about potential damage to her eyes. Instead it was her hearing that was affected. She was almost completely deaf in her left ear, and had limited hearing in her right ear. Not vaccinating is Not Worth It.

There are rare unexpected reactions to vaccinations but usually it is understood who is going to struggle with them and how this should be managed.
academic.oup.com/cid/article/58/3/e44/336537
It isn't a void out there.

It's okay to say people should have a choice about whether or not to vaccinate ad lo g as they are prepared to pay for treatment and the sometimes resultant horrendous level of care needed for a measles victim.

domeyimes

If vaccinations are so safe - why are there some people who can't have them?
(hiding behind the sofa now)

Immune compromised, allergies, autoimmune conditions and I heard on this thread febrile seizures (not heard that one before) all make vaccinations more risky and complicated.

If vaccinations are so safe - why are there some people who can't have them?
(hiding behind the sofa now)

In the same way peanuts are safe.

We don't have some horrendous diseases like polio, small pox, TB BECAUSE of vaccinations
Interestingly, we do still have TB, and the BCG is one of the vaccinations with a lower effectiveness rate (according to Oxford University site, it's 70 - 80% effective against more severe forms). BCG availability on the NHS seems to depend on where you live and your at risk status - and I seem to remember the policies have changed over time in certain areas.

Interesting that the term 'measles free' doesn't mean that there are no cases of measles at all in a country. If one of the issues is 'parental complacency' we may need another term for that status I suppose - as it might suggest to the uninformed that a place is entirely free of measles (which of course could only be guaranteed if it had been eliminated globally).

Peanuts are generally safe. How many people would be okay with a law saying their child had to eat peanuts?

This is a tricky argument - some people can't have vaccines so everyone else has to take a risk (yes - a risk - read the small print - there is always a risk) with their own children to keep these others safe. It's a herd mentality that not everyone has - I always put my own children first I'm afraid - I didn't take the risk (balancing probablility of catching measles and having complications against not vaccinating) and when measles did start to spread towards my quiet little enclave - then I vaccinated because the balance of risk changed. Yes I am selfish but I had to do what I felt was right for my child having had a horrendous reaction to measles jab myself.

Actually up until the 90s we did have polio - it was caught from the poo of babies who had been vaccinated with live virus - about 14 cases between 95 and 99. I told my doctor that I was not happy with live virus for my baby and explained the reason - she was shocked - she was completely unaware that we were the only Western country still coaxing with live virus and that it was causing live virus to seep into the environment. she ordered deactivated vaccine from France for us - I believe that UK now uses this as a matter of course. Things like this do not help me to trust the medical profession to know best.

Now you mention this monstie I think I remember being told that you had to be ultra careful with hand washing after changing nappies after the polio vaccination! It is now no longer a live vaccine - the Oxford university site (very interesting generally) says;

*Until 2004, the vaccine used in the UK was a live attenuated (weakened) oral polio vaccine (OPV). In a small number of cases this vaccine actually caused polio itself (30 cases in UK between 1985 and 2002). Although the disease had been eradicated in the UK, it remained endemic in many countries, so there was a risk it could be reintroduced to the UK through travel and immigration.

By 2004, vaccination had eradicated polio from all but a few countries worldwide, and the UK was able to switch over to the inactivated (killed) polio vaccine, which does not contain any live viruses and cannot cause the disease itself.*

It really is the 2 minute hate, isn't it?

Reports today of homeless children sleeping in storage containers, NHS is being gradually sold off to greedy speculators, Brexit, Austerity, Food banks, etc. etc. and what has got people shrieking like banshees at mothers?

A status we only achieved 3 years ago, that's what. Exactly what does that status give us? Um...

There's a damn sight more than this status that we've lost in the past 10 years or so that should have people howling with rage.

I wonder what they'll next use to wind us up and distract us from what's really going on?

Total nonsense. If I get behind the wheel of a car drunk and hit you and you die, I killed you. If I am unvaccinated and you catch measles from me, measles killed you. Diseases are a reality of the natural world. It isn’t my responsibility to pump myself full of drugs I don’t want in order to prevent you contracting them.

Not strictly true, you can be prosecuted for passing on a disease deliberately. There was a reason for leper colonies. There was a reason, 'Typhoid Mary' was quarantined for life.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/18/hairdresser-daryll-rowe-given-life-sentence-for-deliberately-infecting-men-with-hiv

Not strictly true, you can be prosecuted for passing on a disease deliberately.

Do you understand what ‘deliberately’ means?