To think that there is a worrying rise of The Pushy Parent?

[ShutTheDough]

I visited my friend last week who has moved to Cambridge and happened to meet some of her friends. My friend is very down to earth and I would say has a very relaxed style of parenting. I was quite surprised about how much they invested in their children. Not saying that's a bad thing obviously but it all seemed like alot of pressure on the children. One of them already had the careers set out for their DC.
It just seemed all a bit intense tbh.

"Whatever we may think of capitalism that’s the system we are stuck with so a pragmatic parent will surely do all they can to help their child succeed in the system we have."

There are not enough facepalms in the world for this post.

It’s also a cultural values thing. My culture is quite materialistic in some ways (not that I agree with it), but also does value loyalty, family values... though probably not leisure time etc.

People whose families have experienced poverty may also want to ‘push’ their child so they do not have to go through the same thing. Can be damaging at the extremes, but can also be helpful. Fortunately in this country there are at least some social security mechanisms which though often inadequate are not present in some places.

Why? Surely it’s obvious you encourage your child to earn decently along with all the other good stuff? The holy grail is a decent income doing a worthwhile job you enjoy. Do you advocate railing against capitalism and not working?

Someone on our local parenting Facebook group asked about maths and phonics tutoring to help "prepare" their 4yo for reception .

It restored my faith in humanity that every single reply was basically a version of "WTF are you thinking, just let them play!"

And wow, HostofDaffodils - what an insightful post. I couldn't agree more, and see myself firmly in group 2.

@BumblebeeBum

“Can I ask - those that work and their kids do activities - how?”

With a hell of a lot of scheduling and manoeuvres in our case. DD does martial arts, swimming, girlguiding and extra languages. We handle the languages at home, swimming is weekends, GG is fairly late so I can manage that after work, and the sport is now on a weekday evening so DH has had to rearrange his day to get her there.

She has two instruments (lessons at school).

Shortly she’s going to try a new team sport plus go to two school clubs.

I try to follow her interests (except for swimming which I view as mandatory and she’s only doing for another two stages so she has good technique and stamina - the girl will never be a competitive swimmer). I’ll pay for lifeguard/rescues training though.

For the future, I can see the current martial art being dropped in favour of another she wants to try, which is fine.

Then we’ll need to start adding in her sibling’s clubs and activities...

We had a boggling conversation at our nct with our first baby. American dad turned to dh and said “right we want our daughter to go to oxford or Cambridge please tell me how to achieve that - working back”. The babies were 6 months

Hmm I was pushed abit hard on the music lesson front so careful not to replicate that. One dd plays but she enjoys it and practices without nagging the other didn’t so we binned it. Each have a sport they enjoy.
The thing I really value is imaginative play and I will do a lot to facilitate that. You can play tennis your whole adult life but you can only play spies with your friends for a few short years. I find it very sad that one friend of dds is so over scheduled she has no time for playing with her friends. She rarely smiles either.

Don't we secretly all think that we alone have achieved the right balance? Where we strike that balance depends on our resources, background, where we live and other factors, but also our personalities. Where the parent's personality is similar to the child's (whether that's "Let's do loads!" or "Let's take it easy"), it works well. It becomes more problematic where the parent and child are different in this regard.

I've signed dd up for loads of things at various stages. I'm the type of person who is always up for a nice educational trip to the museum. Dd(11) has been very clear that she wants time just to potter. She's now down to one organised activity (drama/dance/singing) and occasional other ones (such as a cooking class). I've tried to respect who she is, as well as who she could be.

@HostofDaffodils......an interesting philosophy and read. Don't consider emigrating to Australia anytime soon though....applicants are graded with points based on their 'contribution' and I can't see your second group philosophy working with this. I also think it's ridiculously pigeon holing and binary.....fact is many parents are or try to be an awkward blend of groups 1 and 2.
I take a slightly more 'cosmic' view of the world. We are all minuscule organisms overcrowding a fragile world. To survive for as long as our humanity alllows us, we all have to pull our weight in a purposeful way - whether it be caring for children, sick people, working in a factory or whatever. It's up to the previous generation to use what ever means possible to kick their offspring up the arse, so the world keeps turning just a little bit longer!

As the grandchild of refugees who got in this country by virtue of a specific specialised skill which my grandmother had, I'm not blind to the usefulness of qualifications. (Qualifications saved my grandparents from being gassed, you might say.)

I was thinking after I posted that my tendency towards 2 is very much informed by a religious upbringing. That as part of Creation we are intrinsically of worth.

Whereas I suppose with option 1 a lot of it all hangs on evaluating the worth of the raw material and then maximising the value can be added.

I remember my father, who was very much an option 1 person, ringing me when I was pregnant in my late thirties and making a great point of telling me that he'd have absolutely no problem about my aborting if there was a positive test for Down's syndrome....

...@Host ....bloody hell, parents!....that's cruelly Darwinian, I get where you're coming from more now.

As the partner of someone with a disability that’s tough to read Host.

HostofDaffodils

How odd that he thought you’d need his blessing/unsolicited input into such a decision.

One person's happy balance is another's pushy parenting. We pack DC off to galleries and theatre shows and read to them every night because we love the arts. They've grown to love them too. But it does make them appear uncommonly knowledgable among their peer group and probably looks like pushy parenting when they know from a line of music or poetry who wrote it. (As if anyone cares! )

I remember posts here years ago foaming at the mouth that I was 'pushing' my DC towards 11+ when they should be out playing by having them tutored for an hour a week, with an hour's homework. I don't think 2 hours a week is stressful and nor did DC. They thrived at their academically selective school as a result of that very gentle nudge. I'm not naturally pushy but the few times I've stood my ground and said, Do this. It will help you,' despite DC's protests, they have always come out loving what they do. I wish I were pushier. That said DS1 who has always played an instrument out of love and never been cajoled to practise, tells me he has friends who reached grade eight and dumped their instrument. They'd got there through parental pressure alone and had no love for the music. DS said you could tell that by the mechanical way they played. He stopped bothering with grades but plays with real passion.

That was interesting Host. I think I’m in 2 with an element of 1 and agree with the pp who said we’re all a blend of both with some being the extremes at either end.

It’s interesting as I think parenting is ever changing. As you enter the teen years and come towards the end of the rearing phase I wonder if you go more towards 2. Wonder if it’s me ageing or seeing how important it is as regards my children nearing adulthood but I’m taking ever less from 1 and embracing 2 more.

I'm a mixture of both

Thanks host for your insightful posts and I understand perfectly about the valuable skills point you make.

They thrived at their academically selective school as a result of that very gentle nudge. I'm not naturally pushy but the few times I've stood my ground and said, Do this. It will help you,' despite DC's protests, they have always come out loving what they do

Similar experience here. My DD at 14 was horrendously depressed at her school - unchallenged, bored, resentful. Several teachers suggested that she should apply to a magnet high school for kids just like her, and she decided she did want to go, but she just kept on not getting around to writing the application form. She just didn't quite have the confidence to do it.

At that point I did push her, because she was sabotaging herself and her chance of happiness. She did fill in the form, she did go to the school, and she absolutely loved it.

As the grandchild of refugees who got in this country by virtue of a specific specialised skill which my grandmother had, I'm not blind to the usefulness of qualifications. (Qualifications saved my grandparents from being gassed, you might say.)

Interesting - DH's dad, who was the ultimate pushy parent, was also a refugee who was saved from concentration camp because of the skills his father had.

Some parents are too pushy, but if you have to err one side or the other, i think it’s usually better to be a bit pushy than to be uninterested in your kids like some parents are.

This.

@bibliomania you sound like a lovely parent. Good point about the child's and parents' personalities matching (or not). I'm good friends with a family who seem to be scheduled up to the eyeballs with activities. It's my idea of hell, but they seem very happy.
Think what OP was getting at was the pressure to raise exceptional humans who excel at everything and don't waste their time at just having fun with friends, leading an unstructured existence. Oh, the horror!

I am frankly worried for future generations by all this structured after school stuff. I do get that it is a competitive world out there but all this seems to increase the inequality further between the haves and have nots. I didn't do anything after school apart from play independently (80s) and there is so much to show that free unstructured play builds creativity, resilience, imagination. It's sad that it's not seen as beneficial as all these clubs.

Is it hurting you? If not it's not really your business. Sorry op.

I don't see anything wrong with parents having ambitions for their children or helping them get a good start.

Those that go over the top are annoying but that's their problem lol.

Jemima232

@ShutTheDough

I don't think the responses you've had thus far are what you were looking for.

Although neither of your respondents can spell "extra-curricular".

My thoughts too. Oh - and unis does not have an apostrophe.

I can’t believe some kids do so many activities. I feel exhausted just reading it.
I reduced the number of extra curricular activities my children participated in because frankly, it was just too much.
I just made sure that they swim confidently, play at least one musical instrument and have Spanish lessons( dh is Spanish )
It’s actually good to be bored sometimes.