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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Was this rape?

148 replies

OoohMasala · 08/08/2019 23:53

Referring to my ex.

I was half asleep. He pushed up behind me. I said no I'm not in the mood. He still continued to put his penis half way inside me. I moved away. He did it again and said 'come on we can just have a quickie'. I pulled away and said no, I don't want to. He continued to pester. Put his hands in my pants and we ended up having sex. I just went along with it. For reference, he was emotionally abusive and I was scared of him.

Weirdly, I forgot about this incident and only just remembered it and it's making me feel a bit sick when I look back at it.

Rape seems too strong a word. But I only left him a few months ago, still not over the abuse and very confused...

OP posts:
Original poster
OoohMasala · 09/08/2019 07:26

I didn't consent though. Laying there completely still letting someone have sex with me after I've said no numerous times and tried to pull away, but continued eventually out of fear of the repercussions of saying no, is not consent

OP posts:
lovelookslikethis · 09/08/2019 07:29

Not only did you not consent, but you actively said no, yes it is rape unquestionably.

hormonesorDHbeingadick · 09/08/2019 07:29

I must be very naive as I’m shocked at the number of women on this thread who think this wasn’t rape. Rape is having sex with someone who hasn’t consented either because they don’t want to consent or they are unable. A women does not even need to say no to have been raped she just has not said yes or shown in other ways that she is consenting. Very clearly a women saying no means I don’t want to do this. If you are unsure look up the cup of tea rape consent videos and YouTube - they are not all graphic or upsetting.

OP I’m really sorry that this is happened to you. I think it would be beneficial for you to discuss this with a professional eg kind GP or DV worker or helpline. You don’t have to report it to the police if you don’t want to. Do what is best for you at this moment.

MollyButton · 09/08/2019 07:29

Rape Crisis is a good place to call.
And you can also always call the samaritans and they can listen and probably could give you your local Rape Crisis number.

You have a choice about whether to report this, but talking to someone like Rape Crisis will help you, and help you get your thoughts and feelings straight,.

herculepoirot2 · 09/08/2019 07:32

He sounds like a major creep. If you said no and he actually penetrated you, half way or not, he raped you. If he was pushy or pestering but you went along with it absent the threat of coercion, legally speaking, it’s not rape. It’s not enthusiastic consent but it is consent. I know that’s not a popular view on here but it’s the law.

Windygate · 09/08/2019 07:33

OhMasala sadly you were raped. I'm pleased you plan to ring Women's Aid, you need to talk to someone in RL who will believe you and support you.

The rape apologists on here make me so angry, so many women have been conditioned into thinking rape is sometimes acceptable and not really rape at.

Original poster
OoohMasala · 09/08/2019 07:35

Hercule the first time he penetrated me he didn't ask and I didn't know he was going to do it. The second time was after I had said no. I never said yes. I just stopped saying no and just lay there still.

OP posts:
Nodnol · 09/08/2019 07:36

It was rape. And I’m so sorry you went through that.

herculepoirot2 · 09/08/2019 07:37

No confusion about that, then. In UK law, it’s rape when a person vaginally penetrates someone with a penis with no reasonable belief in consent.

Writersblock2 · 09/08/2019 07:38

The concept of consent is easy: it’s when a person says yes.

OP said no.

Not bloody difficult, is it? FFS.

herculepoirot2 · 09/08/2019 07:39

The concept of consent is easy: it’s when a person says yes.

You can consent without saying yes and you can refuse without saying no. The legal test isn’t your consent; it is the other person’s reasonable belief in your consent.

InsertFunnyUsername · 09/08/2019 07:41

You are only questioning it because of the views ingrained on us on what "actual rape is" the same stupid views some are spouting on this thread.

"was it rape because I didn't exactly fight him off I only said no" ..."was it rape because I willingly had sex with him the night before"... "was it really rape because he didn't use violence"

People need to stop putting the blame back on the OP. To a normal man how OP acted towards his advances, would be enough for them to know she wasn't in the mood.

KUGA · 09/08/2019 07:50

Sadly you ended up having sex with him.
Albeit just going along with it.
He got what he wanted.
I don't think you could call it rape after that.
Had you kept saying NO and didn't have sex,then yes,it would have been rape.

Mummyoflittledragon · 09/08/2019 08:02

Hercule
He just got on with his business. He did not check consent. Op did not have a choice in her situation as that was taken away. Her reaction was just that, a reaction, where her body took over. When this happens, there is fight / flight / freeze / flop / friend. Op needs to talk to rape crisis, not listen to strangers on the internet.

If an unknown man came up to and tried to force himself on me, I said no and subsequently put up no fight and let him get on with it to protect myself, there would be no question that this was rape. I understand it is harder to prove rape under these circumstances but the situation would be identical but for the fact op was in a relationship with this abuser.

herculepoirot2 · 09/08/2019 08:05

Mummyoflittledragon

I am not sure why you are directing that explanation to me. The OP says he penetrated her before she knew he was going to do so, so obviously there was no consent.

Latersxx · 09/08/2019 08:09

I was in a very similar situation, years ago, when I was much younger. I was in my late teens / early twenties, he was my first “proper” boyfriend.. the first guy I ever had sex with.. we ended up living together at my parents house.

It took my years to come to terms with what happened in that relationship, and to label it for what it was .. it was abusive and controlling, and I now accept that what happened to me was rape.

He would do the same ... just push, and mither me until I let him do it. I was say “no” repeatedly, say I was tired, try to sleep.. but he would put his hands in my pants, or remove my clothes, and keep on telling me that “I was being unfair” and that ‘he had needs to”. He would go on and on, until I just gave up saying no. He was quite well endowed as well, so it could often end up being really painful.. I remember one time being face down on the carpet, and him being behind he, and just sobbing into the carpet because it was so painful. He never stopped though, regardless of how much pain I was in, or if I was crying, or asked him to stop (he was normally just say he would be quick).

He was controlling in other ways as well, telling my nobody else would want me - and all that usual baloney.

That was all 27 years ago, and it took ages to understand that what he did was rape. I think it awful that people think that what happened to OP wasn’t ... as he wasn’t a stranger, or she didn’t have a physical fight with him. I don’t think rape in relationships is understood, it forms part of an abusive pattern, along with the name calling, and the controlling.

jellycatspyjamas · 09/08/2019 08:11

What the actual fuck - how many times does a woman need to say “no” for it to mean “no”?

Had you kept saying no and didn’t have sex

What part of she didn’t have a choice not to have sex do you not understand.

For clarity:-

  • rape doesn’t require that a woman screams, struggles, fights, tries to run
  • rape doesn’t require that a woman is hit, punched, kicked or held down
  • rape doesn’t require that a man overtly threatens, bullies or shouts at a woman
  • someone who has been raped is not in any way to blame for her rape, nor does their not overtly fighting back mean it isn’t rape
  • it is not a woman’s job to stop herself being raped

Rape is sex without informed consent freely given. Just because the OPs experience was different to someone else’s experience of being raped doesn’t mean it wasn’t rape.

madcatladyforever · 09/08/2019 08:14

I'd definitelt mention it in court, If asked why you haven't mentioned it before just say you couldn't process it and tried to bury it as it was traumatic.

Outnotdown · 09/08/2019 08:20

I agree that it was clearly rape, and feel that people who think it can only be classified as rape if the woman physically fights throughout the assault are ...I'm struggling to find a word here. Those people are lacking, in empathy and in any kind of insight into how we behave when threatened.

Because op was under threat constantly in that relationship.

Good luck op. Know you're not alone.

NuggieThief · 09/08/2019 08:23

Yes it was rape

HattieRabbit · 09/08/2019 08:38

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MissB83 · 09/08/2019 08:39

I think it was rape. This has happened a couple of times to me. It is sex that you don't really want but in the moment you've gone along with, maybe because you don't want the other person getting even nastier. Yes, it's rape.

MissB83 · 09/08/2019 08:40

I should say you don't want AND THE OTHER PERSON KNOWS THAT. No excuse. No means no.

HattieRabbit · 09/08/2019 08:42

I don’t mean to ‘lack in empathy’ I do think that what happened to you was awful and not right. I think it should be very illegal and punished. I just don’t think it’s the same level that some women experience and that having a ‘blanket’ term of rape...actually takes away from the brutal experiences of some women!

It’s like manslaughter and murder- we need that kind of differentiation. Both terrible, both wrong. But also different experiences.

KM99 · 09/08/2019 08:43

OoohMasala I'm sorry this happened to you and the memory is resurfacing right now. I had something similar happen to me at 18 but I'd repressed it until a couple of years ago (I'm in my 40s now). At the time I was young, didn't really understand the nature of consent and just wanted to avoid any escalation to an argument. I said no a few times, I never said yes just laid still. I consider it rape now.

The thing is, with all due respect to every pp on here, you are going to get different viewpoints that may confuse you more.

What you do know for sure if you feel upset, violated and sick by it now. Talking to a professional may help you come to terms with it and find the label you need to put on it for your own sanity.

It sounds like he's taken so much from you, but you get to control what you want to do and say about this. Put yourself first and think about that you need to move forward.

Sending love, OP