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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

What is fair here? 🤷‍♀️

159 replies

Sundancer77 · 02/08/2019 12:26

I’m a teacher and occasionally babysit in the holidays for big jobs-weddings etc as it’s great money. Months ago, a parent of a child I used to teach contacted me and said the company she works for were looking for a babysitter for 8 hours for a group of 6 children with a provided room at a wedding. The hotel venue is almost an hour away and I’d be driving back past midnight (have a baby dd so am pretty exhausted these days!) so I was quite reluctant and only agreed due to the good pay (pay based on price per child, per hour.
The family transferred the deposit to me (half of the overall pay-€300) and I would receive the further €300 on the night, with extra pay for any extra children or if we ran over (which they said we likely would) so weighing it up, the travel/hassle etc was worth the pay.
Now..a couple of days ago, the Mum who works for the company contacted me and said there had been big family problems, many of the guests had, had to cancel and as a result they’d only been one child to babysit. Also as a result, she said to keep the deposit (well, I’d already spent it!) and on the night wouldn’t receive any pay as working out the deposit they’d already paid, for one child per hour, it’s a good amount and can cover my travel etc.
Aibu to feel pissed off? Obviously it can’t be helped if guests pull out (due to a family illness) but I wouldn’t have taken the job if I was only getting paid the fee of the deposit due to the long drive, late hours etc. I only agreed as the pay was worth it? So what happens now? What’s fair in this situation? Do I have to do it as they paid half the pay on a deposit? If I don’t want to do it (I don’t) do I pay the deposit back??

OP posts:
PrincessScarlett · 02/08/2019 18:58

This is a tricky one. As you have absolutely nothing in writing, no contract of t&cs, there's nothing stopping you keeping the 300 and not doing the job. However, I think that's a pretty shitty course of action seeing as you are still being paid very well.

Others mentioning if it were caterers or band they'd keep the deposit, I don't think its the same as they would have contracts and would specify deposit is non refundable.

Personally, I'd do the job for 300 and let it be a lesson for the future to have a proper agreement in place. Although I can't believe other mum was handing over so much money without something in writing either.

JollyGiraffe · 02/08/2019 19:00

Really hope this mum is on mumsnet Grin

WhoKnewBeefStew · 02/08/2019 19:19

For me it's a renegotiation. You quoted for 6 dc, your mum agreed, she's now changed it, which means it's a different amount. I'd still be tempted to say, I'll keep the deposit, but on the night it's £15 per hour (inc the travelling time, plus travelling expense of 0.45p per mile,

julensaor · 02/08/2019 22:08

@Rivkka has written a great message OP, I'd use it, it's fair.

Dieu · 03/08/2019 05:42

It seems a bit grabby when all you had planned to do was watch films with them. For that money, I'd expect my child to be playing board games etc, as well as watching TV.

thewayoftheplatypus · 03/08/2019 06:00

I agree with @dieu, that’s a huge amount of money to just shove some kids in front of the tv (let’s face it, something that most of their own parents will have done this summer for free!)

They aren’t cancelling the job. They are trying to renegotiate the numbers and therefore the fee. Enter into this renegotiation (as you don’t have a contract saying you won’t) but understand that you will have to accept a lower fee. The cost per child per hour plus all of your expenses on top seems fair to me. Take it as a hit and a lesson to get everything written down with any future clients- it’s basic business sense!

If you decide not to do the job, then they haven’t cancelled- you have. And then you should return the deposit.

WishingILivedOnAnIsland · 03/08/2019 07:37

Can I just point out to the people saying there is no contract- a contract can be verbal, a contract can be contained in an email, in a series of text messages etc. Just because she isn't running a formal business with a standard T & C form doesn't make the agreement any less binding.

If there are clear terms, agreement, consideration give (the €300) etc then there is a contract.

If OP reached agreement then she has a contract. She is entitled to be paid if she performs the service, or keep the deposit if they cancel.

If they called the €300 a deposit, then I'd say that the commonly understood meaning of that is that it is kept by the service provider if the customer cancels. She doesn't need to have spelt out that this is what a deposit is

elessar · 03/08/2019 07:53

To be honest I think you're being cheeky. You can't really have it both ways - you charged per child to get to €600 and you were going to charge extra for more children, you didn't charge it as a flat fee. So I think it's unreasonable to expect the same fee for only one child, particularly as you didn't state a minimum number of children that you'd be prepared to do the job for.

So if you cancel I think you should return the deposit.

Original poster
Sundancer77 · 03/08/2019 11:22

Ok, thanks all, lots of differing views here 👍Going close the thread now.

OP posts:
bernietaupinspen · 03/08/2019 11:31

Close the thread?

flowery · 03/08/2019 11:36

How does one close a thread?!

Original poster
Sundancer77 · 03/08/2019 11:54

🤷‍♀️🤣 Sorry, delete, in case the Mum is on here 🙈

OP posts:
IncrediblySadToo · 03/08/2019 12:03

Going close the thread now

Oh I thought you said you were a teacher, not that you worked for MN?!
😂😂😂

Personally, having done this work before, I think £300 to look after one child for 8 hours is a piss take (or I was a mug!!)

It’s changed from a group of kids needing to be looked after & entertained at a wedding venue (actually quite hard work, especially if the parents tell them they can come & go as they please 😳🙄) to baby sitting one child

But it’s not for her personally it’s for the company she works for and they should have covered their backs on this expenditure They’ve offered for you to keep the £300 for just one child and I think that’s more than reasonable. It’s not their fault you don’t have a clearly laid out contract for this situation.

I get you’re disappointed and not keen to do it now, but I think it would be a pretty poor bloody show if you didn’t do it

The one kid on its own will probably fall asleep anyway.

Just say to her that you are only happy to stay until midnight as it’s nit worth your while doing additional hours st £25, or you’ll stay longer but at £x rate

HiJenny35 · 03/08/2019 12:06

I wouldn't do the job but I would return the 300 it's your fault you've spent it. You aren't doing the job so should return the fee.

AllTheUserNamesAreTaken · 03/08/2019 12:41

It’s quite clear from what you’ve said that the amount you charged would vary depending how many children/how long you were working so it’s definitely NBU for the parents to ask for a reduction now there are less children

That being said, a bit like kids parties or similar, it is often X price for up to X kids and then an amount per child thereafter. So I would possibly say you will do it for £400

On a different point, I think you are taking the piss charging such amounts and then saying you planned a movie night Hmm

Someone mentioned respecting your teaching qualifications etc. Not sure how many of those it takes to switch a tv on

PurpleCrowbar · 03/08/2019 12:57

If there had been 3 or 4 kids on the night, would you expect to take a hit on the fee?

If not, then I don't see why you should because there is now only 1.

You worked out a rate for the job, & have been paid a deposit which guarantees your availability. That's yours to keep unless you cancel.

If they now don't want to pay the agreed sum, then in effect they are cancelling/breaking the agreement, so they forfeit the deposit.

I think if it was me, I'd be willing to negotiate - maybe split the difference & accept another £150 on the night. But if that's no good to them, I'd say that is their problem & they lose their deposit.

Howyiz · 03/08/2019 13:04

You mention the company, are you being hired by the wedding family or by the hotel or a babysitting service?

bernietaupinspen · 03/08/2019 13:07

If there had been 3 or 4 kids on the night, would you expect to take a hit on the fee?

If not, then I don't see why you should because there is now only 1.

It was per child per hour.

PurpleCrowbar · 03/08/2019 13:15

Yes, but with a rate agreed on there being 6 kids.

The person doing the hiring should have taken into account the likelihood of drop outs & made provision for this in the terms - it's hardly an unlikely eventuality. It seems they didn't.

OP was clear about the fee that made this job worthwhile for them.

winewolfhowls · 03/08/2019 13:33

I think I would do it, I mean come on, she's a nice lady, you've been paid more than a reasonably really, and there's a looming cancer death in the family. It's not like they can help it, do unto others etc

Then chalk it up to experience and tighten your procedures for next time, it's a learning curve.

It just feels worse and more of a chore because you have spent the money so it feels as if its for nothing, whereas if they had paid you only fifty already and said they would pay 250 on the night you probably consider that reasonable.

Nosavingshere · 03/08/2019 20:15

Oh I thought you said you were a teacher, not that you worked for MN?!
Howling at this

Rivkka · 06/08/2019 18:38

What did you decide OP?

Original poster
Sundancer77 · 07/08/2019 15:16

HI all,

So I messaged her explaining that I wouldn’t have taken the job if had known it was for just one child etc and although things happen, I was counting on the date and the situation we agreed initially. I said with distance and having baby now it wouldn’t be even possible and did she want me to find someone else and would I have to return the deposit etc.
She replied today that she was sorry for messing me around, total understands about the distance and if I’m not able to do it am I able to return the deposit and she will look for someone else?
I just feel bit pissed off about all the messing about, booking it in when didn’t need to and expecting the pay etc and instead now I have to find the money to give back to them after all that 🤷‍♀️I wish I could be in direct contact with the family themselves instead of via her company. Still seems bizarre to me that when booking things for a big wedding day, if things change on their side, they expect the deposit back etc 🙄

OP posts:
ReeReeR · 07/08/2019 15:28

OP I’m not sure why you asked if they want the deposit back

Your email back might have been fine but better if you had said you are not in a position to return the deposit. I think you have a right to keep it since they were the ones who cancelled and now you will probably be worse off as that money was rightly yours.

Or agree to give half back? This just seems a bit unfair on you OP

Bluntness100 · 07/08/2019 15:35

I can't believe you want to pull out and keep their money. That's beyond reprehensible.

If you don't want the job as it now stands you pay back the deposit. You don't try to turn them over.