Pissed off at lack of support on family holiday

[Belleende]

Some background. I am the youngest of 4 siblings. We are currently on a family holiday with my parents. I have 2 kids, 4 yo and 20 month old. The rest of the kids are all 10 and older.

Myself and DP have zero family support around, so very rarely go out, and as our 2 are vv early risers never get a lie in. This holiday has been particularly bad with neither of them sleeping well. I have been getting 2 to 4 hours sleep a night, with 2 totally sleepless nights. I have been on my knees.

In the time we have been here my siblings have offered only once to mind the kids so me and DP could go out and even then only after we had put them to bed. We have not been invited to any group activities. No one has even come to the beach with us.

Before my own kids came along I babysat regularly for both my sisters, have supported them unstintingly, dug my eldest sister out of numerous holes (including collecting her kids from the airport this trip just hours after we had arrived).

The final straw came last night when I discovered that everyone has booked a day trip today that is totally not suitable for my two, and it is our last day here.

AIBU to let rip and put a dampener on the last day of the holiday, or do I just quietly withdraw?

Unfortunately there is a big difference between a childfree sibling helping siblings with DCs, and a sibling with older DCs helping a sibling with tiny DCs. In the first scenario it is a break from the normal carefree existence (bit tongue in cheek) to do a bit of 'fun auntying'. In the second scenario, it is a worn out mum who is just starting to celebrate the freedom (along with associated teenager stress!) that comes with having older DCs - going back a decade to nappies is not that appealing.

Not saying its right. But i remember being a childfree aunty, keen to help. Now I'm a parent of teens /preteens, and I'm broken!

BUT do agree that organising holiday outings that you can't join in on is mean

There's a difference. When my neice was younger I always looked after her so my sister had sleep/ got up and took her Costa in the mornings when we went centre parc's together. Now when we go away I look after my son because she has her own child. I was young and single but she works and still has a child and her holiday shouldn't be paying me back for childcare years ago?

I don't think it's fair to expect them to look after your two young children so you can get a break. Also you said they have a 10 year old and you can't expect his holiday to be based around baby friendly activities either? Your children aren't sleeping, you said around 2 hours a night, so if you went out they would be awake and surely unhappy at being babysat by someone they don't know (you say you have no support at home so assume you don't have them round often with them living far away).

I think you need to just communicate in future and ask if it will be baby friendly and if you will get help as you seem to have built it up in your head and felt let down when in reality they don't need to have your children to give you a break.

They probably want to spend time with their own kids on holiday. I would be grateful for the night out. I think you are being a bit tired and grumpy. Just enjoy your last day on the beach with your kids.

I would certainly let them know that you haven’t enjoyed the holiday and the lack of support or general consideration has ensured that you won’t be going again.
It’s NOT about other people looking after your kids, you’ve all gone away together with I expect the notion of it being a “family holiday” hence spending time together and all pitching in, sharing an experience. OP hasn’t had the opportunity to share in anything because her family has ditched her and completely done their own thing and not once has anyway said “let’s sort it so the young kids can come along” or offered to give OP an hour for her and hubby to have a quiet drink together or anything!
Did no one read the fact that they haven’t even gone to the beach with them for one day? What’s the fucking point of a family holiday when you don’t see the other people? They don’t have to offer to babysit no, but all going to the beach together would mean OP might get a few minutes to enjoy a swim or walk along the beach alone whilst someone returns her favour of babysitting their kids when they were younger.
You now know what to say when “family” events are touted in the future - oh no thanks, we’re going away just the four of us to a lovely hotel with a great crèche and a kids club. Oh and certainly don’t entertain any further babysitting services for your siblings. They all sound selfish arseholes

Day trip is to a place that is not buggy friendly, a place I would dearly love to go

Any chance you can go and get you partner to watch the kids?

Seeing as you helped them when their children were younger and their children are now older it seems quite unfair that they haven’t wanted to help more.
I would say something

Let rip. They are being very selfish. Tell them.

The oldest kids are 16 so pretty independent. Wasn't expecting anyone to do the hideous early mornings we have been taking those in turns. As we are a big group we have not been doing much en masse as it is too difficult, but I just feel that no one has wanted to spend any time with us outside the villa. That on top of the lack of help and lack of sleep and I am in bits. Probably not the best frame of mind to have difficult conversations.

I was going to say you were a bit unreasonable as they’ve had their turn wrangling little ones and early mornings, but given you have helped them and continue to do so, I think they’re selfish, and I would tell them calmly that’s you’re disappointed and it’s not been a good holiday for you. I would also be unavailable for any favours in the future until it has come back your way. I wouldn’t “let it rip” as it will have much less impact

Too late now- but did you think of getting the teenagers involved? I come from a very spread out family and that’s what would have happened in ours.

How selfish of them. I would talk to them definitely, don't let rip, it will be a big falling out. A discussion about how you feel you are not considered in plans, and that the babysitting has been just one way is in order.

The teenagers have been disinterested beyond mucking about in the pool. Even offered to pay them, but no deal.

I've done that kind of holiday before with kids the same age as yours, one of whom was a desperate sleeper and the other one was a very early riser- it was really hard and so tiring. I wouldn't say anything but in my case when an extended family holiday was suggested again I just declined saying it was too difficult last time and I felt excluded - no shouting, just simply no not for me again.

With regards to the day trip I'm afraid I think you're being a bit unreasonable. If its somewhere you've always wanted to go I'm assuming the rest of the family feels the same - lots of places aren't suitable for a buggy and rules out your youngest. The older kids aren't going to babysit, surely your partner can stay behind at the villa at least with the youngest.

I think it depends, OP.
If you actually ASKED them for help and they refused point blank, then they are being very selfish and unkind, especially in view of the help you gave when their DC were young.
But they are not mind readers. If you haven’t asked for help, it’s unreasonable to moan when it’s not forthcoming.
It’s too late now anyway as the holiday is all but over.
If you plan any more joint family holidays, you really need to spell out your expectations before booking, so everyone is clear on it.
Personally, I think you’d be better going off on your own with DH and your DC, to a nice hotel somewhere with a kids club or babysitting service.

You mention picking kids up from the airport so I am assuming they are old enough to fly alone, mid teens perhaps? Sorry but they probably aren't interested in younger children, perhaps finding them boring. Teens don't really 'play' do they? A ten yo will want to hang out with the 'cooler', older teens.

You did get one night alone. If your DC aren't sleeping, it's really not surprising that your siblings did not want to put them to bed themselves.

I imagine that your parents have probably talked about 'a lovely family holiday where we can all be together'. Unfortunately, holidays with very young children are just same shit, different place and your parents have probably forgotten this and got caught up in all the 'making memories' bollocks.

I really don’t think there is a difficult conversation to be has OP. They just have very different ideas of what they want from a holiday - I agree with other posters that you can’t call in childcare from years ago as the situation now is very different.

As for visiting the place you would like to visit - either go and leave your DH behind, or plan to visit again when your children are old enough.

To be honest though I think trips when children are so far apart in ages rarely work as the want and need different things - maybe something to consider for the future?

The teenagers have been disinterested beyond mucking about in the pool. Even offered to pay them, but no deal.

I think this is fair enough to be honest. That’s what teenagers do on a villa holiday.

Difficult one.
The lie ins - not something you can expect others to do for you.
Babysitting is a bit more of a grey area, I don’t think just because you did things with your nieces/nephews you are entitled to some, but at the same time I would hope your siblings would return the favour if asked.

Regarding the day trip, couldn’t you go without a buggy?

Yanbu generally but I don't understand your upset about the day trip. It's a place you really want to go, so it's not unreasonable that your family wants to go there too. Presumably you know it's not buggy friendly so how could you have gone anyway? Are you suggesting that because you can't go, through no fault of anybody, none if you should go? That would be unreasonable of you I'm afraid.

Holidays with dc your age are hard work as everyone is hot and bothered and out of their routines. I don’t think you can expect much help with your children when they have their own to entertain.

They did help you out on one occasion for you to go out and they didn’t have to do that so I would definitely not have a word with them.

Next time you help your sister out, don't just do it, say "OK, I'll do it IF you do XYZ", ie make it conditional on her helping you some time. Preferably something specific like babysitting next week so she can't forget.

Oh, I hate this “you should have asked” schtick.

This is family. Brothers, sisters, cousins, parents. People who love and care about each other. Of course they should have helped a bit, OP. And it’s absolutely shit that they didn’t.

Nothing annoys me more on MN than the fucking sanctimonious bleating of The 'they're your kids , I wouldn't expect anyone else to help' .. really ???? On a 'family' holiday. !

I don't know what world most people live in but it is obviously not the same one I do. In my world - if you like and care for your family enough to holiday with them - and sibling and husband have 2 young children - you OFFER help. ! You also OFFER to give them both a complete break to spend sometime together . Telling them to leave and let us deal with the children for one evening.
Depending on how many people are there and the set up - there is no way any member of my family would not 'give up' at least one morning to spend with toddlers whilst knackered sibling got at least one lie-in together. ..

Would I EXPECT this (the great MN no no) a resounding YES because I am part of a family who love and care for me and mine - and vice versa. Would I do this for my sibling and adult children.
Yes of course! I would EXPECT to. They are my grandchildren/nieces/nephews.

If holidaying with a sibling with young children. I would EXPECT to help with all of the above and if I didn't want to - then I wouldn't be going on holiday with them.

Your Siblings and parents behaviour is crass beyond belief.
Let rip with both barrels. Appalling selfish behaviour that needs calling out.

No, I wouldn’t let rip at all.

It’s not what you hoped for. But that’s no excuse to have a tantrums.

Prior to the holiday did they make lots of promises re involvement? If so, then absolutely have a chat with him. If not, then I would view this as a family of 4 holiday (and sounds completely normal with children those ages. More of an endurance test!)

If you can bring yourself too, it's worth talking to them. They might have quite a different perspective.