Pissed off at lack of support on family holiday

[Belleende]

Some background. I am the youngest of 4 siblings. We are currently on a family holiday with my parents. I have 2 kids, 4 yo and 20 month old. The rest of the kids are all 10 and older.

Myself and DP have zero family support around, so very rarely go out, and as our 2 are vv early risers never get a lie in. This holiday has been particularly bad with neither of them sleeping well. I have been getting 2 to 4 hours sleep a night, with 2 totally sleepless nights. I have been on my knees.

In the time we have been here my siblings have offered only once to mind the kids so me and DP could go out and even then only after we had put them to bed. We have not been invited to any group activities. No one has even come to the beach with us.

Before my own kids came along I babysat regularly for both my sisters, have supported them unstintingly, dug my eldest sister out of numerous holes (including collecting her kids from the airport this trip just hours after we had arrived).

The final straw came last night when I discovered that everyone has booked a day trip today that is totally not suitable for my two, and it is our last day here.

AIBU to let rip and put a dampener on the last day of the holiday, or do I just quietly withdraw?

I totally get how you are feeling as I've felt similar on family holidays but it is really one of those things tbh.

It is also their holiday they aren't just there to babysit/help you out. Yes their children are older but this also has it's own challenges and they also need a break.

Family holidays always sound brilliant don't they. All being together, kids playing, taking turns in cooking!!! Then the reality of it....hellish sometimes difficult. But with bits of fun thrown in I suppose.
OP do you think anyone realised how you felt? Was there any embarrassed comments at the end? They must be very thick skinned not to have seen you were struggling

Yep lesson learned, while the kids are small will only go on trips that meet their needs. I totally underestimated how gruelling it would be.

The e mail thread I think you can only judge in the context of our family dynamics, and I think really wasn't an issue, although it will be interesting to hear if it was, I will ask my sister at some point.

Two things to remember tho, on this trip alone I spent a big chunk of the first day collecting my nieces from the airport, and staying up with them until my sister arrived to collect them at midnight. If I hadn't done this she would have had to rebook flights for all of them and probably miss the first 2 days of the holiday. Doing it was a total pain in the arse, and it took time away from my holiday, but I did it because it's what our family does.

And in the past I went on a package holiday with my sister when her two were little specifically to help her out. I didn't particularly want to use a chunk of my annual leave doing this, but she was really struggling so I did.

I was really struggling this holiday, and a little kindness and consideration would have made a huge difference. I have been there consistently for my siblings, digging some of them out of multiple holes (emotional, financial, practical). I am lucky enough and/or have made different choices so that I have never needed to ask any of them or my parents for anything since I left home, but I had assumed that if I needed them they would be there, but taking my kids off my hands for a few hours and spending some time together whilst on a family holiday seems to be too much to expect.

Do you know, instead of letting rip, why don't you just say how you feel - that you are really struggling and could they please please help - use the words that you've used here which have elicited sympathy?

You sound lovely OP. You really do. I think you've been taken for granted and your kindness has been abused.

I can see you are still intent on cashing in those chips! Do you expect something back in return for everything you do in life for someone? And from what you've said they did take the kids off your hands. You and your DH had a night out while they babysat. If your kids sleep as little as you say they do it can't have been a pleasant way for them to spend an evening on holiday. Everyone else is there to enjoy a holiday too. I think you expected to have free time every day while others looked after your kids and that is not on.

Also, if you were struggling as much as you say why not just say to someone ' I'm really really struggling here. Is there any chance you could watch them for a couple of hours' instead of quietly seething that everyone else is enjoying their holiday.

So when you point blank on the holiday asked your sister or maybe m gor help, what was the answer?

Or maybe your mum for help....

My parents are nearly 80 so not in a position to help. My sister did come to me pretty sheepishly in the last couple of days and ask if I was ok. I said no, was really struggling, but they had plans for the next few days and no offer of help was made. Perhaps I could have been more explicit in asking for help, but they definitely knew I was having a tough time.

Cccameron where did I say I was expecting them to look after my kids every day? Two things would have made me feel very differently about this holiday. One trip for everyone to the beach. And one afternoon for me and DP to have some time together. That's it. A lie in would have been a bonus.
And for the record, the night of babysitting, no one else was planning on going out, we were home by midnight, my kids didn't wake (until we got back) so all that was required was plugging the monitor in. Not a huge imposition.

I sympathise @Belleende. I agree that the pattern seems to be one of inconsideration - your needs being last - rather than anything else, but when a whole family can't find the time to help out one of its own getting no sleep - then their family support is worth very little. Hope you can get some catch-up kip now!

I think you need to be more explicit then in what you want instead of letting resentment build. Just a simple 'can we all have a day at the beach together?' would surely have resulted in a day at the beach!

They baby sat and the older ones did play with them. The sleep issue is between your dh and you, that’s parenting one takes the late night and get the lay in and then reverse.

I doubt you have to ask permission to join them on a beach so when you knew they where heading there you just say great I’ll grab toddlers bits and go. That’s what normal families do you don’t need an invite.

You would of put my back up before we even arrived with the cashing in and being disgraceful comments. I would of planned an itinerary to avoid being lumped with babies and toddlers before I even stepped foot on the plane.

I doubt they will want to do a family holiday again anyway so lesson learnt for all of you. If you want childcare on holidays you book a hotel with kids clubs not a villa.

That really sucks. This happened to us with a family destination wedding earlier this year and it was so disappointing. At the end of the trip the bride asked me if we had a good time and I looked her square in the face and said the trip was a god damn nightmare. Lol

If you’d have said ‘im struggling at the moment, we’re getting 2-4 hours a night. Id be really grateful for some help while we’re away’, that’s way more likely to have prompted offers of help. Your ‘Cashing in your chips’ message is the root of the issue here - you basically said, I expect childcare, you owe me. Ask nicely and you may get offers, issue a demand, and you’ll just piss people off and likely they’ll not offer on principle.
They probably avoided group trips because you’d already declared you expected them to babysit. I don’t blame them - most people would be pissed off at your sense of entitlement.
One night is fairly standard tbh. Did any of the other parents get more than one night out when the rest of you babysat?

One trip for everyone to the beach. And one afternoon for me and DP to have some time together. That's it.

Why didn't you go to the beach with them all when they went? How long was the holiday? How many days did you spend together out of the holiday? Was it literally every day the group went off and left you alone? Did you ever suggest a group activity?

There sounds like something else going on here? If the whole group was actively avoiding you and your family, why do you think that was?

decomposingcomposers I don't know what was going on. I think just a general lack of consideration and maybe they couldn't be arsed with babies.

I will ask my sister at some point, I think when I point out that we did nothing together outside the villa and we were included in none of the plans she will start to get it. We invited people to the beach on the second day in the afternoon. Everyone went off and did their own thing in the morning, the others just ended up on different beach and didn't contact us so it just never happened.

OP as far as the holiday goes I think your family were selfish fuckers or at the very least thoughtless.

BUT: you are putting yourself in the martyr role. I don't doubt you when you say that you've always been less 'important' than the others but I think you are almost enjoying proving to yourself that you're right. You could have invited yourself along to the beach. You have got into the habit of not needing your family (maybe because they haven't come through in the past) but they cannot be expected to know things have changed if you don't tell them you need help now. It's either that, carry on being the martyr, or sack them all off - and I don't think you want to do that.

Belleende

You say you didn't do anything together outside of the villa - how many days were you at the villa together? There's a difference between spending 3/4 of the holiday all together at the villa and them going out alone for a few days and them going out 13 out of 14 days.

Also, the beach day is odd. What was the arrangement? Did they agree to meet you at the beach you wanted to go to and then didn't turn up? Did you mention it later? It seems like they didn't meet you for a reason, whatever that reason may be.

You say they didn't want to be around babies - which is possibly true. How were your children during the day? If they weren't sleeping at night were they difficult during the day?

I guess ultimately, this holiday just didn't work because everyone's needs were incompatible. I wouldn't say they were wrong. You just all wanted different things.

I'm still really confused about why you were only getting 2-3 hours sleep a night with your OH there? The kids nightmares and disliking the cot doesn't really explain that. Can you tell us more? Even if the kids didn't sleep for a second you'd still expect to get 1/2 a night sleep each wouldn't you? If you went to bed at 9 and no-one got in the pool before 7 that should be minimum 5 hours sleep each a night? If you felt that teenagers could look after your kids from 7-9 then it does seem that 1 parent could too? I'm not sure the cooking meals thing is that relevant, it's about pulling together as a whole not just about specific tasks. I'm not wanting to make assumptions here but I do wonder whether your family were getting mixed messages. If you were not both (you and OH) fully clearly pulling out all the stops then it does look to others like you guys are coping in your own way.

I don't think you've told us about what you invited others to aswell. It does sound like you were expecting others to arrange things rather than seeing that as a mutual activity. It could be that sleep deprivation was making it hard for you to think straight to arrange things, and fair enough, but perhaps people need that a bit more spelling out sometimes as otherwise they might reasonably think that you're happy with what you are doing. Some people like mooching around by a pool/ on a beach for a whole holiday, especially when the kids are very little.

Maybe they are put off by the idea of toddlers and beaches.

My oldest wouldn't touch a beach - couldn't stand the feeling of sand on his feet.
My youngest has just got a mouth full of sand, while I'm trying to clean it out, stuck his sandy hand in it!

You need to either let it go and chalk up to experience or talk sensibly that you need help!

Is it possible for a sibling to visit and baby sit for you ?

'I intend to be disgraceful, I'm cashing in all my chips' sounds really quite different from one day at the beach with everyone mucking in plus an afternoon to yourselves - which is still an ask, but seems to have been your minimum as opposed to your ideal or maximum expectation. I imagine some off-group discussion went on among your family once you had made that comment.

I wonder whether, in a way, you've (unconsciously) set your family up to fail, and reinforce your sense of not being important? This would explain what a few PPs have commented on - why, if you feel you have a history of your needs not being met, you would expect to be showered with offers of childcare help on this holiday.

If you never asked then you have to accept that is why they never offered.
As a people pleaser you hope others will see and offer, they think your fine and will ask if you need help and you don't, but feel badly done by...Hence why you did the Airport run...
Ask, sis can you have the children for a few hours, either I will bring them to you, or you can come to us, I am really struggling and need some help....
Also find a baby sitter, plan some time for yourself.

OP what you say about your family is quite inconsistent... one minute they’ve always put your needs at the bottom of the heap and never help you out, yet in a recent post you say you assumed that they’d help because that’s what your family does.

It honestly sounds as though the truth is that the rest of your family haven’t really done anything different this time, they’ve never helped out much, and for some inexplicable reason you invested a huge amount in this holiday and seemed determined to get ‘payback’ from them. But not in an open, ‘I’m really struggling here and could use a bit of help’ manner. Instead you did the passive aggressive making barbed comments on the group chat, which was bound to end badly.

And although it may seem ‘unfair’ that you babysat for your relatives when their kids were small and now it’s not reciprocated, plenty of us have pointed out that you don’t calculate these things as credits and debts... like I say dh and I did loads with our nephews when they were small- days out as well as evening babysitting. Because we were child free at that point and it was a novelty. Now our kids have grown up I’ve been there done that and would not want to spend my precious free time baby minding.
Neither did I expect my SIL to ‘pay me back’ by doing stuff with my kids when they were little. Her hands were full then with pre teen boys and she’d moved to a different phase.

You need to get over the feeling of having been ‘wronged’ and accept that this holiday was just never going to be a good idea.