Why do so many people distrust socialism?

[malificent7]

Is it due to the legacy of Marx, the notion that it's a race to the bottom, the feeling that those who work harder should get paid more or a mistrust of human nature?
I do understand these concerns but what is more worrying if the vast inequality that seems to prevail nowadays. Thoughts please.

I can't see a single example of where it has been used and has been better for the people than capitalism.

I mean, capitalism is pretty shit, but socialism, whilst I agree with the principals in theory, doesn't seem to ever work in reality.

I'd take capitalism with a decent, secure safety net.

People mistakenly perceive socialism to be the same as communism.

I'm a socialist.

@zsazsajuju I stated that, it is democratic socialism.

I'd take capitalism with a decent, secure safety net

Democratic socialism.

I think we need a new name for it, because some seem incapable of seeing anything but the extremes (which I doubt anyone wants to repeat!).

I'd take capitalism with a decent, secure safety net.

The safety net is socialism. You can't have a safety net without socialism. You can't even have police or a fire department without socialism. Anything that is paid by the collective good for the better of society, is socialism.

Gingerbreadsprinkle- absolutely right. People don't seem to understand the difference between the people and the state. And they continue to believe the right wing press and vilify the poorest . I find it quite incomprehensible

The loophole that has been plugged hasn't hit the target.
It's killed disabled people, though. And a single father of 3.

Also, why are people calling communism (Berlin, China) socialism? They're not the same.

Reading the comments above, it is clear that people do not understand what socialism is.

Socialism means that the people who work in a company/factory should also be the ones that own it. At best socialism means that the government regulates heavily on all companies including private companies. It means free education (including university), free healthcare, affordable housing for everyone, and job opportunities (in Soviet Union, you got given a job as standard, people in the cities after school, or uni were given jobs)

Second it is not true that socialism is all bad. Not at all.

The socialist countries in Europe are Denmark, Finland, Norway, Sweden. Germany is less socialist than Denmark for example, because the country is still very much in favour of capitalism. The UK is not a democratic socialist country. The only bits of socialism in UK are free health care. The socialist countries in Europe mentioned above have the highest quality of life in the world, and Denmark has better social mobility than the USA.

In communist Russia, people got housing as standard, and those that lived in the city got a house in the country as well (for free given to them by the state!). Secondly in Russia you got 30 days (or more) holiday as standard and families regularly went on holiday for an entire month!

Cuba another socialist country, has one of the best healthcare in the entire world, they also have some of the best doctors in the world!

The problem with Western media, is that especially in the UK they do not discuss socialism in a positive light, and there are good aspects of socialism, unfortunately the great aspect of socialism and examples of socialist benefits to people's live, well those stories are not told in the UK. Because UK is a capitalist country that for more than 70 years (out of 100 years) has been managed by a Tory government.

the USA is best described as a country run by oligarchs, it is definitely not a democracy by any means, since you need a minimum of 30 million USD to run for presidency, so where would a candidate get that kind of money from, only from millionaires!

Wow. So much misunderstanding of socialism. I guess that answers the OPs question.

@NoBaggyPants

Yes absolutely. I distrust pure socialism but support democratic socialism. However, the OP is asking about socialism, not how socialist concepts can function within a democratic capitalist system.

“I firmly believe that if you work hard you should be rewarded for that”

Agree, hence I’d like to see people like nurses and carers paid a lot more and treated much better. But I’m not aware of any theory that covers that kind of thing at the moment. Maybe there is one and I don’t know, of course.

For all those conflating socialism with a social democracy, these are NOT the same things. We already live in a social democracy. We do NOT live in a socialist state (thank god).

Because anything too far left or too far right disadvantages and alienates a large chunk of society.

Cuba isn't socialist. It's communist.

@jophie80

The socialist countries in Europe are Denmark, Finland, Norway, Sweden. Germany is less socialist than Denmark for example, because the country is still very much in favour of capitalism.

No, these are social democracies, not socialist states.

Many people seem to have bought the lie (rather conveniently for the Conservative party) that socialism = communism, while failing to see the dangers of right wing extremism under their nose.

As a PP has said, democratic socialism is a tried and tested model in many developed countries. It is needed in order to curb the excesses of capitalism, which if left unchecked leads to ever growing wealth inequality and vulnerable people being pushed into poverty. It's not about taking away opportunity, it's about creating opportunity for as many people as possible.

I think it’s against human nature
We are programmed to compete with other humans for resources and while we can overcome our programming these days I think we instinctively shy away from socialism.
Plus there have been more famous examples of left wing dictatorships than right wing

See: www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/jeffreydorfman/2018/07/08/sorry-bernie-bros-but-nordic-countries-are-not-socialist/amp/

For a discussion on why the Nordic countries are not socialist states, but rather social democracies

"Distrust" implies that there's some fault in their thinking, that if only they could see clearly where it would lead they would get on board.

I think peoples reasons are lot more concrete than that. For half the households in the UK, socialism means money is taken away by the government to be given to the other half.

Boris said something in his initial speech about sorting out long-term- care. For some reason the idea sprang into my mind that the government might introduce a levy on pensions, like NI but on pensions instead of salary, in order to fund long-term care. That would be a socialist measure that many on the left would applaud, at least if introduced by someone they liked. For someone who had saved enough for retirement that could mean than a pension income capable of funding private long-term care would be reduced to the point where it couldn't. So it would mean worse care, so that people who hadn't saved could have better care. Hardly an attractive proposition.

That's just hypothetical. But I've pondered the same thing with regard to the NHS in the past. Being taxed to pay for the NHS can mean not being able to fund private care, which you might want when the NHS is failing to deliver. (As a secondary issue, the NHS domination of healthcare provision means there isn't a comprehensive private alternative, of the kind you'd find in almost any other country. So that's a double whammy of a socialist institution reduce access to the very service it's supposed to provide. In rare extreme circumstances, admittedly.)

Are some people thinking of mixed economy?

In communist Russia, people got housing as standard, and those that lived in the city got a house in the country as well (for free given to them by the state!). Secondly in Russia you got 30 days (or more) holiday as standard and families regularly went on holiday for an entire month!

DH grew up in the USSR, military family. Can you hazard a guess as to how housing was allocated? Can you hazard a guess as to the maintenance etc of an average building in an average part of a town outside Moscow?

I’m an amateur gardener, and every once in a while DH will come out with an obscure bit of advice/move plants around/whatever - as a quite young child he with his brother was sent out to harvest, tend fields, dig potatoes etc. If they didn’t do it, the family didn’t have enough to eat.

Every discussion of the successes of the USSR (and there were some) need to be tempered by an acknowledgement of the very real human cost of the enterprise.

A lot o

Venezuela...

As this thread shows people don't understand what socialism is. They either think communism or welfare state "spongers". Egged by a mostly right-wing press.

To me socialism is about supporting the vulnerable so they can have equal opportunities. So that it doesn't matter who your parents are or if you are handicapped . Children from disssbantaged background can go on to achieve well and handicapped people can have a good quality of life.

Look at Denmark. High taxes, generous welfare state, but doing very well. It is possible.

I think it is so heart-breaking that the UK has been moving away from socialism and introducing increasingly aggressive right-wing policies over the last 10 years and still has the 5th biggest economy in the world. Who is benefitting from the UK being so rich? I tell you as a teacher it isn't me.

A lot of political systems are fine in theory but then people get involved, that's what ruins it people generally corrupt, we need a mixture of them all.