To think the gov have let LGBT children down and have encouraged bullying

[LucyBart0n]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-48965655

And caused unnecessary problems for schools.

It now appears other religions are joining in on the act and coming out with homophobic bilge. One wonders if the ministers involved had had their own children suffer homophobic bullying that they might have been more proactive.

I don’t think it’s a coincident that the bullying my son suffered has reared its ugly head again. Thankfully as teachers and schools have more grit the culprits who said similar things to the Catholic leader in said article were dealt with appropriately.

Thanks a lot government you’ve told the world it’s not ok to be gay.

Same sex attraction/relationships - yes, normal, all for it.
Transgenderism - no, a dangerous ideology.
Within transgenderism is the idea by some that men who think they are female can be lesbians, that same SEX orientation is transphobic and that lesbians should be open to relationships with trans women. Plus all the other issues around gender (ie it is a social construct and disadvantages both sexes). It contradicts homosexuality, undermines lesbians (gay men are never asked to accept vulvas)and is full of biology denial
My child already knows about biology and that she is female and you cannot change sex. I heard about all this nonsense and had to teach her.

@zafferana

Nobody is saying that the boys have to wear skirts though. They are just saying that the option is there. What's wrong with that? It's a good thing imo.

@Hugs

It was the horribly clumsy way in which it was done that I think is the issue. Just say 'Our uniform consists of a white shirt or blouse, worn with grey trousers, skirt or divided skirt. It is up to pupils which combination they wish to wear'. End of story.

From my POV I guess they're not dictating which sex wears what.

Everything @Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g said

Government and schools need to stand strong and teach children tolerance and acceptance of all of our differences. I absolutely think equalities should be taught (in age appropriate terms of course) as young as possible. There should be no place for intolerance in our society. Unfortunately, it is rife. Maybe if our children get the message early, dispite the bigotry of their parents, there is hope for the next generation to forge a more open, respectful society.

It doesn't have to be complicated, by the way.

Recently a 6 year old boy told me he wanted to marry a prince, so he can live in a castle.

My response was that was an amusing idea, not 'you can't marry a prince as he's a boy and you're a boy and it's wrong!'. It isn't hard not to be a homophobe.

Also being trans is only confusing for children if you make it so. I had a trans teacher at primary school and that wasn't confusing at all. I actually think kids are naturally accepting, and just get taught not to be.

Transgenderism is an ideology often driven by homophobia.
There's a school with 75 trans students. Anyone who isn't concerned by that figure needs to give their head a wobble. The Tavistock Centre in London are deeply concerned by the Affirmation Only approach, which is pushed heavily by Trans rights group. If you simply affirm what a child says, without further exploration, counselling etc. that's neglectful and abusive. Interesting article here:
www.theguardian.com/society/2018/nov/03/tavistock-centre-gender-identity-clinic-accused-fast-tracking-young-adults

It’s certainly not confusing, unless children are taught that liking xyz means they could be the opposite sex.

My children know that some men/women like things stereotypically associated with the opposite sex, but that they are still the same sex. Or that some people have poorly brains that think they are the opposite sex, but they are still the same sex. Because changing sex - whether to do with gendered beliefs or mental distress - is physically impossible

and the way the Trans groups try to get people to shut up is to scream Transphobia! or No Debate!
Many of these people also believe that male bodied persons who identify differently should have the right to compete against women in professional sports and are happy to stand on the winners podium with a gold medal they've cheated their way to (google Laurel Hubbard for the most recent gold medal going to a trans woman, she's the one towering over the other competitors on the podium, photos tell a thousand words)
The Trans lobby think that by linking the T to the LGB, they can effect a fait accompli over the evil transphobes....manipulative smoke and mirrors.
Google the 'cotton ceiling' too. Male bodied trans women who identify as lesbians and want female bodied lesbians to get over their genital hangups and have sex with them.
This is happening now.
It's not a rumour.
It's not transphobia.
It's not bigotry.
It's FACT and TRUTH.

I actually think kids are naturally accepting

I agree. That's why we have to be really careful not to feed them dangerous nonsense, such as the idea that it's possible to change sex.

Everything Gasp0de said. Let's stick to facts.

absolutely @PencilsInSpace
I'm very grateful for posts like this.
A post very much like this peak transed me.
Right now people are clicking on this thread and starting to question something they've just accepted as fact for too long.
Every single thread like this helps to shine sunlight on the lies and manipulation.

LGB and T issues are very different and I don’t think it helps they are grouped together.

Yes all children should be taught to respect others with different beliefs and bullying is unacceptable.

They should also be taught it’s ok to set boundaries, stand up for themselves and state biological facts where appropriate. The law eg equality act should also be accurately reflected. Lobby groups should not be teaching in schools. Established safeguarding practice should be being followed. Any programme in schools that does this has my full support. Unfortunately a lot of trans lobby groups are aggressively pushing material that doesn’t do one more or all of these things.

Solstice I would have the same reaction to the castle story. I know a trans teacher who is very concerned about the confusing way trans issues are being addressed in schools by lobby groups such as Stonewall, Gendered Intelligence, Mermaids etc.

Stonewall’s reaction to guidance pointing out safeguarding issues about their guidance (an area they have no expertise on at all) really shocked me. Telling schools to destroy guidance that highlighted these holes - without even addressing the issues raised - is at best hugely naive and puts children (trans or not) at unnecessarily increased risk.

LGB and T are logically inconsistent and so cannot be taught together

T means no more LGB. As it is about same sex attraction, therefore recognising the reality of sexed bodies, and not accepting that a person is literally whatever sex they say they are.

The protests seem to be driven by homophobia though which is awful.

It's interesting that trans in not mentioned in the bbc piece. Usually with the bbc puts t front and centre. I wonder why the change.

Unfortunately it is extremely complex. I think it’s important that schools teach that everyone should be respected. That everyone has a right to express their beliefs.

I think the danger of pushing one agenda over another means that there will always be someone who feels that they don’t matter and their views don’t count.

Unfortunately many religions do hold the belief that homosexual acts are a sin. Now it doesn’t matter if you or I agree with this or not. The fact is there are many many people who follow these beliefs to a greater or lesser extent.

The children of the people who have these beliefs will by and large follow these beliefs.

I think schools need to concentrate of acceptance of differences whilst being mindful of the pupils own beliefs.

As I said it’s a very complex area. I think sometimes, what can be a very aggressive push of an agenda can be counterproductive. You can’t make everyone think the same way as you, especially where religion is concerned. I think if we worked more towards tolerance rather than trying to paint everything black and white people would actually be less polarised. As soon as you say one point is absolutely right you are saying every other view point is absolutely wrong, it makes people very defensive and polarised. lol at Brexit

I think a lot of people thought that most of these things were done

LGB acceptance
Women s equality
Racism is a bad thing

Etc

Turns out people just stopped saying what they thought, or loud, or in front of people they suspected might disagree. They never stopped thinking it though.

Feels like society is going backwards a lot around the world at the moment, with resurgence of ideas that we hoped were finished, all over the place.

Turns out loads of people are racist
Loads of people are homophobic
Loads of people think women should know their place and have various restrictions on them

It's shit really

The trans think it's interesting as its a regressive movement dressed up as progressive.

The protests are very much against gay children and adults. Haven’t seen trans mentioned on the placards or in the homophobic rhetoric. Not that transphobia would be any more ok than homophobia.

I think a lot of people who would otherwise have supported the school’s stance have been so disgusted by the agenda surrounding the T side of things that they just aren’t bothered. Having actually looked into the materials they’re objecting to I’m afraid I’d not be happy about my child being exposed to them, but for different reasons than the protesters (who do come across as bigots but have been helpful in highlighting the content of the No Outsiders program). This is what happens when LGB and T (and kink/fetishes) are all lumped together that you are made to feel you have to accept as a whole. No, I won’t and neither will the majority of people when they see what it is that is being promoted.

Yy small - there is then pushback against the whole of LGBt based on that perception. That does worry me.

Agree small.