To think I’ve done nothing wrong?

[YouDoYou18]

Background - Currently on Maternity leave for my DD, 29 weeks pregnant so will be going onto another Maternity leave straight after

I was talking to a close friend yesterday about how my work has sent over the details for the reward day this year and how I’m sad to be missing it as it sounds really good, she replied with it’s very nice of them to offer considering you won’t be working for them and I simply said they probably do just because I’m still employed, even while on maternity leave.

The reply I got was Eh? You didn’t go back after maternity leave. To which I responded that I’m still on maternity leave and will be rolling into another maternity leave but still employed. The response I got was Fucking hell you work for a fucking good company as I had to be back a year before I could have another baby. I said it was illegal to not allow someone a second maternity leave, it’s just that you have to claim maternity allowance instead of SMP.

She then started questioning what the point in me even being employed was, to which I said holiday, continuous employment on my cv and the ability to go back, at which point she informed me that ‘it’s no surprise you’re not entitled to any benefits’. And has now completely stopped talking to me.

Somewhere in the conversation I appear to have pissed her off but I have no clue when?? I don’t think I’ve done anything wrong in keeping my job, and I’ve not been declaring that I should be entitled to benefits, I’ve just recently been worrying about not being able to get any help with childcare when I do get back.. AIBU?

She is just annoyed that you get legal allowances she doesnt with your company.

Our DiL had her first baby in August 2017. She fell pregnant again and found out in the April of 2018 (not planned though not unwanted. Just earlier than they wanted another)

She went back to work in May 2018 and worked until End of October in 2018. She is due to go back to work in September coming. Yes she is going back.

There will be no more. They have two and one of each. Our eldest son and DiL have always done everything perfectly accept our 2nd grandchildren by them was slightly earlier than planned

She works for an independent firm and they have been very good

@donutrehomer Maternity Laws in The UK are too generous??? Are you kidding me ? I recommend using Google to learn about other countries. Sweden, generous parental leave, paid great money as 80% of your salary, strict maternity laws, supporting parents to take enough time to bring up children and then return to work with very low childcare costs! Poland - 80% salary for the whole year on maternity plus protected period during and after pregnancy. If you are ill during pregnancy, you are signed off till you give birth ( yes, even from 3rd month so for the period of 6 months ) and are paid full salary ! France - not the best maternity length, but good protection and free childcare from the age of 2 so parents go back to work! Finland, Denmark, island, all great.
Even less 'fortunate' countries are better than UK I.e. Serbia where Mothers can take 20 weeks of fully paid leave after giving birth.After that, they get an additionally full year of leave, but compensation diminishes over time. They receive 100% pay for the first 26 weeks, 60% for weeks 27-39, and 30% for weeks 40-52.Fathers get one week of fully paid leave.

UK is far beyond any countries with maternity laws, pay and one of the most expensive childcare in the world with minimal support to middle class parents

I fell pregnant whilst on mat leave with my first. I decided to go back to work earlier (10 months instead of a year) and then was back for 5 months before I went off again. The second time I took the full year. I did not intend to fall pregnant so quickly was on the pill and felt embarrassed.

I think the maternity benefits really depend on who you work for. I get 3 months full pay, 3 months half pay and then smp. My husbands employer pays 6 months full pay followed by half pay and smp.

A colleague of mine did the following and has just returned from her 3rd Mat leave spread over 3 years 4 months.

No1 baby: Months 1-12 mat leave
Month 13 in work
No2 baby:13-25 mat leave
Months 26 -27 in work
No3 baby 28-40 mat leave

She's been in work for 3 months in the last 3 years 4 months!!!

Its not illegal but it's been difficult at work!

If youre happy with employers discriminating against women, and blaming that discimination on women, thats fine.

Im not and never will be

@Amibeingdaft81

No, not because of the impact of a pregnancy

The impact of a shit employer

Yesssss

But sometimes it's not a short employer, it can be a small niche employer.

Quite a few posters have already pointed that out.

There seems to be a thought process on MN that all employers, regardless of employment sector and size, can absorb back to back maternity leaves.

If you read the entire thread, it's very apparent that simply isn't the case.

Sorry, my phone doesn't let me swear 😂😂 short should say s h I t

there seems to be a thought process on MN that all employers, regardless of employment sector and size, can absorb back to back maternity leaves

I dont think anyones said that.

Businesses need to accept that this can and does happen.

If they choose not to hire women of childbearing age because of that, they are discriminating.

Discriminating against anyone makes you a shit employer.

The rules should not be changed, and maternity leave and benefits restricted and taken away from pregnant women because some employers cant cope with them.

Legally you're in the right but I agree with donutrehomer to be honest.

@mydogisthebest I agree as well.

The maternity benefits in UK are not too good as some suggest. They are not good enough. There should be more assistance for small companies and highly specialised roles so that the company can employ cover and not be out of pocket. Other countries have much more generous provision ( eg 2 years in Austria, where many women tag a second mat leave onto the first and take 4 years off). I think if companies could afford to employ cover then longer leaves would benefit everyone. It would be easier to recruit decent cover if it was for a couple of years rather than 9-12 months and be less disruptive to colleagues.

No problem with back to back maternity, it could be now or in five years. But a rewards day entitlement? Presumably an invite is related to being rewarded for your contribution or targets or whatever, and yours wouldn’t be anything.

The rant of her response is a an unreasonable rant, but had io been employed and you had rocked up to a rewards day i would have been

If a company can’t pay a living wage, it can’t afford the cost of doing business and it’s not a viable concern. If a company can’t deal with the maximum legally allowed maternity leave for any eligible employee, it can’t afford the cost of doing business. The costs of payroll and benefits are no different than rent or taxes or copy toner. Anyone who moans about the hardships of the (meagre) maternity allowance in the uk on behalf of employers is an idiot lickspittle.

Elision. No ones moaning about maternity pay. Most of that is reclaimable.

The issue is the additional cost of maintaining employment status during extended maternity leave which is an extra cost on top of a replacement member of staff.

Some small businesses would find that really difficult. It doesn’t make them a rubbish business just one that might be in its early days or trying to make it in a tough economic climate.

You didn’t do anything wrong. I little cheeky to have 2 May leaves in a row maybe but not wrong and really if your employer is ok with it and you are too then it’s not really anyone else’s business.

Personally I would have rather had less mat leave but more opportunities for free or cheaper childcare. My son’s nursery fees were £1250 a month when I went back to work! I didn’t even earn that much but I also couldn’t just willingly quit my job and have no income at all. It was a total nightmare.

But to improve maternity leave provisions in this country would cost billions . It would have to be funded by taxpayers or business tax rates, because if the government were to solely fund it then somewhere a service that is essential to others would be cut to the bone or stopped.

It's the same for all these additional maternity leave cover staff, and their potential recruitment costs, the money and funding has to come from somewhere within the company.

@Dorsetdays the ‘cost’ includes everything -financial or otherwise- that it takes to manage maternity leave. There’s no excuse for any business, small or otherwise. You build legally mandated benefits into your costs from the beginning- just like taxes, just like rent, just like everything else- and if you can’t get by, your business isn’t viable. It’s pretty simple, really.

You're friend is jealous, and I can see why, but ignoring you is a bit strong IMO.

You are very lucky with your employer and such understanding is not the norm.

Your employer may be happy outwardly and if they are not funding your mat leave maybe they truly are but I wonder if they are really ok with it?

Most employers would be polite to your face but seriously pissed off with an employee having back to back mat leave.... what's the point of having an employee who is never there and is using the company to suit her own lifestyle choices?

Hmmmmmm.

Elision. You can’t set up a small business (or run one especially in its early days) on that basis though unfortunately.

Back to back maternity leave could mean a small business paying out thousands over a two year period just to maintain someone’s employment status on top of the cost of a replacement and, regardless of the legal position, for most that’s just not viable.

Felicis. You’re absolutely right, many employers would have to say it’s fine because legally they can’t do anything else. How they feel about it behind closed doors is an entirely different matter.

My children are young adults. I didn't have maternity leave bc I had miscarriages and eventually, dh and I decided that our best chance of having dc was for me to stay home. So, no personal experience about this.

However.

Recently, I have been wondering what is the purpose of country/society?

Is it to have a population of workers?

Or is working a way to support families bc families are the most important aspect of society?

I've been thinking a country's proudest task is having happy, healthy population.

I've been searching my brain abt what I've been taught; both as a child/young woman and through society as an adult.

Emphasis has consistently moved further towards being a good employee and less towards family life.

We no longer go to church (societal 'we') so who do we owe our allegiance if not to God and/or family?

Regarding the kind of snooty "if a business can't afford, etc." As a business owner, our employees get paid before us. Business for us is 24 hours/day, 7 days/week.

But I expect my family comes first before business and I think that I would like to know that our business provides families the means for a good life.

Family is first. My allegiance is always family. I expect everyone to put their family first.

I also think that seeing a person on a work picnic/event during maternity leave would be nice. (My dh and dc all HATE company parties. There is no reward they would choose to attend.) but if you work for a company and want to join in while on maternity, it's a good way to stay part of the company if you are going to return. To me, if you didn't come, you'd be telling me you didn't care about the company.

I think that I've fallen off OPs post. But i have been truly studying this recently and I kind of feel that we're on a precipice of forgetting what is our most important values?

I'm not really about fulfilling careers, I'm thinking about the larger population. For instance. Schools don't have emphasis on raising children or being choosing a partner. Those are incredibly important life skills.

But from youngest age, we're taught to show up on time, go to school sick, work hard and listen to authority. All important work skills.

Surely, we need a combination of both?

If it was your employer making a fuss, I would say no you've done nothing wrong but I can see why they might be a bit off. If it's your friend, she's definitely just jealous. Ignore her

@Dorsetdays did I stutter? If you can’t pay your staff and cover their benefits your business isn’t viable. You do the work yourself or rely on contractors or freelancers until you have enough cash flow to grow and manage your business properly. If you can’t then your business deserves to fail.

I’ve read some dire stuff on here !!!

But the attitudes of most of the people towards women getting pregnant is actually SHOCKING!!

As if a woman owes her employers her vagina... fuck off!!

If you can’t pay your staff and cover their benefits your business isn’t viable.

But that's not what's being said at all. It's about all the extra costs in having people taking back to back maternity leaves. In many roles, people get a company car, or an allowance to pay for a lease car. Private healthcare. A mobile phone. A laptop. All that continues during maternity leave. Yes you can argue that if the woman was at work they'd be paying out for the mobile contract and car anyway so it's not an additional cost.

However, in most cases the pregnant woman has to be replaced. And the company has to get another car, another health insurance policy, another mobile contract and so on. That is all EXTRA cost which they might have to pay out for 2 or 3 years while the employee sits at home having babies.