To wonder honestly what must go on in the minds of some men?

[VladmirsPoutine]

I've just taken my niece out for lunch. She's 16 and with the arrival of the weather she's been wearing a t-shirt and a mini skirt with her converse. Typical look for your typical teen but for just during lunch alone she was accosted by 2 different men who asked for her number. Both men clearly middle-aged and trying their luck. I admit she does look older than a teen but sheer audacity of these men hitting on a 16 year old girl really riled me.

And frankly I feel like it shouldn't take men to have daughters or wives or girlfriends in order to understand this.

"What were they expecting you to say; 'ooh yes, I'm 19 years old, of course I want to go out to dinner/to a bar/away for the weekend with a paunchy middle aged married man, yes please.' Idiots"

The thing is, sometimes it works. There's a bit from Tina Fey's "Mother's Prayer" that says:

"Let her be beautiful but not damaged,
For it is the damage that draws the creepy soccer coach's eye,
Not the beauty"

I think there's something in that. As a beautiful but very damaged teenage girl (fairly dreadful childhood) I dated a lot of much older, often quite unattractive men. It was a combination of not believing I deserved any better and hoping they'd look after me. They were only too happy to take advantage of my vulnerability and poor mental health, of course. If I had a time machine I'd go back and drag younger me away from them and give me a good talking to about self-worth.

I can only hope I'm giving DD sufficient self-esteem to shout "fuck off Paedo!" when they come on to her.

It's all so awful and not confined to only girls.My son is now aged 21 years.He is even if i do say it myself, a very handsome boy.When he was about 13 I noticed quite often that he was being absolutely stared at by older men very often in the underground.A few times I noticed him being nudged and touched.I didn't want to frighten him ,so said nothing but told him to come and sit by me.He is now studying and working in catering(event management ) and has said on numerous occasions that he has been propositioned by 'older men' But at least he is strong and athletic and now even though quite shy able to stand up for himself. Makes me sick!

I used to regularly get kerb crawled when I was walking home from school in my uniform around the age of 11/12. So obviously a child. When I told my parents they said I must have been doing something wrong. (I was walking home from school). I so wish I'd had the sort of parents who supported me and reported that sort of thing to the police.

Kashali who has taught your fifteen year old daughter to describe herself as "jail bait"?

'My answer for the 12 year old one would be .... she is 12 I suggest you leave before I call the police. They quite clearly can see how old she is. That is not right at all

Sadly she wasn’t with me. She was coming home from school.

She did as I told her and approached the guard. Who declined to assist.'

This is a huge issue.

When I was young I somehow understood, as did my friends, that it was up to us to try and deal with these men. That it was our responsibilty, not a thing for anyone else to help with.

There was a reason for that I suppose which is the above ^ actually society does say, don't look at us, this is your problem, 12yo girl. You deal with the creepy man, don't expect any help.

Ugh. Lets hope future generations of men and boys are brought up to be a tad more respectful and less entitled.

Christ on a bike.

I think OLD would explain this level of entitled behaviour on the part of these men.

I dunno, there have been blokes this deluded since way before OLD became a thing. As a teenager I remember getting similar from middle aged men who had absolutely nothing that would attract me, and that was before POF etc. Not saying that hasn't made it worse, but it predates online dating. I had a job pot collecting aged 17 in the early 00s and got asked out by one of the regulars, who was 25 years older than me and apparently did this with all the young female staff, to no avail. He had absolutely none of the attributes that middle aged men with women half their age might have utilised to attract them.

Not tarring all men with same brush - I know plenty of perfectly well behaved and well mannered men of all ages. But the trend for this behaviour - surely it has to die out?

I am also really taken aback at a girl saying 'I'm jail bait', it's a wholly objectifying sexualised descriptor that men use when talking together.

Not yet read the thread, but this makes me so depressed as a mother of boys! How do I stop mine from turning out like this???

Agree with posters saying that

A. its all our problem, we should try to call it out or offer some kind of protection even if just physically putting self between girl and man.
B. Giving kids the confidence to self defend verbally and physically.

Interesting that girls should feel they have to justify..like oh I already have a bf..thanks...in order to not offend the offender. Mmm.

We were having a family meal on Saturday and my 12 year old who was wearing very short shorts but a normal Tshirt attracted an old man who was drunk. He kept coming over talking to her. Ignoring everyone else on the table but he appeared again and I moved her down the table. She was oblivious to the attention and didn't even acknowledge him but I found it weird. She is tall for her age but not developed yet. Strange people around, I did wonder if it's just men these days but looking thru this thread it just seems we are more aware now rather than it happening more!

Twinkle I am mum of a boy too.

I think we need to chat with them young honestly and openly (age appropriate) about consent, about bodies, relationships, trust, sex, porn vs real life all that. Watched thing on BBC recently about the Dutch and sex ed. They do a lots with them from around age 7 so its not a taboo.

When I was 14 my dad said to me that when my friends next came around I could stay downstairs and he would take them upstairs, then he laughed. His meaning was clear.

It made me feel sick.

As well as sharing the horror that your daughter refers to herself as jailbait kashali I think you're missing the point. Even if a girl is or looks 18 and is somewhere she can reasonably be assumed to be so (the latter isn't the case for most of these examples) there is still the question of why middle aged men with nothing remarkable about them think they're in with a chance with an 18 year old. And why they think it's acceptable to mither her when having lunch with someone who is likely to be a relative.

Grim. But remember the Bill Wyman/Mandy Smith relationship? I'd like to think that would be frowned on more nowadays than it was at the time though.

I do think the construction industry has come on in leaps and bounds though in terms of eradicating this behaviour from on site employees. Most large firms have very strict policies in place for workers. And they do seem to be adhered to

Yup

I used to manage construction sites until very recently. I have had workers permanently removed from a site for that sort of thing. We take it very seriously.

A lot of them have a one track mind so it is no surprise what they are thinking but they need to stop themselves. Dreadful.

Urgh, poor girl. It’s just gross.
I saw this before that is very interesting..

Some men just actually think they are older, that doesn't make them bad, I can't believe some of these comments.

Yeah it does make them bad. Men shouldn't be harassing or making sexual comments to women they don't know. End of.

Were they courteous? No harm done surely, if they were courteous. Unwelcome maybe, but accosted sounds a bit strong.

Cinnamoncake, I agree, that poor girl. Her mother colluded with it too. As if he couldn't find a young woman as opposed to a thirteen year old girl. It was scandalous and absolutely nothing was done about it, probably because of Mandy's mother.

Stomach-churning though it is to think about, part of the 'fun' for these repellent pests IS the humiliation/shyness/embarrassment of the poor girls. It's a signal of their youth and inexperience, two things that are high on these bastards' list of preferred traits. Presumably, an actual woman with a mind of her own and experience of men would terrify these arseholes, because she would be able to spot and call out their inadequacy in a heart beat.

And this despite the fact that what most of these middle-aged perverts REALLY need in a partner is the ability to administer first aid and spot the signs of a heart attack, the sweaty old excitable scumbags.

I actually had to tell a perv bastard to stop staring and talking to my 7 year old daughter on a bus one day! He was making her and myself VERY uncomfortable and it was so blatant he didnt care! I ended up getting really pissed and saying if he didnt stop I was going to knock him the fuck out... he got off the bus not long after. Must have been in his 60's!!!