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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

I can't do laundry when you're in your garden

618 replies

Fairylighting · 28/06/2019 13:38

Ok, so I really don't think IABU, but was chatting to a friend about this fiasco last night and thought it would be worth putting it to the MN jury! I'll try not to drip feed, but that means this might be rather long!

I live in the first floor flat of a Victorian terrace conversion in London. It's a share of freehold with the ground floor flat and we technically each own half of the garden; my the back half from my fire escape stairs to the back fence and them the front half, from their French doors to the bottom of my steps. The whole freehold and both properties were previously owned by the same person, who rented each flat out and the garden has never been physically split by a fence or hedge etc. When I moved in (at the about same time as my downstairs neighbours), we had a brief discussion whereby we decided to share the garden since it's very small and that seemed like the most sensible and beneficial way to enjoy it.

Since then, we've had a few (4x over 20 months) minor issues where one of them (let's call her Penelope) has sent a message to our shared WhatsApp group complaining about noise, most of which wasn't actually coming from my flat. For example, once when I was away for a weekend and another time when I was asleep in bed. Then, one morning after they had been disturbed by noise from my flat, after I'd had to make a phonecall late at night I got a WhatsApp message from Penelope requesting that I don't have the TV or radio on in my bedroom after 10.30pm Sunday-Thursday... in some ways that one was easy since I don't have a TV or radio in my bedroom.

After that, we arranged to meet up for a cuppa to discuss their issues and set a date to do so a couple of weeks later. A few days before that date I was in the garden with my mum, having a cup of tea, in the afternoon. Penelope came outside and explained that they were having guests over for lunch and felt exposed because we were in the garden, and requested that we went outside. I said that I didn't think that was a reasonable request and she went inside crying.

We then met for the planned chat and Penelope and her partner (he can be Samuel for the purposes of this thread) explained that the noise wasn't really an issue and that it hadn't happened very often, also that Penelope is a light sleeper and is probably more bothered about it because of that, so we dropped that issue. Penelope then started talking about the garden and how exposed they feel in their home, when I'm in the shared garden before Samuel suggested she might want to apologise for the events of the preceding weekend. She did so, and I explained how rude I had felt that was before she continued to explain how bothered they were by the whole issue. I expressed some sympathy but also said that I like using the garden and that it's one of the reasons I bought the flat. We agreed to share schedules so they and I could plan any events involving guests for times when the other party is away if possible. We did that over the course of the following week.

About a week later I got a message saying it was Penelope's birthday and asking whether I could therefore not use the garden, so they could relax in their home. The following day I got a message with some ideas for changing the garden in a way that would make it more open with fewer changes of level and planting. I replied to say that I was happy to chat it through but that it sounded like a lot of work and might also further reduce their privacy then the conversation went quiet.

Another week later I sent a message saying that I was considering buying some solar powered fairy lights for the garden and I got a really tetchy reply from Penelope, who was upset that they'd be shining light into their property all night long. I explained that we could just turn them on and off as we wanted to use them. This prompted another message asking me not to use the garden on the Saturday of that weekend, followed by a long message explaining how upset they are by my use of the garden and how it prevents them from doing laundry and cooking. Penelope said this has all triggered her depression and anxiety and that they're worried the lights will look tacky and encourage me to use the garden in the evenings.

I replied on WhatsApp saying I wanted to consider a proper response and drafted a long email over a few days, setting out the legal position and the fact that I want to use the garden (or at least my part of it) freely. I proposed a way forwards that included me and Samuel communicating until Penelope feels better, neither party making any changes to the garden in the short term, informing eachother of any abnormal use of the garden in advance, and that our default position would need to be a return to the legal split of the garden.

Anyway, that was two weeks ago and I haven't heard a peep since... What's happened?!

OP posts:
Thread gallery
14
ChilliAndRiceIsVeryNice · 28/06/2019 17:49

Sorry, I’ve changed my mind. Don’t even bother to ask her view on the fence. Just get one installed on your side. Imagine the peace of knowing you never have to respond to her again and can use your garden any time you like. She’s lost her right to be consulted.

billy1966 · 28/06/2019 17:51

Super diagram OP.

I can't imagine you having much enjoyment now that this has happened.

I think Sleepwarrior's suggestion is perfect.

Longer term you will have more enjoyment and peace with it fenced off.

peachsquish · 28/06/2019 17:53

Agree with others think a fence is the way to go.

TonTonMacoute · 28/06/2019 18:03

I wouldn't put up a fence without their agreement, it's just going to cause more upset. You could suggest some big pots or planters with taller plants in, so it's not so permanent.but will screen your bit off a bit.

Try and keep communication channels open, with Samuel if possible, otherwise just ignore. It really isn't your problem, although I imagine it is really wearing.

LenoVentura · 28/06/2019 18:06

Nothing new to add - IMO she's trying to steal the garden and you have the better half OP #teamfence.

ChilliAndRiceIsVeryNice · 28/06/2019 18:07

Yeah I don’t necessarily buy the ‘i have MH issues’, and even if she does that’s not your concern. Funny how there’s no concern for the impact on your mental health of all this. She’s trying to make you feel so uncomfortable and hassled you give up and leave the entire garden to her.

TheCraicDealer · 28/06/2019 18:19

SleepWarrior's message is bang on. The whole "good fences make good neighbours" thing is all about how having boundaries and knowing where you stand making life easier for the both of you.

In this case, you should be able to use your half of the garden as you wish. It was very kind of you to trial the rota system but actually they benefited out of that way more than you did because your garden is the better bit and she still took the piss. Although Penelope won't like it, knowing and seeing where her property ends and yours begins could actually help in the long term.

Whilst some people have suggested some sensitive fencing which would allow as much light as possible through to their flat, I actually would be inclined to go for something more substantial. Her being able to see people in the space from her property will probably trigger her anxiety more, and last thing you want is having friends over and her peering through asking you to "keep it down" or whatever.

Nanny0gg · 28/06/2019 18:20

Who's the 1% that thinks the OP is unreasonable??

TheCraicDealer · 28/06/2019 18:22

Penelope.

GotToGoMyOwnWay · 28/06/2019 18:26

Craic Grin

Mia184 · 28/06/2019 18:28

TheCraic Grin

OP, if you do decide to put up a fence, I would so without informing Penelope beforehand. She will likely make all sorts of demands regarding the fence that will make things worse than they already are.

CuppaSarah · 28/06/2019 18:28

I really feel for Penelope. I've been in a similar headspace, also when we lived in a ground floor flat and it was tough. But if it wasn't feeling looking in on by everyone parking their cars outside our lounge(which was where the assigned spaces were) it would have just been something else.

Don't do anything permanent right now. Continue using the garden as you would anyway and try and be a little patient with her, but don't give into every whim. Samuel will point out to her when she's being unreasonable most likely and you don't want to be changing your behaviour. For one you have no reason to and for two as she starts to recover a change in behaviour might make her a bit paranoid again anyway.

It's a crap situation, but it's not your situation, it's Penelope and Samuels.

Owlbert · 28/06/2019 18:33

YADNBU! It is a shame Penelope is hving a hard time at the moment but that's not your fault! I wouldn't say any monre for now. Spilt the garden as others have suggested and only when she/they mention again explain that the whole issue has caused you uneccessary stress and that you are going back to using your part of the garden whenever you want to and ask them to refrain from using your side. Do not agree to keep out of your garden for birthdays, visitors or any other reason in future as she is being indulged and it will just get worse. Good luck OP!

Outsomnia · 28/06/2019 18:34

It is interesting that P + S the downstairs owners failed to suggest a fence or some other dividing method. Hmmm.

Instead of all the whining and organising your life to suit theirs, the easiest thing to do would have been to open a discussion on dividing the garden into two separate spaces. Everyone would then have been happy with their privacy intact.

MitziK · 28/06/2019 18:34

A breezeblock wall would guarantee she has privacy to shove her dirty knickers in the washing machine...

fishonabicycle · 28/06/2019 18:34

Fence. I couldn't be dealing with Penelope. She sounds a bloody nightmare.

Gooseysgirl · 28/06/2019 18:35

Tough shit Penelope... time to put the fence up OP! Share garden is not for her... she needs to move if it bothers her that much.

Mrscaindingle · 28/06/2019 18:36

I had a neighbour like this and tbh you're on a hiding to nothing with batshit neighbours. Either you spend your life walking on eggshells (which won't be enough) or move. It sounds drastic but in my experience this tends to escalate and your home is the place where you should feel relaxed not worried about falling out with your neighbour for just living your life.

Schoolchoicesucks · 28/06/2019 18:40

OP, yanbu but are you mainly using the patio area? If so, I can see why she feels the lack of privacy so much. I agree with the other posters that the reasonable solutions to offer are to continue sharing the whole garden and they improve screening with their French doors. Or you go with splitting the garden, planters with attached trellis would be a good solution to help it not feel too enclosed.

AllTheWhoresOfMalta · 28/06/2019 18:41

I’m with everyone else on this- would rather have a small garden that was all mine than a larger one I had to share with loony Penelope.

And you’re a saint btw, I would have told her where to go a long time ago.

fedup21 · 28/06/2019 18:42

I would suggest a fence every time they mention anything about the garden.

ScreamingLadySutch · 28/06/2019 18:47

Penelope needs net curtains, aeroplane eye mask and ear plugs.

Then after that, she needs to get a grip.

Matildalamp · 28/06/2019 18:47

Pollywollydolly
I just snorted my coffeeGrin

visitorthedog · 28/06/2019 18:48

A row of penguin bollards (facing the house) could totally solve this issue.

Juells · 28/06/2019 18:54

You've tried being reasonable and it doesn't work. Penelope cries and wants to get her way. It's emotional bullying.

fence fence fence fence fence fence fence fence fence fence fence