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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think DD should be allowed to go on DofE expedition?

227 replies

Passthedamncoffee · 21/06/2019 22:15

DD is currently in year 10 and is doing her DofE silver award. She has been having some issues with anxiety and depression, and recently had to go to hospital because of self harm.

Yesterday the school said that she’d be fine to participate in the expedition, however today they have said they would strongly recommend she doesn’t participate. This has been rather upsetting to my DD as she has been looking forward to the expedition (next week) and has been working hard to ensure she could complete the award.

FWIW, all medication etc wouldn’t be on her (instead with the leaders), DD had a practice expedition in March, and while she did struggle a bit overall she had a good time, and wants to go again. AIBU to think DD should be allowed to go on the expedition?

OP posts:
CastleCrasher · 21/06/2019 22:17

What reason did they give for changing their viewpoint overnight? Did something happen?

Original poster
Passthedamncoffee · 21/06/2019 22:21

Nothing happened overnight, DD has been ‘better’ about things overnight if anything. AFAIK they were going to talk to the DofE organiser but no idea if that had happened. They didn’t say to DD if they did talk to the DofE organiser

OP posts:
PinguDance · 21/06/2019 22:22

Hmmmmm. I think this would be a really difficult call and very much not the kind of thing MN could tell you. Sorry to hear you’re both having a hard time though. Xx

worriedaboutmygirl · 21/06/2019 22:24

What does her clinician say?

oneforthepain · 21/06/2019 22:25

They haven't said she can't? Only "strongly recommended".

So go ahead.

DofE is supposed to be accessible to those with disabilities. Unless there are serious concerns for her safety...

blue25 · 21/06/2019 22:28

We can't really comment on this without knowing all the details, which obviously you can't give. I would take advice from her Dr/Psychologist. I understand why school might have serious concerns though.

oneforthepain · 21/06/2019 22:28

Bearing in mind that participants can do their expedition with a carer in their group and significant 'reasonable adjustments' to the normal set up, the school is on thin ice if it tries to stop her because of disability without making appropriate adaptations or there being significant concerns for her safety remaining after adaptations.

RomanyQueen · 21/06/2019 22:29

OP, if they deem her to be unstable it wouldn't be in her best interests.
It is a shame after all her effort.

ICanWearMyBoobsUpOrDown · 21/06/2019 22:30

Could it be a safety issue do with your dds self harm?

I would go and discuss what their concerns are exactly, then come up with solutions to their issues.

I hope your dds struggles become lighter for her, and you. It's a tough place to be, and a tough age to be there Flowers

DuchessSybilVimes · 21/06/2019 22:33

My guess is they are worried about her trying to harm herself while she's out of expedition? It would be a nightmare for them if she came to harm. I can kind of see where they are coming from but obviously it sucks for your DD.

oneforthepain · 21/06/2019 22:36

OP, if they deem her to be unstable it wouldn't be in her best interests.

Hmm that's a call for clinicians, not schoolteachers.

Having something to look forward to, something that will give her a sense of achievement, something that involves working with others... Those are all fantastic things for someone with the struggles she's having and absolutely in her best interests if she can be supported.

I've been part of similar types of events where teens with self harm "histories" and mental health problems were supported to participate. She shouldn't be excluded by default.

MumW · 21/06/2019 22:36

This is a really difficult situation to judge but these are a few questions I would be asking myself...

Where is the expedition?
How far away are you?
Could you go and get her if she really can't manage?
Do you think she will cope?
Do you think doing it might help her MH or would trying and failing make her significantly worse?
Are the members of her group supportive or are there tensions?
Who said it was ok and who then said not so?
What were the reasons given for the change and do you think they are valid/have a point?

If she's done and coped with the practice expedition ok, it would seem a shame not to go on and complete the assessed one.

Hope you manage to find a satisfactory solution.

DipDabLollyPop · 21/06/2019 22:37

I write with experience on this to a slight degree. She should go but the school and you need to agree on a risk assessment and agreed plan of action to make sure she's safe. You must put in writing you are happy for her to do this.

Frannibananni · 22/06/2019 07:32

Who are the chaperones on this trip? Is it mostly volunteer parents and a few teachers?

herculepoirot2 · 22/06/2019 07:49

It’s hard to say without detail, OP. Ultimately the staff involved in DofE have to be confident that they can keep students safe. The staff don’t have to go.

user87382294757 · 22/06/2019 07:52

Maybe they feel they would be unable to supervise her 1:1 and there is a risk she may self harm. You know her well and if she has done anything like this in the past

user87382294757 · 22/06/2019 07:53

You say she recently had to go to hospital for self harm so it is obviously a risk.

Babysharkdododont · 22/06/2019 07:55

When was her last incident of self harm?
Could you go with her and be responsible for her safety?

adognamedhog · 22/06/2019 08:00

Many years ago I did a Duke of Edinburgh hike with a child who suffered from anorexia. There were very poor levels of staff support for her or understanding of her condition and, as the group member with empty space in my bag (because it was a huge bag), I ended up carrying all her stuff as well as my own. In the end I was the one that collapsed under the strain of the weight. It also damaged my shoulder.

It would be wonderful if your daughter is able to go. It sounds like she is having a really rough time and the trip could be hugely beneficial for her. Just please make sure that she has staff support as having responsibility for her could make the other children quite anxious.

DonkeyHohtay · 22/06/2019 08:03

The thing about the silver D of E expedition is that they are not supervised all the time - that's the whole point. DS did his earlier in the month, it's 2 nights and 3 days. They were canoeing up and down a loch and camping on islands in the middle.

Obviously a leader drove them up there in a mini bus. The leader was involved in the planning about what they'd do, where they'd go and where they would be camping. The leader checked in with them morning and night. But apart from that, the kids were on their own. Leader was keeping an eye open from the shore but was not with them. Children on the trip with medical needs (they had both a type 1 diabetic and someone with severe allergies who uses an Epipen when needed) had to manage their own medication. The kids all had first aid training too.

So in OP's case, having a leader holding medication is not appropriate, They have to take care of that themselves. OP has to make her own judgement call on this one.

Littlekittystops · 22/06/2019 08:11

I agree with the school on this. They are in the middle of nowhere with no phones, it is supposed to be challenging and a little stressful. If your dd has been hospitalised due to anxiety, then what will happen to her if it happens whilst she is away? How will they get her to hospital , what will be the impact on the other children. Why would you even want your child camping out of contact when she has been so ill?

I understand you want the best for her, and don’t want her to feel disappointed or upset. I would accept their decision and if you can afford it take her away somewhere calm and peaceful, maybe with a spa treatment or mediation classes, and work on getting her better op.

TitianaTitsling · 22/06/2019 08:18

FWIW, all medication etc wouldn’t be on her (instead with the leaders) is that your directive or have they told you that? Like pp from my DofE we were very much on our own for the 3 days/2 nights with no leaders about, although they were in radio contact (pre mobile phone days!)

Littlekittystops · 22/06/2019 08:19

For those not familiar with this type of expedition.
Parents and teachers are joy allowed to go. The children are dropped off in the middle of nowhere. No phones allowed. The walk/cycle/canoe for miles and miles with a map and set up camp. It is tiring, challenging and exhilarating for the children, but definitely likely to be a flash point if you game anxiety.
There is an emergency phone available in some places, but it is not obvious how this could possibly work with a child that has been hospitalised recently for self harm. What if the child really hurt themselves and it took too long to get medical help. It is dangerous.
I agree with the school. Far too many potential risks.
Dds safety, and the safety and well-being of the other children is paramount.

Littlekittystops · 22/06/2019 08:20

Not
Have

Littlekittystops · 22/06/2019 08:22

I am sorry you are going through this op. It sounds awful for you and dd. I hope you can organise a really lovely alternative for her.