Does a messy home negatively affect a child's upbringing?

[MaryPopppins]

A friend of mine has gone away for the week and as an emergency needed me to feed her cats and let them in and out as her mum is also away and normally does it.

I've only been in her living room and kitchen before. They're both very cluttered, no space on sides anywhere. And lots of collections. But I guess I'm used to it and look past it as kids are normally running round playing and we only tend to pop in for an hour or two here and there.

But today saw the bedrooms and bathroom for the first time. And was really quite shocked and saddened.

(It's a bungalow, you have to pass the kids 2 bedrooms and the bathroom to get into the lounge and kitchen, wasn't snooping. Normally the doors are shut.)

The kids bedrooms were covered. I can't quite figure out how they get into and out of bed. And the bath was piled high with dirty washing and towels. Toilet all brown, even the seat, sink full of bath toys. Every windowsill is full of stuff so they wouldn't be able to open/close curtains etc.

If I'd seen photos online I'd assume it was of mentally unwell people or old people who needed help. (I will admit to being a germ phonic person. Quite obsessed.)

But they're smart, and the kids are smart, quite cheeky boisterous children but they're happy enough and doing fine at school.

Am I blinkered and terribly judgemental and that's a fine way to live? Will it effect the kids negatively?

I'm not concerned for their emotional well being. But I suddenly feel really sad for them seeing where they sleep/are supposed to get clean.

I was lucky to grow up in a very tidy home. My mum is very house proud and maybe I just took it for granted?

I feel like offering help would insult them. They're very capable. Maybe they're overwhelmed?

jezebel could not agree more. The family I know have kids who miss trips as permission slips are lost, never know where their homework is etc. It affects all areas of life.

In my ideal world I would love my house to be 1, and sometimes I achieve it.....then my kids and husband arrive home.

Studies show a strong correlation between messy living conditions and problem behaviours

But there is a big difference between a causal relationship and correlation, even though the terms are used interchangeably, even by researchers who should know better. For example, a seriously messy house might be a sign of mental disorder in the parent, so that could be what is affecting the child (not simply a messy house!). Or, in another case, the child could genetically inherit some of these issues from their parents. In a case of correlation, the answer is not simple as in causation, as the problem may be something else entirely, or just a symptom of the original problem.

But I do think a total filthy mess is obviously not great for children.

It kind of makes sense that a very messy house may lead to problem behaviours. I know if I am in a very messy house I feel unsettled and less relaxed, so not surprising some children may also feel like this.

@redspider1

I've hardly gone "Michaela from Queens Road, Liverpool has a filthy house" have I?

Could be anyone, anywhere.

I'm not stopping being her friend, just curious about if her home will negatively effect her kids. As it would be a shame.

Houses don't have to be show homes but from what you say this house has passed the untidy stage and would now be a concern.
Children deserve a clean safe home. They shouldn't have to be navigating round filth just to get into bed.
I'm no domestic goddess but keeping a basic standard of clean isn't that hard how ever busy your life is (unless you have disabilities).
My DF and DSM had a dirty disordered house and it made my DSD so unhappy as a child. Me and my DSIS were lucky we only had to stay there at weekends and had the week in my DMs clean house. It was horrible not having a clean sink or bath to wash in and having to prepare food in a dirty kitchen.

Its totally possible to have a very clean and organised home AND have lots of time to play and enjoy our children. I don't see it as either/or. At all. We all help to keep the house clean and we all appreciate a calm and clean house.

My parents house was and is still always tidy. I often wish my house was as tidy as theirs. I don't have the kind of house where people can pop in and I wouldn't feel a little embarrassed. It isn't the worst but I can feel standards slipping and it stresses me out. I work and my dh works and we have no family close by to take the kids for a few hours to get on top of things. We like to spend our weekends going places with the kids - museums and beaches etc.
My parents house always felt like a 'home' my mum was/is amazing and our home was full of love but.... I do remember my mum always being busy and being told to tidy up all the time.
I'm desperately trying to find that balance of work/home, fun/tidy. I'm trying to get my family to pitch in more but I usually come across resentment and huffing. Sometimes it's just easier to do it myself.
Personally I don't think it will affect the kids.

Its totally possible to have a very clean and organised home AND have lots of time to play and enjoy our children. I don't see it as either/or. At all. We all help to keep the house clean and we all appreciate a calm and clean house.
Yes if you're on top of it and you tidy and clean as you go along it takes no time at all.
It's only when you've let things slide and you have a big mess to clear up that it starts to get overwhelming.

Middle class people make it a point of honour to live in messy environments to emphasise how important their interests and inner lives are.

As a working class girl whose father was a tidy-maniac I like to have things clean, neat and beautiful. It gives me a calm and lovely space to think, read and be.

Therefore, I spend the morning cleaning, tidying and having a walk and the afternoons I am the Dowager Countess of Downton enjoying my perfect mansion.

Actually, I think some degrees of mess denote dysfunction and derangement and that children brought up in chaos are victims of a certain sort of abuse.

teacher the most affluent titled friends I have all have spotless homes with the exception of the boot room and often the nursery. They tend to have staff to most/much of it, so it is not a huge bore.

This level of chaos will likely extend to some other areas too. For example the parents might by unable to get the kids to school at the right time everyday. They may often forget kit needed for sports and be unable to pack properly for trips etc.

I can't bear a really untidy house - don't mind a home that is lived in but my friend's house is so untidy l come away feeling stressed. Just couldn't function if l couldn't find anything. Kids will go one way or another as they grow up but it can't be healthy.

middle class people make a point of honour living in messy environments - interesting as because on another thread I have been very firmly put in my place as working class on the basis that my son has a nanny and not a grandma.
Incidentally I also grew up a stone's throw from Queens Drive in Liverpool.

The family I know have kids who miss trips as permission slips are lost, never know where their homework is etc. It affects all areas of life.

And I bet they describe themselves as laid back or happy go lucky!

I don't think it can be described in terms of class as an issue, although sometimes self aggrandizement is employed as a cover for disinterest or laziness. Male or female.

Kids need a good example to guide them, raise them in chaos and they'll assume chaos is normal. Keeping your environment clean
and liveable - not sterile - is a life skill important to a persons physical and mental wellbeing. Anyone disputing that is in denial, indeed it's an indicator of depression when a person lets their surroundings suffer.

Of course Mumsnet is all about the extremes, it's either squalor and filth or joyless sterility. The reality is that most of us struggle along somewhere in the middle, with detours to the upper and lower ends of the scale in varying doses. Which is probably what passes for normal. :)

I recently visted my best friends son and his partners new house
They have been living in the house less than 3 months
It’s brand new ( a new build ) and it looked like a crack den
The kitchen had several weeks worth of dirty plates with mouldy food on them
There was absolutely no space on any of the worktops just plates of food and carrier bags of rubbish
Filthy Dirty cat litter tray and it’s smelt of dog shit ( they bought a dog )
Clothes hanging everywhere on the kitchen cupboards

The toilet was disgusting shit smeared in the pan and piss on the seat

The living room was ok but still very messy in that you had to move stuff to sit down
They are both young professional couple with excellent jobs and wages & no kids
They paid around 350 thousand pounds for this house and It looks like a crack den

I can’t quite work out why pay all that money for a house and to live in it like that

I grew up in a house that sounds very much like this. My mum had depression and often shouted at us at night that she couldn’t cope, wasn’t going to come home one day... she woke me up at 10pm one night because she was screaming about how messy the house was, and made me start cleaning. She’d often call us lazy, imbeciles etc. Should have had social services involved but i guess it wasn’t important enough for them at the time.

I didn’t go out and mix with the kids in my neighbourhood and i was too ashamed to invite friends round. So I didn’t have a happy home life and didn’t have a happy social/school life.

I couldn’t wait to move out. Boyfriends always commented on why i was always ready when they came to pick me up and didnt let them in. I now live with a partner who likes a tidy house. I keep on top of the house work, we split the chores and im a bit more relaxed about doing them than he is, but i get them done. I hate it if anyone calls me lazy though

My mums dead now, and i feel bad that this is what I remember, but its true

I recently babysat in an emergency for a friend of mine; I was shocked at the state of her house but it explains why her kids never have friends over.

She's also in significant debt but goes out every weekend (during the day) and this often leads to spending more money she doesn't have to avoid the mess at home.

I don't know how to help her so I've not even mentioned it 🤷🏻‍♀️

@Idontlikecheesecake

Don't feel bad about remembering that, it's a traumatic thing and it's not surprising it overshadows nicer memories. We remember the things that mark us the most.

Sometimes the greatest gift a parent can give - or even the only gift - is a clear picture of the person we don't want to be. Either totally or in part. I don't think we are automatically condemned to make the same mistakes our parents do, we get to make all new ones of our very own!

Dull women have immaculate homes.

"Dull women have immaculate homes"

Two of my friends have immaculate homes and are most certainly not dull. Statements like the above are always made by people being defensive about their less than tidy homes.

I agree! The cereal boxes out bothered me! I mean it looks a bit soulless so you could have a plant or something but the cereal looked messy£

I would far rather be seen as being dull and clean, rather than 'interesting' a batshit crazy child abuser who enjoys living in a fucking midden and would beat the dog with a metre stick to punish me once I didn't respond to getting the beatings myself.

Especially when one of the times the poor fucking animal copped it one was to pay me back for destroying her stuff - because I'd sliced my leg open (all the way through the fat and exposing the muscle) falling through a fishtank left on the ground.

She can be was interesting as she likes in her Fortress of Utter Shite, neither going out or letting anybody in because she thinks they're going to steal her mountains of rubbish.

I'll stick to being dully boring with work, a lovely partner, two unabused DTwatCats, performing onstage regularly, travelling for festivals, painting, dancing, writing music, conservation work and generally trying to be kind. Oh, and with a clean house where nobody needs a tetanus injection after walking barefoot across the kitchen floor.

seriously what is the problem with a cereal box on top of a fridge ?

I like the house tidy and very clean, I’m paranoid about smells, it’s not always tidy because life and laundry so on- but mostly it is.
We do messy play and have all the toys out- it just gets put away afterwards. I think tidying up your things and cleaning them is looking after and appreciating them, the children are lucky to have nice things and should care for them.

My cousins house was always filthy and messy growing up, ashtrays over flowing etc. And their beds never had sheets on and most of their toys were all mixed up and broken. It’s actually way less appealing - I think- to play a game with a giant bucket of mixed dirty toys than a few nicely sorted things so you can see what’s what if that makes sense.

I wouldn’t judge your friends too harshly maybe they’ve had a bad few weeks in the run up to holiday and it’s all gotten on top of them? I mean I actually would judge horrendously but you can see how it happens.