Who was being unreasonable - vegetarian or host?

[neverendingflorist]

Going to try and keep this as short as possible.

Person A invited a group of people over for dinner, including person B who is a vegetarian. A didn't know B was a vegetarian at the time, but B let A know when accepting the invite. A said this was fine. A made lasagna for everyone for dinner, subbing the meat out for roasted veggies for B to make a separate dish. When dinner came round A explained to B what she had made for her and explained what it contained including parmesan cheese. B said sorry, she could not eat it as parmesan is not vegetarian. A said B should have really told her she could not eat parmesan as A thought vegetarians could eat cheese and wouldn't be expected to know these things as she hasn't cooked for vegetarians before. B said lots of things are not vegetarian that aren't just meat/fish and it would take forever to make a list of all things including which cheeses she could/couldn't eat. A thinks B has been very rude and B thinks A has been a poor host.

So who was being unreasonable? I am aware this is pretty much a non-event and should not have escalated in to a big disagreement, but I am interested on general opinions.

I'm at a loss to why B is rude? Let alone 'extremely rude'.

A being ignorant of the food they were using does not make B rude. Am i missing something? Did B throw the food at A?

As do I. That interest just doesn't extend to, um, rennet.

Yes, it's not exactly interesting if you eat meat.

I've got a bag of lettuce that doesn't say 'suitable for vegetarians'.

Whaddaya reckon?? Not suitable?

BertrandRussell

If I discovered that someone had been ill for days because they felt they couldn’t tell me they were allergic to something I had eaten I would be mortified sad

I'm probably being unfair to vegetarians here who I'm sure may well feel ill for days if they've eaten an animal product but I'd be much more likely to Google to double-check if someone had an allergy (which could be life-threatening).
However, as I've said, I have vegetarians/vegans in the family, so am reasonably up to speed.
Maybe I would Google if I had no knowledge of the subject.

If I went to someone's house and they'd taken the time to prepare food especially for my dietary requirements, and it still wasn't suitable (because I hadn't advised them of something they'd be unlikely to know about), such that I couldn't eat it, I would be mortified

Who the heck goes armed with a list of cheeses they can or can't eat though?!
"Sorry, I can't eat parmesan, you do know some hard cheeses aren't vegetarian and have animal produce in, don't you?"
"Same with gravy granules - some are vegetarian, some aren't."
Etc etc

Cue MN post - "AIBU to think this guest is a CF who does she think she is telling me what she can and can't eat, patronising cow - does she think I'm stupid?" lol

@BertrandRussell

Gah! Sorry! Looking back I misread your post. I missed the bit about your feeling bad if someone felt they couldn't tell you about their preferences.
Speed reading: not my forte, it seems.
I totally agree. I'd feel bad too.

Oh dear - I've made lasagne for vegetarians lots of times and never thought about the Parmesan.

If it doesn’t say it’s suitable for vegetarians, it isn’t.

The packaging on the fruit and veg in my kitchen don't have a label stating that they are suitable for vegetarians and neither does the bread. Does that mean that vegetarian can't eat fruit or veg or need a special variety?

Who the heck goes armed with a list of cheeses they can or can't eat though?!

Not many people, clearly.

Which means they're almost certainly being served up food they can't actually eat, since many, many, many omnivores don't have rennet on their radar. It seems even some vegetarians don't!

Still interested as to whether my bag of lettuce is suitable for vegetarians, since it doesn't explicitly say so.

Obviously the labelling applies to processed food. And yes- if bread doesn’t say suitable for vegetarians it isn’t.

@LaMarschallin

Your packaging is for Grana Padano cheese.

As I said in my pp, one of the differences between Parmesan and Grana Padano is that Grana Padano contains lysozyme but Parmesan doesn’t. So @LimeKiwi or whichever poster it is who avoids Parmesan because it contains eggs doesn’t have to!

I don’t know what the not vegetarian ingredients in bread would be, and I cannot be bothered to google. Maybe lard?

@CassianAndor
But lots of people don't know what rennet is or that it's present in some cheeses!!!FFS. YOU CAN'T CHECK FOR WHAT YOU DON'T KNOW EXISTS

This!! I HEAR YOUR SHOUTY PAIN, HOW THE FLAMIN ECK DO YOU CHECK IF YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THE FUCK RENNET IS OR YOU'VE NEVER HEARD OF IT AND THE PACKAGE DOESN'T EVEN SAY?!

(I'll stop shouting now before I give myself a headache lol)

You don’t have to know what rennet is. You just have to know it doesn’t say “suitable for vegetarians” on the packet.

I don’t know what the not vegetarian ingredients in bread would be, and I cannot be bothered to google. Maybe lard?

Or just maybe - the labelling system isn't foolproof?

As I said in my pp, one of the differences between Parmesan and Grana Padano is that Grana Padano contains lysozyme but Parmesan doesn’t. So @LimeKiwi or whichever poster it is who avoids Parmesan because it contains eggs doesn’t have to!

Oo, didn't know that. Thanks. Will keep in mind for future!

You don’t have to know what rennet is. You just have to know it doesn’t say “suitable for vegetarians” on the packet.

Oh my God!

As has been said a number of times now - that's no good to the majority of omnivores who won't check the packet, because it's not meat, and they therefore assume it's OK.

The labelling system clearly is not foolproof.

You don’t have to know what rennet is. You just have to know it doesn’t say “suitable for vegetarians” on the packet.

Loads of things don't automatically say suitable for vegetarians on the packet though.
It's not a blanket requirement for labelling.
Take bakery products etc instore. They usually have no ingredients at all on the packaging anywhere even though they'd be fine for vegetarians.

*Not rtft but ‘vegetarians’ still eat eggs even though male chicks are minced in the egg industry and male calves are removed from their mothers in the dairy industry.

Not sure how vegetarians can eat either.*

Well vegetarianism is pretty much not eating animals, so that's how.

Rennet is certainly a qualifying food and eggs aren't. I was a vegetarian but not by choice (I would have happily eaten meat if I could have got some into the house) and I find it amusing that all the vegetarians around me, who must have known about this and whose dietary principles I had to live by, were chowing down on vegetable lasagne with parmesan

So, I’m a long time vegetarian. I call myself a strict vegetarian ie no rennet, gelatine, etc. The more correct description of my vegetarianism is an ethical vegetarian but I find this more difficult to explain to others so saying strict is easier. Long story short, I’d have eaten the lasagne. The rennet has already been used, albeit in error. To not eat it would be churlish. The deed has been done and the animal won’t be undead if I refuse. It would be a waste of resources to throw it away or eat an alternative. Just as I might eat leftovers containing meat from my children’s meals if it meant not cooking another meal that day. The meat wasn’t killed for me. I haven’t contributed to the meat industry, I can live with that on my conscience

Then you’re a person who mostly eats a plant based diet. You areNOT vegetarian

FFS stop adding to the confusion.

Lesson: don't be friends with vegetarians

Yes ^^

This thread is hilarious.

t would be a waste of resources to throw it away or eat an alternative. Just as I might eat leftovers containing meat from my children’s meals if it meant not cooking another meal that day. The meat wasn’t killed for me.

(a) it was a waste of resources to cook more than you need in the first place and (b) meat isn’t killed for any individual person, not just you - you know that, right?

Obviously the labelling applies to processed food.

Yes!

Although, on past form on this thread, posters will still come back asking "humorously" if:
apples
water
pulses
grapes...

are suitable, if not explicitly labelled.

I've never come across a thread like this for wilful misunderstanding on both sides.
And intolerance.

I had no idea it was such a heated debate.

I said before that I gave my ex-veggie, newly vegan DC a Cadburys Dairy MILK Easter egg. Always used to be her favourite. I know! The clue's in the name - colour me stupid
As soon as I realised, I replaced it. She just said that she knew it would take time for non-vegans to adjust and, in the meantime her vegetarian boyfriend had benefitted.

It sounds as though from the OP's second post, a similarly civilised line was taken:

I am not A or B in this scenario, I am another guest. Just want to say that neither was actually outright rude to each other, my post might have come across that way as I was trying to keep it short. B actually was very apologetic that she could not eat it. And A certainly did not expect her to just eat it anyway. The issue came from A thinking B should have informed her of all the products she could not eat and B saying that was actually thousands of things that were not clearly meat and fish, including quite a lot of wines and beers.

that A and B both behaved perfectly politely.
A didn't expect B to just eat it (though sounds as though she may have been miffed secretly that her best "vegetarian" efforts had been turned down).
B apologised that she couldn't eat it (and may well be more upfront with omnivores in the future and maybe felt hurt that A hadn't researched more).

If some of the more militant posters here had been present it sounds as though WW3 would have erupted.

@FionasWineShow - I've got a bag of lettuce that doesn't say 'suitable for vegetarians'.

Depends. How well was it cleaned or how liberally was it sprayed? Back in the old days, prepping salad, cabbage etc required the removal (and killing) of slugs before eating. My mother always soaked the cabbage in salted water before cooking to kill off the slugs.

Although, despite being a vegetarian, I would be happy for the entire slug population to be annihilated. I'm too squeamish to do it myself though. I throw them into the woods at the back of our garden.