Who was being unreasonable - vegetarian or host?

[neverendingflorist]

Going to try and keep this as short as possible.

Person A invited a group of people over for dinner, including person B who is a vegetarian. A didn't know B was a vegetarian at the time, but B let A know when accepting the invite. A said this was fine. A made lasagna for everyone for dinner, subbing the meat out for roasted veggies for B to make a separate dish. When dinner came round A explained to B what she had made for her and explained what it contained including parmesan cheese. B said sorry, she could not eat it as parmesan is not vegetarian. A said B should have really told her she could not eat parmesan as A thought vegetarians could eat cheese and wouldn't be expected to know these things as she hasn't cooked for vegetarians before. B said lots of things are not vegetarian that aren't just meat/fish and it would take forever to make a list of all things including which cheeses she could/couldn't eat. A thinks B has been very rude and B thinks A has been a poor host.

So who was being unreasonable? I am aware this is pretty much a non-event and should not have escalated in to a big disagreement, but I am interested on general opinions.

B - I doubt many people who is not vegetarian or regularly cooks for one would think that a cheese would be unacceptable.

A should have given heads up what was being served. I'm vegetarian and no I wouldn't eat part of a cow just to be polite. I would feel sick doing so. I tend to ask if I can bring something for myself if it's a meat dinner or ask what they are making ( adding politely and nicely oo no thanks I can't eat that thanks for the offer )

I thought everyone knew some cheeses contain rennet. A should have researched the offered meal a little better, she was a poor host. It's a bit like cooking pork for somebody of Jewish faith and then blaming the Jewish person for not telling them they don't eat pork!

Yoyonomore, sorry to break it to you but if you eat meat you're not vegetarian, even if it's leftovers.

I thought everyone knew some cheeses contain rennet. A should have researched the offered meal a little better, she was a poor host. It's a bit like cooking pork for somebody of Jewish faith and then blaming the Jewish person for not telling them they don't eat pork!

If a guest said, 'btw I'm Jewish' when accepting an invitation it would probably be common knowledge that pork should be off the menu. Maybe not so with Jews and rabbits or shellfish. Or Jews and poultry-plus-red-meat in the same dish.

Not so with rennet and cheese.

A didn't know what she didn't know and most likely said to herself, 'Ah, so B is a vegetarian, which is not a vegan, so B can have cheese.'

Someone with dietary preferences or needs that might cause a hostess to put extra thought or effort into creating a meal should state exactly what they would and wouldn't eat, far enough ahead of the dinner date to make it possible for the hostess to prepare a meal they would enjoy and that the hostess would be proud to serve.

B by her misguided assumption that A could read her mind and was au fait with the ins and outs of the production of a commonly used cheese created a situation where everyone lost instead of trying to create a win-win.

Vegetarian or not, you have obligations as a guest. If your dietary needs warrant a message to your hostess and you simply will not or cannot eat whatever a hostess decides to cook, then it is up to you to not send what is in effect a coded message that you assume the hostess will understand.

Maybe you feel embarrassed to be specific about your dietary needs or maybe you have an assumption that something you know about parmesan cheese is common knowledge, but being a guest is not just about you. You should try to put yourself in the shoes of the person who will be going to some expense and working for a few hours to prepare a meal for you.

Just don’t invite a vegetarian to dinner again unles they bring there own food.

I think the vegetarian guest was rude. The host made an effort to cater for them, even though she hadn't previously known this person was a vegetarian. The guest should've asked what the host was thinking of making and clarified what she won't eat.

Most people making something for a vegetarian (especially if it's not something they do very often/ever) would fall back on some kind of cheesy dish, so she should've at least listed the main things she won't eat, eg, meat, fish, cheeses made with rennet,(please check labels), pesto and any dislikes, eg, I hate mushrooms.

Many people (some vegetarians included) wouldn't know that some cheeses aren't suitable, so it wouldn't occur to them to check the label on such products in the first place (also the same for, eg, pesto).

In the host's place, I'd have been annoyed and wouldn't be in a rush to invite that guest back.

I thought everyone knew some cheeses contain rennet. A should have researched the offered meal a little better, she was a poor host. It's a bit like cooking pork for somebody of Jewish faith and then blaming the Jewish person for not telling them they don't eat pork!

Really not comparable.

As much as it might stick in the craw of some - many, many non-vegetarians simply will not know that a). that some cheeses contain a thing called 'rennet' (they will never have heard of it), let alone b). that rennet is not suitable for vegetarians.

When most people (non-veggies) hear 'vegetarian', they think 'no meat'.

That's the simple truth.

B sounds like a vegan pain in the arse.

I used to work at a hotel and we had a vegan (with various food allergies) stay for two weeks.

She told the restaurant what she could and couldn’t eat and each night the chefs would just make her up something different. She was so happy when she left and told me she usually has trouble finding food she can eat.

B would know this and B wanted to make a drama. I would never have B over to my house again.

The host gave her Parmesan - not a dripping steak. I have various family members use being vegan as an excuse for an eating disorder. Vegans can’t eat anything containing animal products, no cakes, or chocolates or jelly babies.

Meccacos she’s not a vegan.... where have you got that from?!

Sounds like your chefs succeeded in preparing meals she could eat, and I’d hope so too as they were professional caterers. It doesn’t sound like A did succeed in preparing a meal B could eat, so why on earth would B just eat it? Your vegan customer would probably have not eaten anything she couldn’t do.

I think for everyone posting that A wasn’t to know Parmesan wasn’t vegetarian, I completely agree. I mean, in my experience it isn’t hard to read the back of a packet but she didn’t think to and that’s that.

But why on earth should B have eaten food she didn’t want to eat?! Whether it’s an allergy, a religious reason, an ethical reason, or simply food preferences, whatever. No one has to be force fed anything!! If you can’t eat something, you politely decline. Which it sounds like she did! I think the only way B is being a bit of a dick is if she easily could have taken the Parmesan layer off, and OP hasn’t said whether that was possible or not. (Entirely likely the Parmesan was in the white sauce so pretty much running through the entire meal.)

If I invited someone to dinner and they gave me an exhaustive list of everything they couldn’t eat I would find that patronising and annoying. So I don’t think B should have said ‘I’m a vegetarian and that means I can’t eat xxxxxxxx’. She told A she was a vegetarian - it was definitely then on A to do a tiny amount of research and make sure she was actually serving vegetarian food.

That said - I still don’t think this needed to be a drama or a falling out. It’s just a simple mistake. Adults should be able to laugh and be gracious about things like this.

If you’re cooking for someone with a diet different to yours, don’t you just check the packets? It’s not exactly hard.

Did you actually check the Parmesan you bought? You can get vegetarian Parmesan. The kitchen treaty recipe posted here points that out in the comments. It might have been veggie anyway - a lot of veggies avoid it because it traditionally contains rennet but if you check some restaurants have bothered to get the veggie version in.

Actually a bit shocked that most people seem to think B should have just eaten it.

No B shouldnt have provided a list of what she can and can’t eat. That would be ridiculously long and a bit patronising. A should have looked on the back of the packet to see if it was suitable for vegetarians.

The vegetarian was rude and more than a little precious. Most people have no idea how cheese is made, and from what.

She said she was vegetarian. She was given something to eat that wasn't vegetarian. She politely explained she wouldn't eat it and why. The host then berated her for not explaining in advance the myriad of things that might not be vegetarian. Tbh I think we should all be a little more aware of how are food is produced, especially when it takes such a toll on the planet.

If a guest said, 'btw I'm Jewish' when accepting an invitation it would probably be common knowledge that pork should be off the menu. Maybe not so with Jews and rabbits or shellfish. Or Jews and poultry-plus-red-meat in the same dish.

Pork gelatin is used in many dishes. Would you offer yoghurt to a Jew without checking if it had pork gelatin in it? Would you expect them to eat it if it did??

My friend once went to the trouble of making me a vegetarian meal. I had a couple of texts about ingredients (chicken stock/pesto) to see if I could eat them and for alternatives. When it came to eating the meal it was chock full of aubergine. Aubergine doesn’t really agree with me but I knew she had gone to a lot of trouble and I didn’t want to make her feel bad so I ate it and spent the rest of the next day shitting through the eye of a needle. I still haven’t told her this as the meal itself was lovely and I wouldn’t want to hurt her feelings. Change the aubergine to Parmesan and I wouldn’t have eaten it to spare anyone’s feelings. It goes against my beliefs and would have made me feel physically sick to eat it.

@Meccacos Vegans can eat cakes and chocolate so long as they’re vegan varieties.

Multiple people have referenced the almost-vegetarian lasagna being thrown away. Why on earth would it need to be thrown away? Could the omnivore hosts not just eat it the next day or freeze it?

I'm baffled that so many people on here don't know how cheese is made and that it is traditionally made with rennet from animals.

Just don’t invite a vegetarian to dinner again unles they bring there own food.

fuzzyduck1 - the 1970s called, they’re missing you!

JUST READ THE LABELS!

Yes. Because as has been pointed out, it's a lot of effort to list all the things that appear vegetarian but aren't, and to attempt to 2nd guess all the things your host might be ignorant of, and you'd still probably miss some. Whereas it's fairly easy to think "I'll make vegetarian lasagne, better just check the ingredients are all OK".

They don't have to list every single thing that isn't vegetarian though. They can just send a link to a website that list things that may not be obvious to meat eaters and point out that they normally need to check ingredients. This would put the host on notice that they need to be careful and not just assume that all they have to do is avoid meat. At the very least B could have just said that they don't eat meat and there may be a few other things such as products with gelatin and some cheese so they normally check the ingredients.

People are acting as if B was doing A a favour by going to their house but it was the other way around. The host made the effort to cook a meal and it was a different one than other people were getting. The least B could have done is to explain that there are things other than meat that vegetarians don't eat so that her time wasn't wasted.

“The least B could have done is to explain that there are things other than meat that vegetarians don't eat so that her time wasn't wasted.”

Surely it’s reasonable to assume that your host has not just time travelled from 1940, and would know to read the packet?

Moanger your friend had to ask if a vegetarian would eat chicken stock?!