Who was being unreasonable - vegetarian or host?

[neverendingflorist]

Going to try and keep this as short as possible.

Person A invited a group of people over for dinner, including person B who is a vegetarian. A didn't know B was a vegetarian at the time, but B let A know when accepting the invite. A said this was fine. A made lasagna for everyone for dinner, subbing the meat out for roasted veggies for B to make a separate dish. When dinner came round A explained to B what she had made for her and explained what it contained including parmesan cheese. B said sorry, she could not eat it as parmesan is not vegetarian. A said B should have really told her she could not eat parmesan as A thought vegetarians could eat cheese and wouldn't be expected to know these things as she hasn't cooked for vegetarians before. B said lots of things are not vegetarian that aren't just meat/fish and it would take forever to make a list of all things including which cheeses she could/couldn't eat. A thinks B has been very rude and B thinks A has been a poor host.

So who was being unreasonable? I am aware this is pretty much a non-event and should not have escalated in to a big disagreement, but I am interested on general opinions.

So it's too much effort for the vegetarian to make the host aware of the less obvious things that they can't eat but no effort for the host to spend time researching.

I would say it's exactly the same amount of effort. The host is inviting the vegetarian to dinner, and I'd say that once a guest has provided their dietary requirements it's up to the host to make something suitable. The vegetarian informed the host of their dietary requirements and presumably assumed that everything was in hand if they didn't hear anything else. There are lots of things that aren't vegetarian, and if B didn't know what A was cooking then B wouldn't have known what specific non vegetarian things to warn A about.

You're right, B could have very easily said "hey if you want to let me know what you're making/send me the recipe beforehand if you're unsure and I'll look it over and check everything's good". Similarly, A could have just as easily said "hey this is the recipe/ingredient list for the lasagne I'm making you. Is everything there good?" When I'm making food for people I have responsibility for it once they've told me of any requirements. So as the host I would check if I wasn't sure. Or, if I was a guest and the host said "it's my first time cooking for a vegetarian" I would say "let me know if you're unsure of anything because some things seem veggie but aren't!" If the host then didn't get back to me/didn't ask me about any ingredients I would assume they were good.

Dont think anyone was being unreasonable. Veggie friend can't be expected to eat non veggie cheese, but can also understand why as a non veggie host you might not realise about the cheese issue and it's annoying to spend time and effort making a dish someone won't eat.

If im having someone with special dietary requirements round i usually check that what im making is ok for them first. As B said you cant list all the non veggie friendly foods in the world to your host in advance....

llama. That’s a dish suitable for vegetarians.

parmesan to serve not IN the dish, non vegetarians can add it, vegetarians can say ‘no thank you’

hithere12. No one needs to understand or approve of her choice to be vegetarian, not vegan. That’s for her and her alone. She doesn’t eat products that are from the body of an animal, rennet is. Milk etc is not. You don’t have to agree with her decision, just respect it if you agree to make food for her.

Honestly I'd describe myself as a vegetarian and I eat Parmesan.
B was being a right twat.

I really don't think one person's ignorance makes another person rude.

It was an unfortunate situation. No unreasonableness to be found.

It's a bit bonkers there's a good few people who haven't a clue what's in the food they eat. Doesn't seen unusual though, been in restaurants where there were two 'vegetarian' options: one had parmesan and bacon, the other smoked salmon!!! I had the former It was very nice - but definitely not vegetarian!!

(I'm not vegetarian btw)

I didn’t know about the vegetarian symbol. I’m not sure that many people do. I heard about fair trade and free range.

MadamButterface:

"vegetarians don't eat animal products. rennet is an animal product. those things have always been true, so idk what you mean about 'nowadays' either. what you think 'would be nice' is neither here nor there really"

I explained in another comment that the concept of vegetarianism has changed over the years, because many vegetarians used to eat cheese and eggs, but these days they seem to be much stricter. Perhaps it's because the cruelty involved in some aspects of the farming/dairy industry has become more widespread?

Also, not sure why you took offence at my use of the word "nice"? Bit odd.

It always amazed me how many times a vegetarian at a bbq has judgementally eyed my juicy burger while stuffing the acid from a sheep’s stomach (halloumi) relishingly down their gob. Usually if you point it out it’s not vege they don’t believe you.

I've never seen a supermarket own brand halloumi that isn't vegetarian (and I always check) so maybe they don't believe you because you're wrong?

PS: I meant the information concerning cruelty has become more widespread.

There are actually fairly few cheeses widely available in the UK that still use animal rennet - which is probably why it isn't better known. If half of all cheese wasn't veggie it would come up more often.

I've been a veggie for 29 year, no meat since 1990.

B is unreasonable.

IncrediblySadToo

OK, seeing as you want to be pedantic, here's another one that very definitely has parmesan IN the recipe, but is tagged as 'vegetarian':

recipes.sainsburys.co.uk/recipes/main-courses/gluten-free-roast-vegetable-and-hazelnut-crumble

My point is, as shown by this thread, it ISN'T common knowledge that parmesan isn't vegetarian and there's all manner of information online which suggests that it IS, including recipes from respected organisations such as Sainsbury's or the BBC.

I'm a meat eater but thought it common knowledge that parmesan isn't vegetarian. Surprised by this thread tbh.

The vegetarian was rude. The host tried to accommodate her, made an easy common mistake that would not have even been classed as a mistake by many people who call themselves vegetarian. I say this as a non meat- eater. Almost all of us are very non pushy and reasonable, often ridiculously so (I've been to parties where I could eat nothing at all but made big efforts to hide this so as not to embarrass the host) so I hate to read about the rare entitled vegetarian eater.

B was being a right twat.

How does apologetically saying that you can't eat something because it is not vegetarian make you a twat

SleepAllDay7
I think it depends on your personal and family experience.
French background/ family and virtually no vegetarian experience in our immediate family, so not sure why we would know this (and DH even worked in the cheese industry for a while, LOL!)

However, a family member is intolerant to sulphites, about which I know LOTS, but I'd be surprised if many other people do...

It always amazed me how many times a vegetarian at a bbq has judgementally eyed my juicy burger while stuffing the acid from a sheep’s stomach (halloumi) relishingly down their gob. Usually if you point it out it’s not vege they don’t believe you
What bollocks cannotresist I shop in all the well known supermarket chains and can buy vegetarian halloumi (and labelled as such) in them all.
I do wonder what a “judgemental eye” cast on your burger actually looks like.

When you're doing a dinner party you have a lot to cook for and think about. Person B seems to have taken it as person A couldn't be bothered or was being deliberately lazy etc. But I think given person A cooked a separate meal that most of the general meat eating public think is vegetarian, person B shouldn't have eaten it if they didn't want to, and explained why - but to accuse person B of being a bad host is a step too far

Person A could have been gluten free, halal, kosher, carb free, sugar free, dairy free, vegetarian or vegan. No host wants to spend time cooking stuff that no one wants to wat, they made the effort even if it was a bit misplaced so to have a go at them for being a bar host seems mean spirited

I think B was unreasonable, as they should have flagged up the rennet issue in advance. It's a very easy mistake to make, and if you aren't vegetarian yourself and don't know many, it's unlikely that you'd be aware of it.

A should have double checked her ingredients, but if it simply didn't occur to her that they wouldn't be suitable, why should she?

I'd have just eaten it personally, as my host's feelings would be more important to me than the parmesan which had already been bought and would end up in the bin anyway.

I’m vegetarian.
But if I’m hosting a dinner party where someone has dietary requirements I’m not familiar with, gluten-free for example, I’d run the details of the menu past them before the meal just to be sure.
I’d have asked what she was planning on cooking, but no, I wouldn’t have eaten a non-vegetarian meal.

I don't invite vegetarians to dinner

Some vegetarians I've known over the years will eat rennet cheese and sweets containing gelatine.

Some vegetarians don't eat these foods - they are stricter.

Vegetarians are best erring on the side of caution when specifying what they do and don't eat to non veggie people. . I don't think it's unreasonable for non veggies to assume flesh free foods are ok. The host did try - she simply wasn't aware Parmesan wasn't vegetarian.

They probably should have just communicated better. A should have told B exactly what she was preparing. And B should have asked beforehand, if her needs were to specific.

I don't invite vegetarians to dinner

Fair enough. Not everyone is skilled at cooking more than the usual bland meat and two veg.

I can't believe people are saying B was rude.

All they did was very apologetically explain why they couldn't eat it.

They didn't have a go at A or demand something else.

What's rude about sticking, politely, to your beliefs?