Who was being unreasonable - vegetarian or host?

[neverendingflorist]

Going to try and keep this as short as possible.

Person A invited a group of people over for dinner, including person B who is a vegetarian. A didn't know B was a vegetarian at the time, but B let A know when accepting the invite. A said this was fine. A made lasagna for everyone for dinner, subbing the meat out for roasted veggies for B to make a separate dish. When dinner came round A explained to B what she had made for her and explained what it contained including parmesan cheese. B said sorry, she could not eat it as parmesan is not vegetarian. A said B should have really told her she could not eat parmesan as A thought vegetarians could eat cheese and wouldn't be expected to know these things as she hasn't cooked for vegetarians before. B said lots of things are not vegetarian that aren't just meat/fish and it would take forever to make a list of all things including which cheeses she could/couldn't eat. A thinks B has been very rude and B thinks A has been a poor host.

So who was being unreasonable? I am aware this is pretty much a non-event and should not have escalated in to a big disagreement, but I am interested on general opinions.

I think it is more disrespectful to animals and the environment to throw the meal away.

A is very unreasonable.
B wasn't rude she simply said the cheese has cows stomach in, it's isn't vegetarian so I can't eat it sorry.
What was she meant to do, eat it just to please her. Would you be saying the same if she was Hindu? If you don't eat it you don't.
A mistake by A and not her fault but you can't expect B to do anything other than say, sorry I don't eat that.
She's not a strict vegetarian or vegan, she's a vegetarian, she doesn't eat meat, fish or anything made with bits of them. I'm surprised people are still so unaware of what's in the food they eat.

I'm vegetarian and know about parmesan but would not expect all non-veggies to know. Equally it would not have occurred to me to mention it in advance unless the host specifically mentioned what they were cooking.

I think it's just an unfortunate co-incidence and no one is unreasonable.

B was unreasonable, massively

And how about being fucking grateful to her host. Jesus...

According to OP, B told A she was vegetarian, was served a non-vegetarian meal and said "Sorry, I can't eat that".

Which part of that is massively unreasonable?

I don’t think either of you are being unreasonable, but if you’re not sure/prepping something separate it’s often helpful to just communicate ahead. If A had said I’m going to make a veggie lasagne for you alongside a meat version then hopefully B would have said that Parmesan is not veggie. It’s an easy mistake to make. In that scenario and if B didn’t mention Parmesan then they would probably be being a little bit U

"You can't be a part time vegetarian. Either you ARE a vegetarian or you aren't! "

I'm increasingly understanding the part timers - well, according to most of MN, the fact I don't check cheese makes me not veggie.

I've got a couple of friends who will only eat ethically sourced meat but they describe themselves as veggie for catering reasons because you can't start quizzing people or work events about how the meat was sourced.

as I say, luckily I'm not in a dinner party circle and many friends are veggie or vegan, but I completely get that it's easier to say "veggie" than it is it to do anything else.

FamilyofAliens. It's mostly microbial. I have worked in the industry for 30 years.

A could have informed B of what she was intending to cook, and B would then have had the opportunity to say 'I cannot eat the parmesan', and an alternative could have been arranged ahead of time.

This is why I always offer to take my own.

B is a vegetarian that eats cheese, she should have been clear that this doesn't include Parmesan.

She’s not a vegetarian ‘who eats cheese’, she’s just a vegetarian who eats things that are vegetarian. Which Parmesan isn’t! Unless she specifically knew the host was making lasagne (in which case it might be worth mentioning cheese) why would she specifically mention not eating Parmesan?

IMO A can be mildly annoyed that B chose not to eat the lasagne when A had spent all that time making it, as it was an animal by product not actual meat and a genuine mistake. But I think A was a pretty poor host for blaming B and not just gritting her teeth when B explained she wasn’t comfortable eating it. If you agree to cook a vegetarian meal the responsibility is on you to make sure it’s vegetarian!

Theworldisfullofgs
As a matter of interest, most wine isn't vegetarian.

Thankfully lots are. Yum
It’s bad enough that I don’t smoke or take drugs and I’ve been vegan for over 30yrs. Giving up my wine would be a step too far! 😱. 😁

It’s not surprising that A would have been confused, when you have people using the label ‘vegetarian’, when they’re nothing of the sort. Eating something that contains the products that are not vegetarian, simply because someone made it for you or you can’t be arsed checking, means you’re not vegetarian. It doesn’t bother me if someone says they follow a MAINLY vegetarian diets, but calling yourself vegetarian, and not following a vegetarian diet is bullshite. People that do that create confusion amongst non vegetarians and fucks it up for the rest of us.

I think both are at fault, but the main fault lies with B, because they could easily have sent a text or online link to explain what they didn’t eat or simply ASK what was being made. TBH I always ask if I can bring a dish so that I don’t give the host extra work. I explain that I don’t want my diet causing them extra hassle. Most hosts are only too pleased to accept.

I think part of the problem is that everyone thinks they know what a vegetarian is ("they don't eat meat or fish, right?") but actually what it is is a restricted diet which, judging by many of the replies on here, varies in specifics from person to person. My own experience bears this out as well - I've known people who call themselves vegetarians who eat fish. Christ, I've eaten people who call themselves vegetarians who eat chicken! So given that there's a wide variation, as with all restrictive diets it's best for the person restricting to be as specific as possible about what they won't eat. Because every vegetarian seems to be different.

LOL not "eaten people"! "KNOWN people" that should be! Eating people is definitely not a vegetarian activity.

@HaroldsSocalledBluetits
Christ, I've eaten people who call themselves vegetarians who eat chicken

I get they're bloody annoying, but eating them's a tad harsh!

Cross posted lol

🤣🤣🤣

B should have explained that she only eats vegetarian cheese. Loads of people wouldn't know that not all cheeses are vegetarian, she should not have assumed.

I’m surprised by how many people did know how cheese is made.

I once had a person turn up for a dinner party and announce they were a vegetarian ON THE DOORSTEP! I was able to quickly russle up some pasta with veggies in a creamy cheese sauce for them, but I was cross (hid it of course, and was lovely smiling host). Fast-forward six months and the same group of people come for lunch. Obviously I remembered the veggie and catered for him, only to have him announce that he'd started dating a Texan so was now eating meat. smh.

Christ, I've eaten people who call themselves vegetarians who eat chicken

You see! You’re exactly the kind of so called part time vegetarian that gives vegetarians a bad name!

B said lots of things are not vegetarian that aren't just meat/fish and it would take forever to make a list of all things including which cheeses she could/couldn't eat.

I agree with this. She's said she's vegetarian i.e. someone who doesn't eat food which has involved killing an animal. Cheese which contains animal rennet involves killing the animal, so it's not a vegetarian product. You would hope this would be widely known but as this thread has shown, it isn't. Thing is Parmigiano-Reggiano is well-known for not being vegetarian because its production is controlled and must include animal rennet to be proper Parmigiano.

You're asking a vegetarian to eat part of an animal's stomach. In what way is that reasonable? It's on a par with people saying "oh the meat's cut up small so you won't notice it". I don't blame B for not wanting to eat it and for not wanting to list everything that's vegetarian, or not. If she'd done that she'd have seemed rude and patronising.

Lesson learned on both sides hopefully. A knows to check ingredients more thoroughly, or not cater for vegetarians. B. knows that a lot of people are ignorant about what it is they're eating. As a general guide, if you're offering hard cheese to someone it will be hardened and the hardening agent is often rennet. There is now a vegetarian rennet, but it is usually made with a product that requires the killing of an animal.

Breatlessness, I know how cheese is made

But all vegetarians I know, bar 1 (a vegan) eat cheese, quite a lot of it in fact (one even eats smoked salmon )

So vegetarian can mean many things, in real life, ime, most eat cheese

B sounds more like a vegan than a vegetarian

No, not true; as has been explained, it's about the rennet in Parmesan. Although you can get veggie-friendly Parmesan, but I'm assuming that wasn't the case here.

It sounds like just mutual misunderstanding and miscommunication. Maybe A, if she doesn't make much veggie food, could have run the lasagne idea past B, who could then have mentioned the Parmesan.

B IBU!

I would also have assumed cheeses were fine unless B said. Instead of just saying she is vegetarian and expecting A to come up with a list of well thought out questions or hours doing internet research she should have just said what she doesn’t eat

One of my vegetarian friends always argues that the rennet comes from an animal that would have been killed anyway for the flesh eating carnivores....