First Date, who pays?

[DreamsOfDownUnder]

So I'm going on a first date on Sunday evening for some food and drinks.

I'm planning on going dutch... I think?

What are people's opinion, man/woman pays/go dutch or do we pay for what we've had.. It's been a while since I've been one!

I’m afraid that his culture’s ingrained sexism would be an irrelevance to me, Monstrance. Unlikely to be a second date, either way.

Why can’t people see that payment is about dominance. Parents pay for kids and similarly men pay for women. If that isn’t good enough reason for BOTH men and women to insist on Dutch out of respect for women after all these years of being treated like a secondary class, I don’t know what is.

Go Dutch, or one pays, and the other pays for drinks. I’ve always done it that way in relationships, or taken it in turns. Unless one of us wanted to treat the other for an occasion, or because we were feeling flush, etc.
I think the whole thing about expectations of appearance become less of an issue as you get older, and more comfortable with your own self. (Or it has in my personal experience.)

That's a real shame that you can dismiss an entire culture of people over something so stupid. My husband is amazing and has never treated me any less than him.

But Helena, no one "needs" to dye their hair. The point is. If they do so, they should do it for them not some random bloke.

I know plenty of women who at grey. It doesn't make them less attractive. No one needs to dye their hair.

I do. I do it for me. If I didn't, I certainly wouldn't do it for some bloke.

Thats what i said I do it for myself.

What i was addressing was your denial of other womens economic reality.

“That's a real shame that you can dismiss an entire culture of people over something so stupid.”

Monstrance! Surely your DH knows that if he does not adhere to everything “50/50”, you will both be sent back to... the 50s!

Different cultural ideals on MN - heaven forbid!

I think that's a bit of an unfair attack, I never dismissed other woman's economic reality.

Most women can afford a box dye or a can of shaving foam. Yes if youre on the extremes and these things dont work for you, then the alternates May be more expensive. But that still doesn't mean you should do them for some random bloke if you wouldn't do them for you

Hmmm ... how the thread got so aggressive towards the end. As if some of us who lets a bloke pay are in some way stealing from those of you who don't. Then the old career/independence vs SAHM trope came up, same old woman vs. woman. Very sisterly and feminist, that.

Do what you want to do, what feels right to you, no need to justify. Say, you want to pay half, excellent. I wouldn't if I know the man earns twice as much as I do, and I don't care to impress the big Independence Panel with how well I'm doing feminism. It's my money at the end of the day, and what of it is left to pay for bills etc, and I know that "sisters" won't chip in.

I’m not ‘dismissing’ any culture, Monstrance — how could I be, when I don’t know what culture you’re talking about? I’m simply saying that cultural considerations would have no impact on my approach to paying on a date. Why would it?

Well we are on the same page there.

For me ......yes

For some random bloke.................nope.

I still don't get it ..
Most normal men are willing to pay on a first date...
Men ...about 3/4 are saying they think they should..
So if they want too, and lots of us would like them too... Who are the ones who are objecting....

*HelenaDove Fri 24-May-19 18:43:30
I think someone should actually try going with unwaxed legs on First Dates. Watch the same viewers who castigate women on there for not paying their half (cos after all women are equal now) go into meltdown and crash Twitter with their outrage at her daring to turn up ungroomed.

Oh come on! how bloody ridiculous I'm actually cringing. I've made the absolute unforgivable crime of not reading the full thread but to equate paying for oneself as daily mail cry face can't afford a leg wax is ridiculous, as is the shaving huuuurts claim

Hands up I'm one of those vilified people who think a man should pay on a first date. I am a single mum with a career and pay for everything myself. Do I think it's right how I feel? No - I do think I'm old fashioned that way. I absolutely spend ++++£ on beauty products - it's for me though? Not for any man. So for Helena (and I apologise if that's not how you meant it) to say to be an equal on date to take into consideration and woman having a hair dye and a wax - mind boggling.

Men ...about 3/4 are saying they think they should..
So if they want too, and lots of us would like them too... Who are the ones who are objecting....

Where are these figures from? I'd like to see the study that shows 75% of men think they should pay and then the study that shows they want to pay.

Men might feel pressure to pay, because of attitudes that are being expressed on here but that doesn't mean that they want to pay does it?

You’re forgetting the poor loves whose culture apparently forbids a woman from buying them a latte, Decomposing.

If a person asks you on a date, take you somewhere that has no prices on the menu, you going out when the bill comes it costs £100 each for a meal, drinks £200 in wine....who here would be willing to pay £200 for the privilege of going....

mummmy2017 Fri 24-May-19 23:43:27
If a person asks you on a date, take you somewhere that has no prices on the menu, you going out when the bill comes it costs £100 each for a meal, drinks £200 in wine....who here would be willing to pay £200 for the privilege of going....

I've admitted I'm a hypocrite - I'm a single parent who pays for everything but I'm absolutely old school in that I think a man should 'take out' a woman. Am I a leech?

Fullheadtintandtone.. 😁 I want him to pay as well.
Just wondering at what point people stop being willing to go Dutch on a date... If they were not choosing the venue...

Fullhead i was calling out the hypocrisy over it. The same people who say Equality innit when it comes to men and women being equal when it comes to paying hum a different tune when other parts of feminism are raised.

There are women who cant even afford sanpro. Its not fucking daily mail sad face. These problems actually exist.

I suppose it depends on what a date actually costs. It's not just the refreshments. The woman may well have bought a new outfit, had her hair done, been to the beauty salon etc. The man probably won't be buying a new outfit etc. If you look at the total cost of the date, and not just the refreshments, the woman could well be paying more despite not paying for the meal.

Personally, I'd find it unchivalrous if a man didn't pay on a first date unless I was aware that he earned less than me. He's under no obligation to do so obviously but it would be informative of his generosity/willingness to share etc not just financially but also emotionally.

Imagine this AIBU

"AIBU to go to a food bank because i spent the last of my Universal Credit on a leg wax"

Fullhead going by your attitude you would be the first to criticize.

If a person asks you on a date, take you somewhere that has no prices on the menu, you going out when the bill comes it costs £100 each for a meal, drinks £200 in wine....who here would be willing to pay £200 for the privilege of going..

Surely you would discuss where to go for the date? If it was a £100 per person restaurant and I couldn't afford it then I would suggest somewhere else. I would never agree to go to an expensive restaurant and expect someone else to pay.

walkingtheplank

Who has asked the woman to buy a new outfit, have her hair done, go to the beauty salon?

These are personal decisions and if people choose to do it then they need to own it.

Noone is forcing you to do these things.

What's wrong with wearing something you already own and wash your own hair?

If I buy a new outfit or have my hair done it's because I want to not because I feel compelled to do it by a man.

I agree that I wouldn't want to be surprised by having to share a £300 bill if I was going out with a friend - which is how that negotiated meal out sounds.

It sounds like a man can't surprise you, try to impress on a romantic first date as it has to be pre-planned/agreed.

Decomposing Composers - what if the man feels compelled to surprise you with a romantic date at the end of which he pays?

I think it disingenuous to think a woman isn't expect to wear something nice/make an effort with her appearance. That costs time and money. You say that's your choice - but that choice is not made in isolation. As women we know that there is an expectation that we make that effort - far more than is expected of a man (who is statistically going to be earning more than you, even if he does the same job).