To want to throw DS 18 out to give him a shock

[Comeonsun]

DS 18 has everything going for him so why is he so rude and nasty? He has a great apprenticeship- still in college for the first year and seems to be enjoying it (is sullen and won’t speak most of the time so I don’t know the real ins and out of it). He earns over 1k a month, drives a beautiful car (he pays for it) but we paid for lessons and first year insurance. He pays us £50 a month ‘rent’. That’s too much apparently- he’s disgusted that as he’s in ‘full time education’ we are taking something towards his food / elec/ gas etc.

He has a double room, huge widescreen telly (Xmas present from us) Xbox etc. Access to fridge, food, all washing done, room cleaned, ironing etc.

He so bloody rude though! Condescending attitude, would rather grunt than talk and is breathtakingly cutting and basically vile. Only ever happy if he’s having something new from us and even then the happiness lasts 5 minutes before he’s back to being a pig.

His room needs a new window and desperately needs decorating and new carpet. I’ve just passed him on the landing and said we plan to give him a few weeks notice of upheaval (we’ll need to empty his room for a few days so it will mean needing help to move furniture etc.

He’s point blank refused to have the work done and just ordered me out of his room! He says I’m wasting my money as he doesn’t want it redecorated. It’s my bloody house and it needs doing! Why should I let a room go to wrack and ruin just because he says so?

I’ve explained that if he was renting somewhere a landlord can come in and do works and that when he owns his own place he can decide if something needs doing or not.

He’s told me not to waste my breath as he’s not listening - I’ve never been so close to slapping him to be honest. I feel like chucking the cheeky, insolent sod out .

He’s upstairs now shouting away playing on the Xbox, tell me if I’m being unreasonable as I’m about to throw the swine out.

where does it say he had to go. All OP said was he made the holiday a misery. Not that he had to go.

Me extrapolating from him refusing to go this year. I do feel he's not been encouraged to grow up.

£50 rent a month sounds like the worst of all worlds. Better not to charge rent but expect the lazy sod to help around the house and be polite and a considerate family member than to charge a random £50 a month so that you both feel hard done by. You're not teaching him anything to charge him £50 a month - it's not a commercial rate, so he doesn't learn how expensive it is outside the home; you haven't got a formal contract to explain what you think your relationship now is and what he should expect for his contribution; and it's enough in his teenage mind to make him feel an unwelcome inconvenience. It's like saying he's no longer a proper member of the family, nor a normal lodger or tenant, and you are leaving him in no man's land where no-one can agree on reasonable expectations.

Time for a family meeting. He pays a meaningful amount of rent, he joins in chores, he takes care of his own washing etc from now on, he treats you with respect, or he leaves. One chance only to shape up. He’s been spoiled and needs a dose of reality now.

OP I would suggest a round the kitchen table meeting with you DH and son...there is obviously a problem here somewhere that needs to be brought out into the open...no accusations no confrontation needed ...a beer and a chat ..3 adults...His attitude stinks but there is nothing you can do about that,thats down to him but you don;t have to put up with it..I think some people have an expectation of how its going to be turning 18 and sadly for some it doesnt go as planned! In his room all the time suggests he is hiding something..could it be amassed debt you dont know about? Could he be smoking weed? Could he be struggling with expectations he has put on himself? Struggling with sexuality/ It could be any number of things...bullying in his workplace anything...so before the screaming and yelling and dramatic chucking out I would take time to explore these options...Sadly if it turns out to be non of the above then he needs to raise his game and sort out his attitude but you wont know til you talk ....I am not making excuses for poor behaviour or suggesting letting him rule the roost,it might be a phase and hopefully he will snap out of it who knows? Slow and steady will win this race though not knee jerk reactions.I would if you could engage maybe start asking his opinions..if he thinks he is an adult then involve him as one...(you dont have to do anything just use kidology)He sounds to me like he is stuck between kid/man...I wish you well in sorting it out..maybe the holiday will give you all some space to reflect....

I am back, just busy so couldn’t respond earlier.
I know it’s now high time to get him to try standing on his own two feet. Whenever I try and get him to spend time learning to cook he says he’s not interested. Apart from the meals we cook for him he will live on fast food and meal deals from Tesco. Never makes a meal, even a sandwich- he’s ratge go without it grab crisps, pepperoni and other snacks.
With regards to the dog Im ringing the dog minder today to book him in as he’s not capable of looking after him properly and it’s not fair on the dog.
Spoke to DH last night briefly when he came in from work (he was on lates) and he’s annoyed - there will be a discussion this evening as this cannot go on.
He’s having everything way too easy and not appreciating it so things have to change.

Ever since I booked it he’s refused to let me show him how to use the washing machine / dishwasher
What? 18 and can’t use the washing machine? DD is 10, she doesn’t do her own washing but sure as hell knows how to use it. She could do the dishwasher too.

Whatever we do for him it’s never enough.
Teaching him to be independent would have been enough.

Does DD know how to look after herself?

I wouldn’t take board from someone in full time education, but surely an apprenticeship isn’t FTE?

Sure, throw him out if you don’t like how you’ve raised him, that will teach him!

And as for debt, drugs etc I’m absolutely sure that’s not a problem, he’s proud of the amount he saves every month, he’s always been strongly against smoking and drugs etc. He plays football a few evenings a week, is out and about with friends etc so it’s not like he’s always in. He’s not keen on drinking, he’d rather stay sober so he can drive as his car is his pride and joy - that’s kept immaculate by the way - so is his room - he’s not messy just sullen, rude and cheeky when there’s no need to be.

If he pays a decent amount towards food I expect that will curb the takeaway habit.

DD on the other hand is 16 and can cook, and can use the dishwasher, hasn’t done the washing or ironing though but she would be willing to learn. He won’t - he’ll just walk away as he doesn’t see the point in it.
DD could be left at home now, he couldn’t!

I find the rudeness hard to deal with. It's new in our house, I'm not sure what it's about but it drives me mad. If I can bite my tongue and just laugh at him when he does it ,it sort of takes the wind out of his sails a bit and he stops. I'm hoping things will improve when he goes to uni in September although I did remind him recently that I won't be finding anyone who is rude to me!

Oh and I don't work but ds does his own washing these days after a spectacular argument about shrinking a jumper

So apart from his rudeness, and refusing to have his room redecorated what exactly has he done wrong?

He pays £50 a month, yes he could pay more but surely the amount has been agreed by you and his dad?

He doesn't do his laundry, but you're happy to do it, so I wonder if he did try would you just take over?

He's happy to buy his own food, so no need to cook for him

He saves money each month (not sure how much but he's not frittering it away)

He pays for his car, keeps his room tidy, sees his friends and works.

Perhaps he spends too long on the Xbox, but it doesn't seem to be preventing him from college and his apprenticeship so what's the harm.

I understand his rudeness isn't acceptable, but kicking him out seems like a massive over reaction.

The kicking him out was said last night on here when I was angry after his latest nastiness. In reality no, I wouldn’t kick him out. I’ve tried killing him with kindness, I hate speaking to him nastily - I’ve not brought the children up like this. He’s obviously struggling with the transition to adulthood but surely there’s no need to speak to me like I’m dirt.

So your DD sees you washing, ironing, making food and skivvying for her brother when she's there doing it for herself. This is how you teach her to let men treat her.

STOP doing FA for him. Tell him he is due more rent. Give him a month to stop being so rude, because his flatmates wouldn't put up with some bully in their house.

Tell him he needs to go somewhere else for holiday.

You have denied him the opportunity to become and functioning adult by mollycoddling him and he is resentful and angry, like a spoiled child. Tell him you are very sorry you have let him down so badly and that you are ashamed of his behaviour and have had a wake up call. Do nothing for him, nothing at all. Ask him to do things for you. When he is rude calmly say "if you wish to live like this you need to move out". You must stop fussing over him and Mollycoddling him it is terrible for older teenagers self esteem and damages their transition to adulthood.

I also agree that your DD shouldn't be doing chores when he is so lazy - why are you allowing such awful sexism in your home? I would change the wi fi password and take the fuse out of his x box!

The paying of rent seems to have given him an entitlement

It's not rent.

It's a contribution towards heating, electricity usage, phone and internet usage etc etc

It's this ^

And even if it WAS rent - any landlord has a right to update their property, carry out repairs, and importantly, evict a tenant who is causing damage (which your son is by not allowing you to maintain the standards of your home).

I assume he has no rent book? Tell him to doss with one of his mates until he finds somewhere - and I can promise you, he won't even get a bedsit for that sort of money, never mind having his washing etc done.

Please don't leave your dog with him. He will neglect it.

I think you're very unfair to leave the dog at his mercy while you're on holiday. He won't look after it. Put the poor animal in kennels, not with someone who won't feed or walk it, or make sure it has enough water.

He's a horrible little prick, and you're enabling him. Some day he'll make a wife and family very unhappy with his entitled emotional abuse.

He doesn’t want to learn washing because he doesn’t see the point

We he runs out of clean clothes because you have stopped washing them, he will see the point

I don't think kicking him out will acheive anything, OP, but I agree with the others that he should be doing his own washing/ironing/meal prep, etc. If he wants to waste money buying fast food, etc, leave him to it, but stop doing so much for him! Just stop, and make him responsible. Even my 12 year old knows that if his dirty clothes aren't in the wash basket, they don't get washed! Your boy needs to be shocked into looking after himself. Any services that you are currently paying for, like car insurance needs to stop...he needs to start paying for that himself. If he doesn't start stepping up, you help him find a place to live.

He's a horrible little prick, and you're enabling him. Some day he'll make a wife and family very unhappy with his entitled emotional abuse

And the award for the most over reaction goes to...

Tbh I hope he is embarrassed that the family pet is being sent away for a week (at a cost you) because he can't be trusted to care of it for a week.

Your DD is capable and has learned how to do things - why haven't you made this a must do for him too? He hasn't always been 18, he hasn't magically become an adult who can't or won't do anything for himself. I don't understand how it hasn't been addressed sooner.

My family do exactly this - they let the boys get away with murder by no doing any of the chores / have any day to day responsibilities and yet miraculously all the girls are totally self sufficient. I get told it's an "Irish thing" when I confront them about it but it's just a sexist thing.

You sound lovely and patient but you've done him no favours allowing him to get to this age with so few day to day life skills.

Poor doggo :( 🐶

How is it over reaction ? If a woman posted all that about a husband or partner, it would be pointed out that its emotional al abuse. Just because it's a son rather than a husband doesn't change that.

OP, he does sound very ungrateful but could it be he doesn’t understand the cost of living.

What if you drew up a household spreadsheet and show him the costs of living. Then ask him the following questions:

• Do you think you should contribute anything to the household in money or in housework? If not why not?

• Do you think we should pay for your car, WiFi, etc? If yes, why?

• At what point do you think you should be living independently? If you think we should be supporting you now, when do you think that should stop?

Give him time to think about this and suggest he asks his mates for ideas too. He might actually have a proper think and come back to you with a sensible plan.

If he comes back with “you should pay for everything forever and I won’t help out at all” then you know he’s very unreasonable. Then you should plan a timeline for his departure because you can’t sustain a non contributing able bodied household member.

But give him a chance to suggest his own plan first.

Unfortunately I think @Blondebakingmumma is bang on with this as there is such a gulf between what he does and what his sister does, it's totally damaging to both of their expectations of equality.

So your DD sees you washing, ironing, making food and skivvying for her brother when she's there doing it for herself. This is how you teach her to let men treat her