To cut my nose off to spite my face just to make a point? Work related.

[QueenofmyPrinces]

I’m feeling so torn about something that’s happening at work....

I’m a nurse and for the last 6 months I’ve been starting to implement a massive change to one of the services that we provide and it has got the potential to be something really amazing. It involves new policies being written, new care plans being created and it means giving some teaching to other members of staff and doctors - in other departments as well as my own. I’m doing it alongside my Manager but it’s my “baby” as such and implementing it and all the changes that go along with it is definitely above my pay grade. However, it’s something I’m really passionate about and so I have thrown myself into it.

A month or so ago there came an opportunity for a promotion so myself and two other nurses went for it. I was by far the most experienced and maybe I naively thought that all the work I’d been doing on the new project would earn me a step up the pay scale.

However, they gave the position to another nurse and although I really get on with him, he’s been qualified 10 years less than me, and is not particularly thought highly of by other staff in a professional capacity. As a person he’s a really nice guy, I socialise with him out of work sometimes with other colleagues and I generally have nothing against him.

I was understandably very hurt though when he got the job over me and although I know NHS interviews are points based and so he obviously said more buzz words in the interview than I did but it still feels so unfair.

My issue is that my Manager has been in touch to ask how far along I’ve gotten with implementing the new changes to the service that I’ve been working on and asking when we can meet up to discuss what my next steps are to getting the changes put into practice.

I honestly feel like telling her I’m done with it and that if I’m not deemed to be “senior staff material” then why should I be doing all this work for her benefit?

It sounds really petty I know. It just feels like I’m being taken advantage of and if there’s no reward or recognition for any of this work I’ve been doing then what’s the point?

I feel like telling her to have her newly appointed senior staff member do it because I don’t see why I should put myself out anymore (I know how childish I sound).

It’s so hard because it’s a project I’m passionate about but at the same time I just feel so angry.

My DH absolutely thinks I should tell them to shove it.

But am I cutting off my nose to spite my face by no longer doing something I’m passionate about just to make a point?

I don’t know. I feel confused and torn.

I'd take a cold hard look at whether you can use this project to move your career on in the future - possibly at another trust. I’d also look at if you could still do that but spread the work with others as it were.

Men getting promoted faster in female dominated professions is a thing – so it could be that or it could be that he played the bingo word interview better.

I also think your managers are going to take all the credit for it and would personally refuse to carry on. I also think you were probably blocked from it because they want to take the credit from you.

I just noticed that you're part time and I can imagine that might be the problem for you.
I don't know how it works in the NHS, but where I was in the public sector sexism was not an issue.

Stick with your project. It would make you even more unhappy to see someone else doing it badly, and giving you instructions and training on it which you know are not optimal.

Someone upthreead (Wittsendargh?) said something about putting your idea to the NHS Innovation team. That, or something like it, sounds like it might help you.

Can you write up a paper and get it published in a journal under your name before someone else takes your data and puts their name to it.

Men getting promoted faster in female dominated professions is a thing – so it could be that or it could be that he played the bingo word interview better.

You see a lot of male primary school head teachers but when you look at the general split of sexes in the primary teaching sector which has always seemed odd to me.

Sadly that’s how nursing interviews go. It isn’t fair. Like you said, you need all the buzz words.
I would carry on with the project but would also start looking elsewhere for a job. I would let your manager know that you are doing this.
Imagine how good your project will look on your application.

I think you are right to feel upset and unappreciated. But to walk away from a development opportunity would just work against you. It would mean you couldn’t use it as an example or reference on your CV in the future. Plus you would look petty and unprofessional.

Interviews are not the best selection tool but they are a reality. Plenty of people don’t perform in them. As a manager it is painful to see someone you know not show their potential. But it happens and there’s nothing you can do to help them in panel situation.

I advise you to learn from the experience. The key thing that sticks out is that you expected to get tested on your past experience. They had that information from your application. They would be testing other things. The job spec will have identified this.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but you sound as if you expected a more traditional interview. If that's the case, then maybe he was just better prepared than you, and did a better interview. I understand your disappointment, but the interview board esp in public service, can only follow the rules .

I d keep doing project, get honest feedback, and get interview trg.

I think if it was me, I would ask for meeting with my line manager and whoever is above them.
I would tell them, in a non accusatory way, that you were very disappointed and that you believe that the stellar work you have been putting in should have been taken into account, and that you would like to now find a way forward.
Be honest, but not defensive, and say this disappointment has taken the shine off the project you have worked so hard on, and you want to find a way to move forward whilst feeling valued for all the work you do that is above and beyond your pay grade.
Silently fuming will get you nowhere. Throwing your toys out if the pram will be momentarily satisfactory but in the end you will regret it.
You are clearly a staff member that they need to keep on board. Which gives you bargaining power.
Use it

Myself and the other woman work 25 hours a week and the man works 37.5. The job for the advert stated that a minimum of 25 hours is required for the role and so we both met that criteria.

The first 8 questions were based on the NHS and the other 4 questions were scenarios.

Some of the questions I was asked were about Personal Development Reviews, the new Student Nurse Programme, questions about risk assessments and what published papers have influenced the profession in the last ten years. There was also a question about the Care Quality Commission and public trust in the profession.

The scenarios were based on keys to the controlled drug cupboard going missing, a staff member being persistently absent, a health and safety risk on the ward and dealing with aggressive patients/families.

The presentation we had to do was current issues in the NHS and how it contributes towards the pressure within nursing.

I advise you to learn from the experience. The key thing that sticks out is that you expected to get tested on your past experience. They had that information from your application. They would be testing other things. The job spec will have identified this.

There was no application as it’s done internally - all we have to do is write a letter of interest and then we are given an interview.

My current manager has only known me for 12 months so has no idea what I’ve done throughout my career and the other manager on the panel (a manager from another ward) doesn’t know me at all.

There wasn’t a job specification, just a list of three criteria that we had to meet in order to apply. Two of these were years experience and hours worked.

I would honestly stop work on the project and send this e-mail, " I'm sorry I thought to knew that I didn't get the promotion linked to the project. I'm happy to hand over all that I have to x to continue."

I would speak to management and say 'I'm disappointed about not receiving the promotion. I have thrown myself enthusiastically into the implementation of X project because A. I passionately believe in it but B. I felt it would provide me with extra skills and experience and facilitate promotion. Who do you intend to be leading the project going forward? I feel my hard work and dedication has gone unnoticed.''

This happened to me, I was the only candidate who printed out a document, photocopied it, put together an overhead presentation at my interview, cheeky manager said how good it was, could she keep it. She then used it to implement some changes on the ward and I still didnt get the job. No feedback other than sorry, I know you're disappointed. I carried on doing my job well but didnt go over and above like I always had done, didnt take on 6 roles as a 5. They seem to like senior 5s, they are hard working, experienced, able to run the ward without having to get involved with management duties. I felt bitter and stuck it out for about a year then jacked it in and got a better job. It will look good on your c.v. and there are other jobs out there.

It's always the bloody men who get promoted. Winds me up.

How much work is remaining before project completion? I would want to finish it, get feedback on emails, then apply for jobs elsewhere.

Even if people think they're being fair, implicit bias often takes over and this does sound clearly sexist. If the role required a ft position it should have clearly been labelled as such. Otherwise, that isn't part of the criteria. And NOT asking about experience/training etc is a way to shut down the conversation that would have gained you points. In other words, the interview was skewed to exclude you before it even began. I've had this where the management clearly wanted to give the job to a man who had less qualifications, experience and success than me (Teaching jobs) so they never asked us what we'd done in the past to show our skills for the job. He was crap at the job but I'd left before he was arrested as a pedophile (and convicted) so clearly management royally screwed up there.

If you still trust your manager, ask to speak to them. Point out that as you're still doing all your regular work then you don't have the opportunity to develop this. Ask if there are any funds or time that could be given to you to focus on this. Point out that patient care could be negatively affected by you effectively trying to do two jobs at once, AND the new initiative won't receive the attention it needs. If your manager really wants this job done properly, they need to make it possible for you to do it. If they can't do that then they aren't really taking the initiative seriously.

Then - any training you do, any paperwork, any slideshows etc - PUT YOUR NAME FIRST. Make it clear that you are the lead on this. Give your email etc as the contact. Don't share electronic copies so that other people can change them and 'accidentally' put their name instead of yours. Graciously thank your manager for their support as you developed this, and embed phrases like that in training/paperwork etc so that it's almost impossible for them to change things and look like they were the lead.

And start applying for jobs all over the place - even two steps up from where you are. If you're good enough to roll out a whole new initiative, you're good enough to be a manager.

Save all the documents you do as part of this in PDF with your name on

I suspect the clincher though was the hours you work. If it's a role that requires a 'presence', then your reduced hours, would not really go in your favour.

carry on doing it, If it was me & I stopped I would be kicking myself watching other people take over my 'baby' & having no involvement

I've worked for the NHS for a long time and have seen no evidence of sexism in recruitment. What I have seen in recent years rightfully in my opinion is a shift away from staff getting promoted just because they've been there longest.

I wouldn’t do the work anymore. Tell them to pass it to the promoted guy, and don’t give him your workings so far. Let him start from scratch.

I second saving info on the project as a pdf with your name on it!

I may be wrong but isn't it all based on the interview for NHS positions. If he gave an incredible interview then he scored more so would get the job. Seen it happen too many times in the NHS before for not overly good staff to give cracking interviews and get the position over someone who would be much better