to worry about slightly chubby 4 year old DD?

[microferret]

My DD is 4 and a half, 107 cm tall and weighs 20.3 kilos. Our daycare provider flagged up her weight as a potential concern at the last meeting we had, a couple of months ago... It has been on my radar since she was about 2 though.

I'm at my wits' end... We did everything right. She was EBF until 6 months, and then we slowly introduced solids. We offer lots of veg and fruit. I made sure small amounts of sweets and treats were part of her daily intake because I wanted her to have a healthy attitude to them. She loves them, but doesn't over do it. She understands that there are limits, and accepts them. She doesn't overeat at all! She's active, she runs about a lot and rides her bike. It's baffling.

After the meeting, DH and I decided to take some action. We decided to skip carbs in the evening, so she has a dinner of protein and veg, and then some olives or a small amount of nuts if she is still hungry. But it's made no difference - she's still gaining weight at a worryingly steady rate. She has a sweet treat after daycare at about 4pm, just to make sure she doesn't feel deprived. Breakfast and lunch are normal, with carbs. The daycare staff don't feel she really eats too much, they say she eats just like the other kids do, who are all of course skinny as rakes.

I'm really at a loss at this point. It's a mystery as to why she gains weight constantly. DH and I are both slim, we eat lots of veg and model good behaviour. I wasn't a very skinny child although I was never overweight until my teens, but even I remember feeling horribly different and chunky because all the other kids were beanpoles and I was more muscular, with short legs. Even though my mum was feeding me super healthy stuff and I only ate sweets and desserts at weekends.

I just don't want her to suffer like I did. It's a quandary.. Do I take action now (and what fucking action, really, apart from starving the poor kid???) and risk screwing up her relationship with food, or do I relax and wait for the puppy fat to disappear, and risk the problem getting worse?

Has anybody experienced similar? Can you offer tips?
*if you're coming on to tell me about your kid who was fat until 2 and then became a skinny minny with a huge appetite and hollow legs please don't. It's not the same situation and isn't helpful.

Urgh! OP some of the advice you are getting here is great but some is really dangerous nonsense! Please talk to your GP and filter carefully the views of internet randoms!

Swapping a sweet for a piece of fruit is of course healthier, but if she has a banana instead of a bowl of ice cream at 80kcals she will be eating more calories than she would with the ice cream. I wouldn't cut her carbs either OP, esp if they are good carbs, it's calories and exercise and nothing else.

Your DD sounds like she just has some genetic puppy fat and is probably ready for a big growth spurt. I'd take her to the GP though to discuss concerns and be very careful about limiting her food until you do. If she is a typically active 4year old her diet sounds fine.

it's clear here why shes gaining weight, and amazing that you are oblivious to it. A scoop of ice cream daily? She doesnt need that daily at all! Some kids could eat that and not gain anything. But her genetics may not allow for it, granted.

Well first and foremost, is she actually overweight, have you calculated her bmi on the NHS calculator?

What are her portion sizes like? Do you use a small child sized plastic plate for her meals? I always go with the notion that I'd put a small portion out, and if they're still hungry they can have some more.

I don't see why she needs a sweet treat every day. Personally I think you're taking the wrong approach. I don't think it's good to make a habit of having a sweet treat after nursery/school. Even if it's not many calories, it's a bad habit. Why can't an after school treat be some cheese and crackers, carrots and hummus, a piece of fruit, a boiled egg, a couple of breadsticks.

We're all different shapes and sizes, some people are naturally chubbier and bigger built but ultimately you won't become very overweight unless you're consuming too many calories or have a medical condition.

however, speaking as a mum of a boy and a girl, I am still fascinated by how little my daughter needs to eat compared to my son. Girls really don't eat a lot

Come and tell my daughters that please

What is she eating for breakfast, lunch and dinner?

A sweet treat everyday?! Nuts and olives are also high in fat, so while good for us portions should be very small.

My son is almost four, we have our sweet treat at the weekend when we have home made banana pancakes in bed.

Maybe post a typical daily menu, then people could suggest small tweaks.

Maybe post a typical daily menu, then people could suggest small tweaks.

I was going to say this too.
I’d re start carbs at tea time and swap the daily ice cream for a less sugary yoghurt. Watch portion size too.

I think you’ll get all sorts of sound advice on here but you need to see the doctor to ensure you get specific advice tailored to your child. I don’t think cutting out food groups is advised for little ones. I am strict on sugar and treats (not daily) but even I don’t think that a scoop of ice cream can possibly be the issue. Mine both have a larger frame than me and a propensity to put on weight. I don’t buy into that puppy fat thing - any fat is simply too many calories and not enough moving (family of doctors here who agree). It can be difficult to work out correct meal portion sizes when they are good eaters. When mine start to look a little weightier I simply increase veg proportion on plate and decrease the rest. So a bit less pasta, chicken, potatoes etc, and more veg. Possibly from a third veg to half of the plate. Two types each sitting for variety (broccoli and carrots, peas and sweet corn etc). If they stuff themselves on veg, all good. But when they are full they may stop if the excess food is veg. Works with mine although great side effect is that they eat significantly more veg. Most kids I know have so little veg that they need more other food groups to compensate. Up it and it might fill her up with fewer calories.

And cut out snacks. Fruit only. If your portions are ok, kids really don’t need 45 snacks a day. Kids aren’t allowed to feel hungry these days because we stuff them full constantly. They get used to grazing constantly. Break the habit.

20kg at 4 puts her at the very top end of the charts- dd is almost 7 and weighs 19.5 kg for context. If she is overweight, and for children it is difficult to assess, she may just be big for her age (but 107 cm and 20kg sounds big) then the first thing you need to do is make a dr.s appt. Do not change her diet until you have seen a dr. Weight is controlled by how many calories are consumed v how many are used. If the dr. does say overweight, whatever you are feedding is too much, reduce it. But don't take anyone elses advice other than a qualified medical person. Each child is different, and that may be the correct weight for your child.

"however, speaking as a mum of a boy and a girl, I am still fascinated by how little my daughter needs to eat compared to my son. Girls really don't eat a lot"

Come and tell my daughters that please grin

I know it is a massive generalisation, and there are rake like girls who eat like horses, but from years of playdates, parties etc the boys tend to eat me out of house and home and the girls often leave some food on the plate.

Hi OP,
Don’t let anyone’s comments make you feel bad - everyone is different and everyone’s kids are different. Some kids are not that into food - some seek it out with a passion early on.

Here is what works for us (but I know we are lucky because our son has an off switch when he is full)

I try to make sure his dinner looks like a child’s dinner. I assess it in my mind and if it looks like an adult dinner i know it is wrong. Sometimes my son will say he’s full but 10 minutes later complain he’s hungry (he’s 9). If we have dished up the right size dinner for him I’ll tell him that and ask him to try to eat it please. If I know we have dished up too much then I’ll say “that’s fine you don’t have to eat anymore” (but he sits at the table until we’ve finished too). We are trying not to pass on our own overeating/finish everything on plate even if uncomfortably full.

I gather school dinners are tiny - but actually designed to be the correct amount of calories for a child’s meal - so I guess that’s a reality check for us all.

Keep drinks to water and sugar free squash as much as possible. I think one carton of juice has about a days sugar allowance for a child. My son does have roughly one a day (naughtily) but if he was gaining weight it would be one of the first things to go (swapped for tangerines for vit c).

Kids need dairy so a yogurt or fromage frais would be a good pud. I mentally run through what dairy my son has had (he tends to leave the milk behind if he has cereal) but if he’s had toast, non dairy school dinner and non dairy dinner at home I am concerned enough to insist he has a yogurt or a hot chocolate with milk for his pudding. He won’t drink a cup of milk I wish he would. Some studies have suggested that people that have dairy are slimmer than people that don’t (obviously kids need it for their bone health)

Sometimes his ‘pudding’ is hours after his dinner - it’s still his pudding. If he’s had dinner and pudding and say’s he is hungry it’s real food that is offered (toast/sandwich etc) at which point he usually isn’t bothered as he actually just wanted more treats.

I have been surprised at portions I have seen of treat foods for kids sometimes (in families I mean not restaurants where you know they will be big). Ice cream for him is probably two scoops (older than you dd), biscuit portion =2, a big treat would be a packet of fruit pastilles. Sometimes I have seen big cereal bowls loaded with ice cream/five biscuits ....)

I agree don’t cut carbs. Remind yourself of guidance for a kids meal size and balanced plate of nutrients and aim for this instead.

They also don’t need to eat/drink (anything other than water/sugar free squash) too frequently/ all the time. Eating too frequently is no good for young teeth.

I’m not suggesting you do/don’t do any of these things. Just ideas if they are of any use. I’m sure if you provide a healthy lifestyle with small treats in moderation your daughter will grow into a healthy active child.

If you look on a growth chart she isn't overweight? She's between 75 and 91st centile for height and just one up between 91 and 98th for weight. A gap of up to 2 centiles is normal, certainly one centile as she has, to account for different body types. I think your day care provider is being very unhelpful in this scenario. She's fine at that height and weight!

I know it is a massive generalisation, and there are rake like girls who eat like horses, but from years of playdates, parties etc the boys tend to eat me out of house and home and the girls often leave some food on the plate

Huge generalisation. But it is also a consequence of stereotyping- girls are often praised or remarked upon if they don’t eat much, where boys get positive comments for eating a lot “growing big and strong”.

Plus boys are encouraged to run around and engage in physical play, girls socialised to sit and interact or play less robustly.

Boys have less judgement on body size and what they eat generally.

Lots of food/diet obsessives on here so take advice with a pinch of salt.

From the stats you give your daughter sounds like she is just inside the normal weight range but at this age BMI calculations are extremely sensitive to correct height and weight measurements.

So talk to your GP. Children who eat a reasonably healthy diet, are served appropriate portions, are active and have normal-weight parents are at a lower risk of long-term weight problems. An unnecessary focus on weight is more likely to lead to long-term problems than to prevent them.

People have different builds. I'm like you - not very tall, short legs, sturdy build. I weigh more for my size than many people. Maybe your daughter is like that too. You can't change her body type so it's far more important to work on her self-esteem than to try to make her conform to the "norm".

She is 4. She is probably about to have a huge growth spurt and kids bulk up for a few months before them. I can tell my son is about to have one as his face goes really chubby, his ears suddenly look massive then he shoots up another inch. He's not even 2 yet and in is 3/4 clothes and some 4/5 🤷. All kids are different.

Also please ignore the silly advice here. Ask your GP for a paediatric dietician referral and get some professional advice.

Just dropping in to say we're out and about, I haven't buggered off! Will read through and respond in a couple of hours. Thanks for all the replies so far, even the sniffy ones lol

My children have healthy meals but also rather a lot of less healthy snacks.
We do a tonnes of exercise though which balances this.
Not quite enough exercise might be your issue as it’s much harder for children to go out to play than in the past.

We do the following weekly:

At school
swimming with school year round and a PE lesson. Plus 1 night at after school club where they might play dodge ball.

Out of school:
3 nights in the park for 40 minutes straight after school. We go religiously and it’s the same 10-15 families who also do this.
1 hour football
1 hour gymnastics
30 minutes tennis
30 minutes swimming
30 minutes drumming (must burn a few calories!)
Plus running around at Beavers/cubs.

Gilbert1A ... a 4 year old should have full fat milk

Not true.

From the NHS website: "Semi-skimmed milk can be introduced from the age of 2, provided your child is a good eater and growing well for their age"

I don’t think 1 scoop of ice cream or a couple of sweets per day is what’s making your child overweight!

Most kids I know have a biscuit or a few crisps or a bit of cake everyday and are slim, mine included.

I’m aware I’ve just admitted to a huge no no on Mumsnet so I await people telling me I’m ruining my child’s health 🤷🏻‍♀️ But they get plenty of excercide, eat well otherwise, are slim and stop when they’re full

@raviolidreaming "can"... Doesn't mean 'should'. Everyone should be having blue milk. Red is basically sugar water and green isn't much better. Blue milk has enough fat in it (and more nutrients) for the vitamins and minerals to be soluable and absorbed.

Low fat diets are HORRIFIC anyone, especially children, and their gut health, bone health and overall wellbeing.

The NHS guidelines are due a massive overhaul as the shitty national advice is what has pushed the obesity crisis in the first place. Low fat = high sugar and it's just fucking dangerous. There's still a lot of ignorance ingrained from the low fat fad of the 90's. Fat IS NOT bad ffs.

Blimey all this hand wringing about the kid having a scoop of ice cream or a couple of sweets daily. My kids had a sweet treat or pudding after a meal everyday and the only time any of them got a tiny bit podgy was right before a growth spurt. Obviously I haven't seen your DD's portion sizes OP but maybe you could cut them down slightly rather than cutting out the evening meals carbs,and make this meal slightly later so that she's not needing the evening snack. Now the weather's getting nicer let her ride her bike to the park and get a good run around there daily (weather permitting). Take her to swimming lessons and enjoy the free swim after with her. Enrol her in gymnastics,dance,martial arts,football,anything to get her moving, and let her lose the weight by having fun rather than by deprivation. Oh and drinks should be water only with maybe a small glass of semi skimmed milk before bed. If all else fails speak to your doctor,though I would be wary of discussing her weight in front of her. Good luck.

So, to clarify a few things...

1. ice cream: this is a bit hard to avoid in the warmer months. there's an ice cream shop right next door to the kita, so from spring onwards all the kids go there right after they get picked up. it's a social thing, so hard to avoid. They do a thing called a "kinderkugel" (kids' scoop) which is extra small. None of the other parents at the kita seem to think an ice a day is a big deal, so it has never struck me as being something that's terribly bad. Maybe it's a cultural thing - we live in Germany, perhaps things are different here.

2. olives aren't high calorie! about 5 olives (the usual portion we give) is about 30 cals and they have loads of good fats and minerals. Salt is an issue I guess so I could start soaking them beforehand instead. The nuts we give are unsalted and unroasted, and again, just a tiny handful. I want to give exciting foods in the evening that have loads of good fats and nutrition so that she feels sated and isn't just getting empty calories.

3. I'm not cutting out carbs all day, just from about 5 onwards (even then she is still getting carbs in the form of veg or beans, just no refined carbs). She goes to bed at 7:30pm, this doesn't feel excessive to me? She has plenty of carbs for breakfast and lunch. That said she's still gaining weight with this system so perhaps we should drop it.. I feel like it has at least been beneficial in getting her to eat more veg tho

4. re. exercise - we ride her bike to and from kita every day. After kita we often go to the playground for at least an hour. Even after that she thunders about up and down the corridor in our house constantly, or leaps about on the sofas. On weekends we go swimming or on some sort of day trip, we're pretty active. She has loads of energy.

5. the paediatrician tells me not to worry every time he sees her, and I do try not to, I just don't want to sleepwalk into disaster. My dad is a retired GP and he says she's perfect (tho he's probably biased). Tbh I probably wouldn't be freaking out so much if the daycare assistant hadn't spooked me about it.

6. we don't drink a lot of juice and we never have fizzy drinks in the house except fizzy water. She has a lot of plain water and sometimes drinks non-dairy milks.

I think I'm starting to come to terms with the fact that it's just her genetic destiny, as it was mine, to be a bit chunkier than her peers as a child. As I'm now very content with my body I probably just need to keep a cool head and teach her the things I've learned as she gets older without trying to control things too much. My mum was a mega control freak and it absolutely messed me up as a child and teen. I should just chill probably.