To wonder what the hell is going on with FIL and food?

[Moodyfoodie]

Have NC'd.
Would appreciate some perspective as starting to feel I am going a bit crazy. So visiting IL's (go to visit a few times a year, with DH and 2 small DC). So as.not to drip feed, FIL and I have clashed in personality pretty much since I met DH. He is an old fashioned, women should be seen and not heard type, I was an independent career woman when I met DH.
Anyway for the past couple of years we have all got along ok, for the sake of DC. No major issues and tolerated each other I would say.
So the past couple of times we've visited, IL have made a big meal for our family and BIL and SIL. I've noticed FIL will never offer me a drink, he will pointedly ask.SIL and BIL but not me. They'll serve a small portion of food and then if there's any leftovers, twice now FIL has made a huge point of actually standing up and asking SIL and BIL if they would like more, or just putting it on their plates, whilst completely ignoring myself and DH.

Last night we got a takeaway. I ordered a dish and we generally share everything. I put a small amount on my plate and thought I'll go back in a minute. At this point BIL gets a call from SIL and decides to go home. Said our goodbyes and that was that. Goes into the kitchen to find that FIL has given entire takeaway to BIL and SIL. So nothing left. Didn't bother asking myself and DH if we'd finished. I am not greedy but we'd had a small.plate each.

For context when they visit us I'll make them meals from scratch and offer drinks etc. as I think it's the polite thing to do if you've got guests.

They're cooking tonight and I'm honestly considering going to the local Mcdonalds, rather than sit there whilst FIL makes a big point of pointedly offering food and drink to everyone else. DH says he just 'doesn't think' but I feel like there is more to it. He's begging me not to go as it will cause an atmosphere but I feel FIL is doing that anyway, I feel quite unwelcome.

Understand this might sound petty and there.are bigger problems.in the world but really would appreciate some perspective.

You have a DH problem.

None of this will change until he grows a spine. I suggest counselling for him as it will be really hard for him to unravel a lifetime of this dysfunctional shite.

I would refuse to see PILS or allow your precious DC anywhere near them.

What a horrible man. And your other half should say something about being so rude to you.
My partner is quite shy but he did complain that his Mum used to give me three chips for dinner! She is just a terrible cook though.

God Moody, many sympathies.
I had this sort of treatment from my MIL all the time I knew her ( I wasn’t good enough for son, ( fuck knows why) women’s size portions ( ie fuck all) men offered a drink etc for bloody years.
It is really really hard to rock the boat without looking like an utter dick ( part of their plan I am sure)
Eventually DH slowly saw through her awful behaviour towards me ( there was much more) and we went very low contact for about ten years. Towards the end of her life I encouraged him to go and see her ( mostly to preserve his state of mind) and she went straight back to her old awful ways. I cannot say I miss her at all.

If he drinks a bottle of wine a night then he’s the alcoholic!

As you are leaving OP lean in for a kiss with FIL and whisper ...thank you for a lovely evening,,,we will be back next week to go through the same hell again of playing happy families.your hospitality again has left me underwhelmed as expect ,,goodnight see you soon with a smile and cheery wave....you will frighten the life out of him! do it though so no one else can hear...ever so quietly ...and yes I did this to my FIL...he never messed with me again and the turn about was remarkable...he is always respectful now whether he means it or not is a different matter but I dont care either way...he does now behave.,There was no way I was going to let him treat me like rubbish,or like he treated others,he was nothing to me and to my knowledge he has never ever told anyone what I said to him...if he did I would deny it and ask him if he imagined it!

My fil was like this with me too exactly like this! I totally lost my shit one one and drove down to his house an had it out with him I mean I totally lost it I shouted alot told him a few home truths an now he is much much better with me he again doesn't expect women to have a say and I wa a ever good enough in his eyes even tho I work (nurse) an my husband is a stay at home dad I proved everything but in my fil eyes I wasn't good enough he always compared me to my hubby's ex intact he still does but r relationship is at least much better between us

Go with the bright and breezy PA 'oh yes please, thought you'd never offer' with a huge smile on your face when someone else is offered more. Gives him two choices, either top you up or have to outright state that he didn't offer, showing him up for the rude twat that he is.

He sounds so much like my FIL! He’s incredibly sexist and very much likes women in their place, he’d literally walk out the room whenever I talked about my work. Anyway SIL is very quiet and very much a carer of BIL. FIL goes out of his way to be overly nice to SIL whilst ignoring me, even on the day after our wedding. He does similar things with food too. So bloody weird.

I think it's difficult if the OP's partner is an abused child. (The abuse may be emotional rather than physical or sexual.) As a child one is programmed to long for the approval of one's parents and to be scared of their disapproval. One wants to keep trying to win that approval - it's what one wants more than anything else. It really isn't easy to stop when one is grown up. Especially if giving up the game means - effectively - not just distancing oneself from one parent, but losing both.

Obviously an adult male has got responsibilities towards his partner and to taking care of his own children. But it really isn't easy for the child buried inside the adult male to do these things - because as soon as he's back with his parents, he'll regress again.

I'm not saying that the original poster should accept - or tolerate - this situation. I think it's more about acknowledging the gravity of the harm that's been done, and the difficulty of solving the problems of a dysfunctional family.

Wow heythere, exactly the same dynamic. Always remember on my wedding day, he walked in, didn't even say I looked nice. Wouldn't expect that, really but he actually didn't say a word to me!!!

Fast forward to BILs wedding and he made a point of coming up to me to tell me how GORGEOUS SIL looked. I agreed with him, she did! But he didn't like my agreement so he went on about how she also had such a lovely personality too. As she doesn't speak much, I wouldn't know!

Honestly, it almost makes me laugh. Almost.

@Moodyfoodie, you say "I honestly don't know what to do." That's because we expect people to behave normally, and your husband's family just don't.

Have a google on FOG - Fear, Obligation, Guilt. Theres a lot of information out there about this, it's basically the effect shit parents like your FIL have on their children, and the emotional issues it creates for those children. I am not going to slag off your husband, because this is the childhood he was subjected to, and you have seen at first hand how that now-adult-child is still affected. But the more you understand about this unhealthy dynamic, the better you will be able to help your husband.

I would probably be going low-contact with them, possibly with a view to no-contact in the future.

Whatever you choose to do, just remember - 'If you do what you've always done, you'll get what you've always got'. Unless you start making some changes on how you/DH/DC interact with DH's family, you're stuck with how it is now, because FIL sure as hell won't change. He likes it just fine as it is.

Good luck.

Go home. Don’t see them again for several months.
Use the money you save on petrol for some counselling for your husband.

Moodyfoodie
it did get better. I encourage my husband to phone him and visit him and my children to thank him for his (still generous) birthday and Christmas gifts, but I no longer feel beholden to him. Since writing I’ve thought a lot about the dynamics of DH family and realise the bullying my MIL and SIL (DH sister) received was insidious and since MIL’s death she has gone LC too. My relationship with FIL has improved over time and when we see each other it’s much less ‘charged’ than it used to be. What I’ve sadly come to realise is, that my DH has many of my FIL’s traits and recently when I’ve stated to refuse to accept comments or behaviours I’m the one called out by my teenage DC for causing an atmosphere and until considering your post I was starting to question myself. But what I don’t doubt is I have DD’s who won’t put up with any blatant sexist behaviour, but I think I need to now teach them about the more subtle dynamics too. Time to pull on my big girl pants again and take a deep breath! Good luck OP

so he went on about how she also had such a lovely personality too. As she doesn't speak much, I wouldn't know!

quiete people can and do have lovely personalities too! you don't just show your personality by talking (much). not sure what your point is (you pointed out several times that SIL isn't very talkative - well, so what). maybe your self perception is skewed too?

Wow hes rude OP. If I had food on the go I'd offer everyone even if it meant us having smaller portions it's just good manners, if I'd invited bil and sil in law over for tea and you and your dh had turned up I would of offerd you both some. If there wasn't enough to go round I'd explain it but I'd happily make youa cuppa and a sandwich.

I wouldn't cause a scene at the house, there would simply be no point. Addressing his bullying by brining your own food or asking for more food directly won't work as no one round that table has your back. They will all stay silent and not help defend you and they are all enabling his bullying of you. People like that are cowards and won't change.

If I were you, I'd never visit again. Your dh can go but not your dc as he is a disgusting 'role model' and you don't want your dc picking up any behaviours from fil thinking they are normal.

quiete people can and do have lovely personalities too! you don't just show your personality by talking (much). not sure what your point is (you pointed out several times that SIL isn't very talkative - well, so what). maybe your self perception is skewed too?

When I said she doesn't speak, she doesn't. She isn't quiet, that's different. She literally does not speak, just yes and no answers, so I wouldn't know about her true personality. Nor would FIL.
My point with this is that FIL will go on and on about how wonderful she is, in front of me, when he doesn't have much interaction with her.
BIL talks a lot about what she does for him, housework, running him baths etc, it's all we hear about. I guess FIL is basing the personality stuff on that.

What do you think will do? How can you take care of yourself better in the absence of help from others?

I have no real advice for the competition he's attempting to create between yourself and SIL, but in regards to the food hogging, you really just have to stick up for yourself in the politest possible way - "I'll have a little more, seeing as there seems to be some going, thanks". After years of saying nothing in response to the IL's penis portions (DH would receive a mountain of food, I'd get two small roast potatoes and a single slice of meat) I had to start doing this when I was breastfeeding and physically needed more to eat at dinner. It was also while I was BFing that a birthday was being celebrated and after FIL filled everyone's glasses with Champagne, he asked me, "What would you like, a cup of tea or a glass of water?" I very politely but firmly said, "I'll have a glass of the Champagne too, thanks." Lots of tutting and looks between the ILs that I was asking for something GASP alcoholic while looking after the precious grandchild but then they don't try any of this crap anymore now.

He’s very rude and passive-aggressive. We had similar behaviour from a relative and had to go NC in the end. The things they did were so subtle that the rest of DH’s family said I was overreacting or that the person had not meant anything by their behaviour. It took years for DH to finally realise for himself what was going on.

I actually think if he is looking for a fight, you have been doing brilliantly ignoring it. That will be driving him mad, but if he escalates things that will also make him look mad. So if you just treat it like a charming eccentricity (and eat well before you go) and just keep on bringing ‘normal contributions’, paying sometimes etc then you are irreproachable. What he wants is for you to cause a fuss, because he knows this will make his family anxious and they will blame you as they have been trained to do.

What a nightmare. Are you going to avoid going back?

I was struck by your comment that your DH gets physically upset by the thought of upsetting him. And yet you want this person in your DC's life? I wouldn't. Your poor DH needs counselling and you all need to back away from FIL.

I agree with Eva he is looking for a fight and everyone else is so gaslighted that if there is one, you’ll be in the ‘wrong’.

I agree, My, but it's making him see it that's the problem. He's upset but the thought of me rocking the boat with FIL and blames me for not seeing that FIL just 'doesn't think'.

It's so ingrained. I think my parents are lovely but I've pointed out that they have faults, I do, we all do. With FIL however he will not admit that he has faults at all.

I am at a loss. Perhaps this is just a massive DH problem but I am trapped. If I even hint about splitting he again becomes extremely emotional and I feel sick with guilt.

I would like to go LC, just me. As far as I can see FIL is mostly loving to the DGC but I am nervous about not being there to police his behaviour with them because they are little and won't be able to articulate to me how he's been.