AIBU to think his ex-wife-son are taking us for too much

[Shesonlyworth30]

Long time lurker, first time poster. It’s a long one so apologies in advance.

Been with my DF for almost 7 years, have a 3 (almost 4) yr old and getting married in the summer.

DF was married before (to C - she was also married before and had 2 other sons (both older) and has one son with DF (16 this year) who lives with C in Scotland. DF has never not paid for his son, he even chose to have it deducted straight from wages when CSA were in charge. He didn’t trust C and wanted there to be a proper paper trail if ever she decided to say she never received anything. Since we have been together the payments have been just shy of £200. I have never had a problem with him paying for his son.

C has never let DF speak to son or see him since he was 3. She tried to kill herself a few times (once when pregnant and once when son was born) so DF took parental responsibility for her 2 older sons and their own while she was sectioned. They split up when son was 3 and she told a court it would be detrimental to her mental health to allow DF custody and access. Court agreed. (DF living in north of England at this point and C in Scotland)

Fast forward to last year. CMS took over from CSA and they re-assesses him and told him his payments would need to be £500 a month. We argued that this was a massive increase. They said it was because of what he earned. However they were taking overtime into account which we said was wrong. His overtime was not guaranteed and he did that to pay for our wedding/holidays etc. They said they were right. He went to court and while the judge was sympathetic said there was nothing they could do. He even tried showing them that if he had a basic month, with no overtime, paid the mortgage (a not unreasonable £660) gas, elec etc he physically would not have enough to pay the CMS. They didn’t care. They don’t take household expenses into account. He then said he had another child to support (ours) they said they had allowed £30 pcm for her. £30 bloody quid. That’s not even a day in nursery.

Because C doesn’t want him to know where she is she wants everything doing through the CMS so he has to pay their admin charge (extra £83 pm) and now we are in a vicious cycle. He worked more OT last year to pay her and still have money for our savings but because he earned more he now has to pay more this year £634 pcm!!!!

I’m fed up with it. My daughter doesn’t have £634 a month spent on her from her dad. I expected his payments to go up but AIBU to think this is grossly unfair and there is a fundamental flaw in this thinking. Surely if CMS believe 2 children should cost £664 then that money should be split between the 2?

His son can leave school at any time now but we know she won’t tell us so this could be ongoing for another 4 years because there isn’t a doubt in my mind she’ll make son stay at school if she’s getting £550 odd quid a month. Oh and she’s back with her first husband!! 🤬🤬

I can tell you for free at 16 I didn't need £600 worth of upkeep

So you lived for free, did you? It didn't cost your parents any money in rent, bills and food to keep you? You didn't need a bed, sheets, furniture, clothes, toiletries, school uniform?

Why should be pay less because he’s chosen to have more children? The first one doesn’t suddenly need less money because he has another.
He’s made zero effort to see this child for 13 years? I wouldn’t be marrying him.

And yes. You’re being disablist.

Why hasn't he seen his son since he was three years old?

Has he tried to get access to his son? If not why not. If she’s as “mad” as you claim why isn’t he allowed access?

Of course your daughter has that much spent on her. If he is earning £32k a year and finds it hard to spare £600, it's because the rest of his money is going on the life that you (and your child) have together! Mortgage, food, clothing, shoes, clubs and activities, holidays, bills, school uniform, child care... of course he's spending that on raising her.

Surely he cares about his son and wants to support him too?

His earnings went up so the child maintenance went up. That isn't particularly unusual, nor should it be. He can cancel the overtime and have the maintenance reduced but you'd be losing out on the increase too.

You need to take her totally out of the equation. Where she gets her money and who she is in a relationship are totally irrelevant. Your DP pays maintenance as a percentage of his earnings for his child.

All these people disputing the £600 upkeep... so for each of you that has three kids you set aside £1800 a month for their upkeep? Correct?
Wrong. Economies of scale. The woman lives for a certain amount, the actual cost of the child additionally to that is not much.

He’s bringing home around 2k a month without over time. After tax.

So he’s spending 1400 a month on keeping you and him and your DD. Plus what your income is goes to that too.

And up to a year ago, despite his wages having gone up, he was paying £6.66 a day to keep his son.

He should be kissing her feet with gratitude that she raised his son alone for 13 years.

How much she earns (you sound angry that she's disabled and claims benefits for that - why?) has no impact on how much he pays. She could win the Euromillions and would still have to pay £600 because it's based on HIS earnings. Stop moaning and hope he doesn't run out on you as well.

You know NOTHING about the ex so stop pretending you do.
Constantly stating she is on benefits will not make mn side with you.

I dont care what money she has end of the day your dear fiance needs to pay his share of his childs upkeep.

Stop fighting his battles and looking for sympathy.
CSA was all well and good when he wanted to use them but now it is no l9nger in his favour....

Also why should his 1st not benefit from his overtime? You and child number 2 will so why shouldn't child number 1 also enjoy the extra?

OP, I have been in your situation when I was married to someone who had 3 other children, it is frustrating, I saw the step children go on holidays abroad whilst I had to clothe my kids in 2nd hand clothes and struggle to feed them. I am now in the position where I am a single parent and their father pays very little towards them. I have 2 teens and no way does it cost me £600 a month to keep each of them but it does cost me more than the £140 their dad gives me each month.

People are being harsh, I can see it from both sides.

I think all you can do is continue the way you are, there is a light at the end of the tunnel because once his son is 18 he will not have to pay anything.

The only ‘fundamental flaw’ in the system is the fact that so many parents get away with paying nothing at all for years and years.

Your step child has access to 15% (slightly less on the new system, I think) of your partner’s income. Your child together has access to the remaining 85%. You also are able to work to make a contribution to your household,

He asked to pay direct to her. She refused

This is not how the system works. A quick read of their information leaflets would tell you that. If he isn’t allowed to pay directly it will be because he has a long history of non-payment.

What legal action has he taken to see his son? None?

He was married to her. He knows she has been playing the system for years. Her bro and SIL know the same. One of the reasons they don’t want to have anything to do with her

And YES you could ask the CSA to deduct straight from earnings and no there was never an investigation. He didn’t trust her. There was a nominal cost for this. The CMS are charging £83 a month for the privilege. And if 1 parent refuses bank transfer it needs to go through them hence the admin charge. She refused. Not us.

Yes holidays are a luxury but as I have mentioned he works 2 extra nights a week (nights away from our daughter) and a day at weekend to pay for these.
Yes I know I chose the job, but I was thinking long term and it does leave me about £450 a month short

He has filled in any paperwork correctly when it has come out they re-assesses every year as part of CSA and kept it what it was. CMS have chosen this amount. And while £434 might not be a lot to some of you I implore you to find it at the drop of a hat one month and then for the 12 months.

He has appealed. He went to court. Judge said nothing they could do.

I have to say am flabbergasted at the comments on here. I have said he should pay for his son, of course he should. He always has and of course he will continue to. In my eyes it just seems unfair that time that takes him away from our family to earn is then split, in my eyes, unequally between his children.

As far as access goes, she moved to Scotland and didn’t tell him where she was. His son was 3 when he left and he didn’t want to cause lots of upset for him when he thought about access again his son was clearly older but wouldn’t have known DF from Adam and logistically wouldn’t have had easy access. Of course he could have made the time but the nature of his job is being on call (and at the time was 2 weeks on call, 2 weeks off call) and working all over the country. He also didn’t want to have to cancel/change plans last min and give her any more ammo.

On another note how do women not see a huge red flag when they meet a man and find out that
a. He had a child he never sees, and
B. He's all too ready to slag off his ex, and she falls for every word he says despite never meeting the ex.

I mean it's mightily convenient that the ex is the bad guy here isn't it 🧐 if she's so incredibly awful I don't understand why he was with her and had a child 🤷‍♀️

He has 50% responsibility for his child with his ex that is being rightly enforced

Yeah exactly...so do you think his ex is spending £634 as well every month. I can tell you, I've never ever spent £1268 a month on my child. OP there's something badly wrong with the calculations for your DP, he needs to get this checked out.

So he couldn’t be arsed to sort access either. And he put his own selfish wants first.

He sounds a charmer.

You are complaining over two nights a week away from your daughter and one day at the weekend when he hasn’t seen his son in 13 years? You have some brass neck

So it’s the ex’s fault he abandoned his child because she wanted ‘ammo’ wake up OP.

There is nothing that would keep me from having contact with my child OP. You have a child would distance stop you?

Seems darling fiance didnt even try.

The ex "disappearing" works well for him as then he can spin you any old line.

My daughter doesn’t have £634 a month spent on her from her dad

What do you think? That the amount is used as pocket money? Do you realise that money could have been used to pay the rent, the mortgage, the school dinners, etc.

There’s no way she can spend her life living of benefits these days. I doubt very much that the court had supported leaving the dad without contact if there were not some VERY VERY serious reasons to stop it (like dad being a clear danger to his kid, a proven threat to their safety, etc). It makes me wonder what would be her side of the story. I am pretty convinced that evidence of bank transfers is enough paper trail to prove maintenance if he had the amount deducted from his salary it can be either because he often missed payments or wasn’t paying or worse.

The CMS is right, you earn more, you pay more, even if you were working longer hours to pay a wedding or buy a car.

I suppose after four years with your fiancé, you know who you are marrying but then... nobody knows who they really married until they get divorced.

Best of luck!

Yeah exactly...so do you think his ex is spending £634 as well every month. I can tell you, I've never ever spent £1268 a month on my child. OP there's something badly wrong with the calculations for your DP, he needs to get this checked out*

When people talk about maintenance they aren’t expected to “spend” £1200 a month. It’s about the extras the children cost - so she needs a house with that extra bedroom (and all the extra bills that come with a bigger house), school uniform, school trips, food on the table, clubs, clothing, shoes, holidays. It will certainly cost more than £600 a month for all the extra a child of 16 costs.

At least you know if you split up you’ll be quids in

When people talk about maintenance they aren’t expected to “spend” £1200 a month. It’s about the extras the children cost - so she needs a house with that extra bedroom (and all the extra bills that come with a bigger house), school uniform, school trips, food on the table, clubs, clothing, shoes, holidays. It will certainly cost more than £600 a month for all the extra a child of 16 costs

Yeah I know, I'm not stupid, I have kids and I know what they cost. The ex should be contributing half as well so if OP DP is paying £634 a month, there's no way the ex is matching anywhere near that.

You don’t get it OP. The child maintenance amount is to try to ensure the child does not lose out financially from their parents separating. If he was still with his ex then his son would benefit from his increase in income. So you don’t want your partners overtime to go towards his son because you want it for your wedding... you don’t see the irony in that??