Why is there such a huge discrepancy between the school day/school hols and the majority of workplaces

[Lifeisbeaut]

Just returning to work after a career break and trying to work out the logistics of school pick ups, how to manage school holidays whilst minimising the children being passed from pillar to post without routine. It’s not manageable or affordable.
I wish more employers offered term time only or proper part time options. I feel like what’s the point in going back to work when I will barely see my children and I’m barely bringing much more money in. Whoever said we could have it all was lying (unless I am missing something?)

Aren’t you making those optional if you’re offering 1.30 as a pick up point? - school is optional already.

Smoggle

presumably we're talking more primary schools

Are we? this isn't specified anywhere. The school day doesn't change between primary and 11-16 education.

The same drop off, pick up issues are still there etc. etc.

Your big problem there Ice is that your specialist teachers are going to want to know why they aren’t paid for their planning and prep time while the core teachers are.

Even better to book them in to stay til 6pm and have tea and homework at school if I need to work.

So its not really about your children its about you.

@Lagrish, it might eat into profits but so do a lot of things employers are required to do for the common good

The same drop off, pick up issues are still there etc. etc.
The issues are very different. A 6 year old needs to be taken to school, collected in person, and supervised by an adult after school. A 13 year old takes themselves to and from school and can take themselves to clubs or stay at home alone for a couple of hours.

So its not really about your children its about you.
Boney, I would absolutely support abolishing work, but I think that might be even more controversial than universal after school clubs

school is optional already.

Well that would solve the school run issue.

Smoggle

I would absolutely support abolishing work, but I think that might be even more controversial than universal after school clubs grin

Almost funny, but it doesn't change the fact that you want things changing for your benefit and not the benefit of your children.

You have already said that teachers can leave at 4 to pick up their own children, So who does that leave to look after yours?

And you are already increasing the costs to the school by opening longer, increasing staffing costs due to extra meals and schools not being able to take in bookings for the evening sessions as the school is still full of children.

You have already said that teachers can leave at 4 to pick up their own children, So who does that leave to look after yours?
Who do you think provides childcare in nurseries and after school clubs now? It's not teachers.

Smoggle

I'll give you a clue, once all the parents have left to pick up their children who picks up the slack?

I'm with you. Really why can't people work 8-2 or 10-4? Do we really do so much in those extra two hours? Maybe not every single job, but a heck of a lot . It's because we get burdened with the cost of childcare instead of employers having to pay more overheads to have more employees for less hours. The venerable consultant must surely agree if a company were obliged to pay overtime after six hours continual work, the model would change?

Boney - sorry Boney, I'm not following you. Sounds like you have a specific point you want to make though? Are you worried about parents not wanting to take jobs as childcare providers?

And this is exactly why I'm not considering going back to work until my children are old enough to look after themselves for a few hours each day. I currently work Saturdays, and evenings when my partner can look after the kids, and once they're both in school I will look for short shifts I can do while they're there, but will have to be able to do school drop offs and pick ups. It's a huge sacrifice money wise, but the best option for us. If you earn enough to use holiday/after school/breakfast clubs, and are happy with that arrangement, it's an (expensive) option, and only really feasible for higher earners, and I wouldnt say gives you "it all" as you will be missing out on time with your children. I personally don't think anyone can "have it all" unless they can physically be in two places at once.

Really why can't people work 8-2 or 10-4?

I assume that doesn't apply to teachers though? Are they and other school staff still expected to work school hours?

You are free to not work of course but then you have to tighten your belt and go without luxuries. My mum did it for years with 5 kids..... lifestyle is a choice but if you choose to work you have to make it work. If you have a flexible employer great but you can't expect all businesses to work around parents wants

There is a definite tendency to take a one size fits all attitude to work which isn't always helpful. Sometimes working isn't going to be worth it if it pays poorly and there is limited chance of progression once you've factored in childcare costs. Not all jobs are careers or even provide dignity and self sustainability

I think it would be good if we could combine term time only with students looking for temporary summer jobs in some cases.

I really can’t see this working for anything other than the most unskilled jobs though. Imagine turning up for your hysterectomy to be told that the surgeon works only term time and today, a media studies student from the local uni is standing in.😂

So if the company I work for offered proper flexible term time contracts we would have half the staff come holidays. Then we would get less revenue, have negative profit and consequently have to shut down causing those parents to be out of a job and other non parents out of a job and a service would be missing from the industry I work in.
It can’t be a shock that school is 9-3 it has been for ever and jobs just are not. Surely everyone knows this before having children.

I have read a lot on here the last few days and it seems to me if we all stuck with one child (can’t help twins I know) we would be happier spending time with them in the holidays, we would spend less in the holidays, we would be less stressed in general as not pulled in 100 directions and working would be easier as it’s not so expensive to put one child into nursery/wrap round.

As others say it’s a choice to have children, school isn’t childcare and we are lucky to live in a society that offers it for everyone.

I think the biggest problem is too many companies want people to be available 24/7 on 0 hour contracts where hours can fluctuate week to week.

Where as childcare providers need to know exactly when you need the child care.

I don't know what the answer is.
Surely some of the bigger companies (I'm thinking Tesco etc open 24 hours) could offer creche facilitates? Not sure of the ins and outs but I'm sure some companies make time for women to express breast milk so surely a creche would just be an extension of that?
E.g. mom nips off for 30 mins to express. Mom nips down to creche for 30 mins. Obviously wouldn't help with school pick up and drop off But maybe that could also be part of it.

And to ask the age-old question, if all parents are offered term-time/school time only hours, who is it that covers all the rest to keep the business running? Have a guess.

Smoggle

As you don't seem to be able to see it, the people that are picking up the slack and working the hours that parents (in this case you) don't want to work are non parents.

having it all isn't a job, family and husband.
Having it all is being happy with the life you have and the freedom to enjoy yourself.
Working and juggling childcare being too knackered to keep your partner happy is a life of misery.

Because we use an archaic model of timing for education based on the needs of farming communities several hundred years ago (both in terms of holiday and school day)

This above, plus the fact that the structure of the working world is based on men doing the work, women staying home to look after children. The structure hasn't changed to keep up with the fact that in many families both parents are working OR that single parent families are increasingly common.

We scrimped and saved to have me at home for 5 years +: we've been skint but the stress levels are way lower than having to rush from work to childcare to school etc and panicking every time there is a strike or a sick child etc.

My error was assuming that after school clubs would be universal and available to all who need them. My DD's probable school has after school club until 6pm Monday and Wednesday and until 5 on Friday. Other days no after school provision at all...

I also didn't quite twig that au pairs generally want a language school somewhere they can get to easily and that growing up in a medium sized multicultural town meant it was easy for my parents to get a succession of au pairs.

To be fair I did not realise until I tried that I am shit at being a SAHM. I need some adult interaction on a regular basis. Now stressed trying to get back to a job that fits around my DH's frankly impossible (medical field) job...