Why is there such a huge discrepancy between the school day/school hols and the majority of workplaces

[Lifeisbeaut]

Just returning to work after a career break and trying to work out the logistics of school pick ups, how to manage school holidays whilst minimising the children being passed from pillar to post without routine. It’s not manageable or affordable.
I wish more employers offered term time only or proper part time options. I feel like what’s the point in going back to work when I will barely see my children and I’m barely bringing much more money in. Whoever said we could have it all was lying (unless I am missing something?)

How would you feel if all the shops/services you use and need in a regular basis followed school hours? You would leave work, pick up your children and then nothing. No supermarket, bus, swimming pool, music lessons, doctor, dentist. Do you see my point, OP?

Perhaps you mean only the job you do should follow school hours?

Two totally separate things, school is there to educate children. Employers have a business to run, they can't do it around people's preferences to have children and not want to pay for childcare etc.

It's perfectly possible to have a career and children if realistic and willing to pay for childcare. It's those that feel they should be given the perfect job for q few hours a day term time only that soon realise real life is not like that.

It's not even just the pick ups/drop offs/holidays dds school is always asking us to come in during school hours for workshops, stay and plays, sports days, assemblies, meetings because she's on a development plan.
It's the endless mum guilt, I saw a quote with sums it up for me "women are expected to work as if they don't raise children and raise children as if they don't work"
Luckily I was able to compress my hours and work late and rely on parents for pick ups and morning clubs (which are very difficult to get into)

Why school age I never really get this statement!

Maternity leave if employed is 6-12m, if employed your child would required childcare after your maternity leave.

Employers run a business and school is for education, your child care issues is your responsibility not that of everyone else’s.

Was these not factors you considered before bringing a child into the world.

School is for children. Not adults.

The school day is short because that is what children require.

I know it's not a magic bullet but all working parents should check their employers parental leave policy too. I think this can vary but it's typically up to 5 weeks unpaid leave to care for dependents. So that can help if you can afford the salary sacrifice (which I appreciate not everyone can),

OP, I don't get how you didn't factor this into your career break. MN, the internet, the world is full of articles and views on this. Why so surprised?

School day here is 8-1!

Perhaps it's because the "problem" of school runs/care outside of school often falls to only one parent?

Because at an institutional/structural/governmental level women's careers and contributions aren't valued imo - because most of the "holiday care" still falls to women, or is farmed out to other women paid badly.

Because we use an archaic model of timin for education based on the needs of farming communities several hundred years ago (both in terms of holiday and school day)

And this.

Lots of other countries do better at making childcare better and more affordable. Some other countries (Holland for example) do better at synching the family and work days, so that entire families can sit down to an early supper together. Entirely possible if the political will is there.

Because it has been a given since before the advent of the pill that mothers are part of a married couple and as such, are stay at home parents with no chance of a career whilst their children are of school age, unless they are wealthy enough to afford nannies/tutors/someone other than themselves to look after children out of school hours. Society has moved on in terms of women working outside the home, but expectations that mothers/ (occasionally a father) stay at home to provide all the necessary care for their school-age children are still implicit.
Or, as others have said more succinctly, women can't have it all.

I agree and I’m lucky that I work for a progressive company that offers a wide range of options.
I work from home, I work during school hours and I work the rest of my shift in the evening 6-8. And do this 3 days a week.

There are plenty that employers can do to help working parents, they choose not to.
School holidays are a little bit of a faff but I just use a childminder and my mum helps me out 1 day during the hols.

I work for a tiny firm (two directors, four support staff, including me). When I first started, I was asked what hours I'd like to work. I don't have children and needed a full time job because, ya know, mortgage. The other women all have children: one works term time only (even though her youngest graduated last year ), another now only works two days a week in the holidays and the other works three days a week and shorter hours and less during the holidays.

As lonely as it is in the holidays, I am so impressed with the directors' attitude to working parents mothers. I've also made myself indispensable as I'm the only one who can do all the jobs! Which reminds me, I must ask for a pay rise...

I realise such jobs are as rare as rocking horse shit but they do exist and it's good to know I could go part time when finances allow.

I'm always baffled that people are shocked to find they need child care in 🙄🤔the school holidays

See i think 8 til 1 that diddl said for school could be easier to manage. In that many people could get to work by 9 so less would need before school care and decent childcare from 1 til 6 would be a proper job so easier to staff than 3-6 (its not that easy to find people interested in children who only want to work 2.45-18.15 term time - people need a wage they can live on)
Its definatley interesting to look at other structures and consider how they could work.

This is the exact reason I didn't take a career break. Working for peanuts whilst the kids are small to cover childcare costs means you keep your employment going, skills current etc, and are in a much better position to request flexible working. To approach an employer for an entry level role and ask for flexible working is so much trickier than requesting it when you've already proved yourself in your industry in my experience.

Because most businesses and organisations need to operate all year round. Even some educational organisations. I work at a university and and we are busy all year round.

However, our whole society is still based on children having one parent at home with them (typically women) and I do think some organisations could review their working practices to make flexible working more commonplace.

Lol how about because the world doesn’t stop needing services and workers after 3pm and during the summer?

This is the choice you / your partner make . We decided that I would just work very part time after we had our first child ( night staff nurse 1 /2 nights a week) so that our children didn’t require any outside child care . Obviously that meant we didn’t have the same level of income but it worked for us .

It’s because most people can’t be trusted to work from hone and term time working is annoying. It’s just one of those things. I’m not sure why you are surprise or why you bought into the havingit all bullshit. Having it all us just another way of saying to women that they have to do it all at cost to their mental health. It’s nonsense.

Retail used to be good for this. You would have the full timers and then the part timers - the mums who worked Monday to Friday 9.30 to 2.30 term time only and weekends and school holidays were the 6th formers and uni students. It worked just great and everyone was happy (ish).
Retail rarely does that now. They advertise as 'flexible' but that actually means zero contract.

I’ve had several requests for staff to work flexible hours but had to reject the majority as our clients need us to be available between the hours of 9-5 so someone wanting to start early and finish early, doesn’t work for our company.

We have decent PT options at our work which seems to work well as everyone wanted different hours and it covers the busiest times! Manager is flexible so you can change the shifts within reason
One works 8-6 Monday and Tuesday and 8-2 Wednesday as she has child care those days
One works 9.30 - 3 or 10 - 2 or 8 - 2 depending on child care
One works 9.30 - 2.30 every day

We need to reframe out of school childcare in this country. It’s not “being passed from pillar to post” it’s child-appropriate time.
My ds goes to afterschool club where he runs around he school field playing various sports in a relaxed self-organised way with other kids of all ages.
In school holidays he does various camps.
Yes it costs money but nothing compared to what we paid for private Nursery.
I refuse to feel guilty for any of it. After work I like a sit down and cup of tea. After school my ds needs exercise and fresh air, if I was to collect him at 3 I would not want to go run round a park for two hours so it’s better all round I get him after after school club at 5/5:30.

What irks me more is the assumption that all children in the class have a stay-at-home parent. At least there is a clear start and end date to the holidays, and there are often nannies looking for a one-off gig as their main family goes on holiday.
Parents' evening? Latest appointment is at 5 pm.
PTA meeting? "Mums' coffee morning" at 11 am.
Workshop on reading skills / exams / assessments? The headteacher will meet everyone at 2.
You don't come into class as a volunteer reading assistant? The teacher has no time otherwise to discuss your child's progress.

You are trying to connect two unconnected parts of life. Work and having children are not mutually compatible

Wow. I don't even know where to begin. So for millions of families, working and bringing up children are just 'unconnected parts of life'? I didn't realize I can split my life into segments like that.
Also, all humans who have children should give up work since they are not mutually compatible. Or do we just mean all mothers?

OP I agree there is a huge discrepancy. I DON'T think work hours should be the same as school hours at all, but there have to be better ways to coordinate the two aspects. They are absolutely connected parts of life. Saying 'This is how it is' or 'You suck it up why didn't you think this through' do not move anything forward for the better and demonstrate a conservative, unsympathetic worldview.