Using a disabled loo.....

[countrymousesussex]

This is a weird one that I’m genuinely curious about, and it’s a situation I’ve found myself in a few times.

Being on maternity leave with a 4.5 month old, I am often out with the buggy. We live in a village so often am in a different town/village when shopping, running errands etc - so not close enough to nip home.

Today I was in a market town about 7 miles from our village, shopping. I was dying for the loo so I went into the baby change room at Tesco to find that there was no loo inside it. I then tried to get the buggy into the ladies but there was no room. Someone saw me struggling and said why didn’t I just use the disabled one as there was no one waiting and it has space for the buggy. I didn’t feel right doing this, so trekked in and out of coffee shops till I found one with a large enough loo to get the buggy in.

Was I being ridiculous to not use the disabled? In our village cafe I often leave the buggy in the main room while I nip to the loo and ask one of the girls that works there to keep an eye on the baby, but I wouldn’t feel comfortable doing that anywhere else.

Parents with buggies, what would you have done?

Disabled people, would you have been really annoyed if I’d used the disabled?

I’m just interested to know if I was being a doughnut!

I deliberately bought a slimline buggy as I knew this would probably be an issue. Even as it was it was hard to get the thing in to some public toilets and certainly didn't fit in the cubicle so I just reversed in and peed with the door open :) The only time I ever used the disabled toilets was when heavily pregnant and incontinent, or for baby changing facilities already installed in one.

I'd be mortified to strip off and use a public toilet with the door open. I don't go out with a buggy much for reasons like this to be honest.

The public toilets in a town near us were replanned two or three years ago now. When they reopened afterwards they were a long row of, I think, maybe 10 toilet cubicles which are all easily large enough to comfortably get prams or pushchairs into

Ours have just been done and one is large enough to fit in with a buggy. The door is normal width. I can't get the buggy in. Awesome!

Yabbers

We haven’t made the decision. For two years we’ve been trying to get the public loos reopened simply as they were. This wasn’t given the green light.

However as I said, the facilities are going to be manned for a start. How often do you see fully manned facilities? They’re also in a shared space, so unlikely to have groups of teens messing about as you would in a public loo in a park for example.

Given the siting it isn’t “prime target”. In fact the teens are way more likely to be at the other loos.

FWIW the two people who initially raised the idea of a changing places facility are absolutely thrilled that there’s been such massive changes - and work gone into - ensuring there’ll be a decent facility in such a tiny town. They’re not concerned about sharing the facility - we all totally understand that it’s not ideal - but this is a compromise that means they can use the facilities which seems pretty reasonable.

I'm struggling to recognise other people's descriptions of their set of toilets. We have nice toilets in the parents rooms, which I'm the only one seemingly to have. After that almost every accessible toilet is marked for disabled but also contains baby change. One small cafe only has literally one accessible toilet, no other toilets for ladies / gents etc. The only (very few) times I've seen people wait for the toilet has been one or two mums with babies, but usually I'm out midweek and there's never been a queue. I can only think of one park and one parents room that have separate baby change but no toilet for the mum to use, which always seemed pretty stupid to me as both have the space. Meanwhile, a lot of the standard toilets are up a few steps / at the end of narrow corridors / tiny inside, I can only think of two where a pushchair can even get into the main door and I wouldn't like to try getting it around to wedge into a cubicle. I will not leave my baby and there is no way I can carry him and my bags while on the toilet, I'm not sure I could even if I didn't have wrist problems and wear a wrist splint.

I can really understand the frustration and upset if people are regularly waiting for the disabled toilet and it's awful that there aren't more. So the anger towards planners or restaurant owners at sharing facilities is fair, but to me that anger seems misplaced in getting annoyed by parents using a toilet that's marked "baby change" to change their baby and wee at the same time. That isn't every poster, but it is what a few people seem to have as an additional objection. If there's another option then "I just can't wait" is not a good enough excuse, but when that is the only facility provided for parents too then it seems unfair too blame the parent for using it. In near-empty restaurants with nobody obviously disabled, it would seem crazy if I tried carrying DS and my bags into the ladies instead of quickly using the room marked "baby change" to change him and go to toilet at the same time.

I've used disabled accessible toilets if there are no others available. big queues in the ladies

My bladder is weak and painful

I've never had anyone waiting when I've come out or tut at me or been challenged at all.

I don't feel bad about using a toilet that no one is using.

If the baby changing facilities are in there I'd say it's absolutely fine they are a shared resource. Be as brief as you can baring in mind people might need it.

If baby changing is elsewhere and you've no other options depends how desperate you are.

I don't think any reasonable person would expect you to damage your bladder or risk an accident. If you have post pregnancy issues as well it might be that you are entitled to use such facilities if you need the toilet very quickly.

Not all disabilities are obvious and someone that has recently had a baby is more likely than most to have such issues.

This thread shows that a lot of people are unreasonable though and don’t care that their selfishness or inability to plan ahead means that someone could end up in pain or soiling themselves.

If the only baby changing is in the disabled toilet then that is awful planning but nothing the parents can do about it other than be as quick as possible and don’t treat it like a family day out.

Who spends longer in a toilet than they need to @Sirzy, and why?

A wee nappy takes a minute or less to change. A poonami where poo has streaked up or down the baby and a fresh outfit needs putting on, plus wiping down the mat and bagging up the mess might take longer. Is that the kind of thing you mean by "family day out"? I'd love to see your planning for when your baby is allowed to poo.

@CupcakeDrama maybe I just look trustworthy!
Sometimes it's been "can you just watch the pram for a minute" while it's outside the toilets and they've taken baby in with them, other times the pram and baby have been by the sinks and I've just stood there while they go in a cubicle

Disabled parking spaces are changing to accessible spaces round here so I can't bloody wait to be fighting with people who think they're accessible to all that need them! 🙄

I waited for 7 minutes for a woman with a pushchair to come out of the disabled toilet at Manchester Airport 3 weeks ago. There was a baby change right next to it so she must've been using it for convenience. Just as well as I wasn't desperate eh?

Maybe there was someone using the baby change one when she went into the disabled one?

I’m not saying she was right I’m just saying I would imagine most people don’t go around inconveniencing disabled people on purpose!

The woman with the pushchair could have a disability, they aren't mutually exclusive

To give an example of what Sirzy means by planning, to go to a shop as a mum with a baby generally pack a changing bag get pram/ baby seat ready then generally set off (sorry been a few years but generally not having to do this).
My trip to shop is there a means of public transport there? Ensure it’s not rush hour or on route to hospital or other public facility otherwise have to get a cab as my child is noise sensitive even with ear defenders. check shop facilities, where is nearest toilet? quiet area? Is there a cafe near by with fast service and not too busy? If not pack a drink and a snack. Are there other toilets nearby? This gives options. I try to pick a toilet away from the main shop areas if possible as these tend to have less use. Plan route from front door to shop. Ensure I know exactly where the item I need is so I can grab and go. Now it’s planned pack a bag with change of clothes, wipes and a large towel or blanket and a hand towel. Pack floor wipes and antibacterial wipes (this is to clean toilet floor etc if needed before I put my child on it because some people can be disgusting to be frank). My child will look in the toilet so if that’s dirty I get to clean that too. Failure to plan equals a melt down and hours of comfort so to save the grief I shop online as much as possible. I only go to disability days at locations (something else we fought for) with even more planning as it involves social stories. Yes my frustration is with the planners but also with the “I’ve got two children who can walk and so I will use the accessible toilet for no other reason than I can’t be bothered to handle the stress of them in two separate cubicles in the ladies”. And yes that is something i have been told by a parent who also told me to keep my child at home who was melting down and hitting their head on the floor because they had soiled themselves and needed to be clean. So I avoid taking her out. This is why I ask parents on here to fight for better family friendly facilities instead of defaulting to well accessible is for everyone.

I’m going to repeat this as some people seem so fixed in their own narrative it’s quite disturbing:

It’s an accessible toilet. Not disabled only. Where I live they actually have signs on them that say “accessible toilet for everyone”.

Also it’s where the baby change is located 99% of the time, for a reason. It is for everyone who needs it.
You may not like it but that IS the way it is. The accessible toilets are not just for disabled people. What about people with twins? Or a baby and a toddler? How are they supposed to fit in a cubicle and why should they? The comments about changing babies on toilet floors are disgusting and ridiculous. Would you like to lie on a toilet floor? Of course not. They are people too. Vulnerable humans who’s immune system isn’t developed yet.

Yet again disabled people are meant to just roll over and give up the facilities they have fought hard for.

Most disabled toilets I have seen have the “not every disability is visible” sign on. That isn’t an invite for everyone to use it just because they can’t be arsed to wait!

It’s not giving up the facility though. It’s just waiting for your turn if it’s in use at that particular time.

I’ve never specifically used a disabled toilet with the pram but the idea of mums not doing so and having to juggle a baby one handed whilst toileting and risking dropping them/getting them dirty on the floor is insane.

Especially as this is for the benefit of a hypothetical disabled person that even if they do materialise out of thin air is going to be delayed for about a minute at most.

I always used it with buggy if no other option. Now dc are older but youngest still a toddler I still sometimes use it in quiet places as easier to fit all 3 of us in. I wouldn’t use it alone or with just 1 child though.

I'm not disabled, but have an overactive bladder. Before I saught treatment for it I would often use the disability toilet. I don't feel guilty for it.

Our family covers most options for needing accessible toilets, I have several chronic conditions some loo related some mobility. Dh has to use it if there's no family toilets and he has one or both dds needing to go. Now to add to it I have a broken knee (full length brace and no bend so no steps). I would never object to a parent with a buggy using it because they had to and yes I too have urgency issues. It's the fault of the designers not the users

To also repeat.
When referring to accessible spaces accessible is the preferred term as it uses positive language
This is the Wikipedia link explaining about accessible toilets en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accessible_toilet

In particular this section
terminology
Alternative terms are "handicapped toilet" or "toilets for the disabled" which are no longer recommended (see disability).

In regards to baby change situation it is that way because parents don’t fight for the facilities they should have planned until parents do it will remain that way

Is it really so much to ask for you as parents to help with that fight? Or is it a case that because your children grow it’s not worth your time?

Yes but all these people saying “I saw this woman with her child using the disabled toilets, I had to wait” are making the very same judgement they accuse others of.
If you accept that not all disabilities are visible, then you have to actually live that, and not look at that woman and judge.
That woman with a buggy may have post birth injuries which make her incontinent. The toddler in the buggy may be autistic and completely unable to cope with the noise of the hand dryers in the main toilet. You have no way of knowing, so don’t judge, you may be right, but you equally may have just made someone with real difficulties feel much worse, and much less likely to step out the house.
I look fine. I can generally manage fine. I can generally use normal toilet facilities. But if I am somewhere, like a pub, where the toilets are upstairs, I need to use the disabled toilets. Because stairs cause me pain, and if I struggle up then, I will potentially be exhausted for days, I may be off work. I’ll do it if I have to but if there is an option not to, I’m taking it. And people can say, that’s fine, you have a disability, but they don’t know that until I tell them. So I get tutted at.
My son has autism. I’m not going to tell you that when you tut at me for using the disabled toilets with him. It’s none of your business, and he has a right to privacy.
Also, expecting and exhausted mother of small babies, who can barely keep herself going, to campaign for better toilet facilities if bloody ridiculous. And let’s face it, society isn’t so good at accepting that mothers might actually need some support and help.