Do you think there will be a 2nd referendum?

[oweus]

Many of my friends and acquaintances seem to think so. I still think it's unlikely.

From your facts above - I'm getting; the EU is a bully who always wins, EU immigration cannot be controlled - and our government is so weak that it will "ignore the will of the people" to keep the EU happy.

Or, howabout ... the people of Switzerland voted for a unicorn, and couldn't have one ? Just like the Leavers of the UK voted for a unicorn ?

THIS! www.facebook.com/ledbydonkeys/videos/1887578141347420/

We were never going to be allowed to leave the EU, democracy is officially dead.

ODFOAD ....

If Leavers had a plan before rushing us into this, we'd be out by now.

Even now nearly 3 years after the referendum, not only do we not know what the exact Leave plan is, but even Leavers can't agree if it's good or bad.

The real message here is that things that are complicated aren't made any less complicated by pretending to people they aren't complicated.

You tell me The Leave Plan. The Plan you voted for, researched and discussed. The Plan that was campaigned on.

When you tell me what The Plan is I can tell you if I agree with The Plan.

So about this Plan...

The EU elections will be very interesting indeed as they’ll be a pretty good indication of how the country feels now IF there’s a decent turn out.

The Plan was to tell the World that we are a great and mighty power which does not need the EU and is so spectacular that, when we leave, everyone will be rushing to our door desperate to make trade deals with us, because they would much rather piss off every country in the EU than the UK. The reality, of course, is that we are an unproductive country which has had its economy artificially bolstered because it is in the EU - and out of the EU, we look like a sad wannabe, run down tax haven.

What would a second referendum even ask for though? People go on about folk now knowing what they were voting for last time. They still wouldn’t!!

The vote would be between a clearly outlined deal with all its implications properly explained and remain. As it should have been three years ago.

Theresa May's deal is clearly outlined. Her deal is what people voted for. Given that leave and remain politicians think it's a bad thing for the UK, I think it's sensible to check the People want to go ahead, anyway, against advice from all sides, since it's what they said they wanted 3 years ago.

Her deal isn’t what people voted for at all. Peter Osborne says he had no idea of the implications for the Good Friday Agreement which is why he’s no longer a leaver.

The vote would be between a clearly outlined deal with all its implications properly explained and remain.

I don't see why remain is an option that needs voting on. It's what should happen if Leave can't get their **ing act together and give us a clear vision of what's going to happen which get the sensible supermajority any major constitutional change would require in any other democracy in the world.

We were never going to be allowed to leave the EU, democracy is officially dead.

What a load of total shit.

You could leave now under the terms of May’s WA. You could leave pretty swiftly with a customs union.

The people stopping the UK from leaving are the unicorn hunting brexiteers.

It needs voting for because otherwise leavers would maintain that nobody voted Remain.

It needs voting for because otherwise leavers would maintain that nobody voted Remain.

At some point the idea of status quo needs to be explained - possibly in English as "default position".

If the other vote outlined the intentions of the EU- i.e. the EU army, which other countries will join over the next 10 years, a full audited version of their accounts then fine lets vote again.
The idea that voting to remain is a vote for the status quo is Crap.

Intention isn’t reality. The status quo is the current situation.

Well the reality is the EU is not what it was originally intended to be!

OnlyFoolsnMothers we have had this debate many times.

In the 1975 referendum the term 'ever closer political union' was used and understood.

The EU is evolving in the way many planned and foresaw.

If the other vote outlined the intentions of the EU

In that case we’d also need to talk about where the worlds going. An increasingly protectionist USA. The rising power of China. The increasing presence of ill intentioned Russia.

I’d say the future makes the EU look even more attractive than it does now.

Or would you prefer to hang out with Putin?

Well the reality is the EU is not what it was originally intended to be!

Well if you're happy with that, doing nothing says so.

If not we can leave, if enough people agree how.

Or (my preference) we could stay in, and take part ... who knows, work at getting back the respect and admiration we had when we worked as part of the team and pulled of some stunning victories.

would you prefer to hang out with Putin?

I feel increasingly uneasy being part of an EU that is inclusive of countries that put up walls to keep anyone non-white out, countries that lack of tolerance towards homosexuality etc. This is no longer a mix of similarity tolerant, liberal nations.

“Well the reality is the EU is not what it was originally intended to be!”

The UK was not subject to the EU - it was an integral part and hugely involved in decision-making. Including in creating the regulations that govern how a country leaves. The UK isn’t some victim of the EU here - our governments and citizens have been part of its development. I have heard Brexit compared to a family member leaving a family business and that is a good analogy. Legal matters and interests are heavily intertwined

What would a second referendum even ask for though?

I heard a suggestion on the radio today of "do you want to leave with this deal or remain in the EU?"

I heard a suggestion on the radio today of "do you want to leave with this deal or remain in the EU?"

The thing is that this "deal" only deals with the process of leaving and says nothing about what happens after it expires. So we're still back to a possible decade of Leavers arguing what should happen after the transition period.

Where's that plan Leavers told us they voted for ? I've never seen it.

The UK was not subject to the EU - it was an integral part and hugely involved in decision-making. Including in creating the regulations that govern how a country leaves. The UK isn’t some victim of the EU here - our governments and citizens have been part of its development. I have heard Brexit compared to a family member leaving a family business and that is a good analogy. Legal matters and interests are heavily intertwined

To be fair UK citizens haven't had a say, our representative governments have- and they've made a mess of it.