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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Homophobia within the Muslim community

430 replies

thankssomuchforthat · 27/03/2019 09:07

Please can we keep this thread calm and good natured as this is a genuine question.
I was genuinely shocked at a spokesperson for the Muslim community on GMB condemning gay people as sinful. Saying being gay is fundamentally wrong. Saying most Muslim people vehemently believe this. Is this true? Or are gay Muslims tolerated within the community? What would happen if a Muslim teenager was gay. Would the family disown them?
Genuine question. I suppose I mix in circles that are tolerant of homosexuality.
Please keep comments nice and friendly.

OP posts:
M4J4 · 29/03/2019 07:54

So despite being told Christians and Jews are also protesting, it's Muslims you're fixated on, OP.

Your agenda is very obvious.

Tunnockswafer · 29/03/2019 08:08

Is there a country in the world with Christian or Jewish leadership who currently has a law that being gay is a reason for the death penalty?
All the religions have lots to answer for but I would think their level of homophobia could be assessed against that point.

N0rdicStar · 29/03/2019 08:11

Re this news story I haven’t seen any other religion protesting or interviewed. Not one parent saying we don’t think it’s ok to tell 4 year olds it’s ok to be gay. I saw several Muslim parents saying just that on interview.

It’s inexcusable and utterly wrong. It is ok to call it out and ask how prevalent such horrendous views are.

Lweji · 29/03/2019 08:31

Is there a country in the world with Christian or Jewish leadership who currently has a law that being gay is a reason for the death penalty?

The key here is currently.
Not that it should be excused in anyway.

It's true that for that specific school there aren't any other religions specifically protesting. But believe me that some parents of all sorts of religions also oppose their precious little ones being "indoctrinated" in gayness.

drspouse · 29/03/2019 08:44

Although Nigeria is both Muslim and Christian, there are some death penalties on the books for homosexual acts.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Nigeria

Needadvices · 29/03/2019 10:54

Seen mentioned a few times already, but in islam sex for pleasure(within the marriage) is actually incouraged. Birth control is allowed. People know christianity and think they know islam.

clairemcnam · 29/03/2019 11:04

Needadvices There are people on this thread who have been brought up in the Muslim faith. They do indeed know Islam first-hand.

I hate how on MN the default assumption seems to be that posters are white and have a christian background, it is not true for many posters.

Needadvices · 29/03/2019 12:48

Well i saw so many posts on how in islam sex is supposedly only allowed to procreate etc with is the christian point of view. Knowing islam first hand as well doesnt mean much, the experience of islam in pakistan is very different from the one in indonesia. Like those books from "ex muslims" , most of whats written as examples of how badly they were treated was all cultural stuff rather then religious.

StoneofDestiny · 29/03/2019 13:37

I think all religions are deserving of criticisms, but I don’t think it helps when other religions are dragged in in order to minimise when it’s a thread about a particular one.....Christianity often comes under attack so it’s wrong to call Islamaphobe if it happens to be about Islam. Every religion has aspects that other people might find abhorrent/strange, Islam is no different

Very true, and it's that fear of being called Islamaphobic that stopped various investigations taking place into the activities of some Muslim men who were abusing children.

In a lots of closed 'cultural or religious communities' the danger is often within!

wafflyversatile · 30/03/2019 08:51

. So in this exact scenario it is at least 90% muslims proteating if not more. Please answer....are you one of the what about the men posters when the issue is domestic violence because you seem unable to accept we are allowed to talk about the main group of people who are the main perpetrators and blatantly showing their homophobic views in this instance

I think it's more akin to if there had been a couple of stories in the media about lesbians who had badly abused their partners and posters were starting threads asking about abuse in the lesbian community and why are so many lesbian relationships like this. What is it about lesbianism that explains this? Most relationships in the UK are heterosexual and bringing up the fact that abuse is common in those too is a perfectly valid part of the discussion.

Lweji · 30/03/2019 10:32

Comparisons with other religions are relevant to compare how any issue that involves any Muslims is presented in relation to people who follow other religions.

For some reason most of us are able to distinguish between more traditional or fundamentalist sects or followers of Christianity or Judeism for example, but tend to put together Muslims as a whole.

I think it may be useful to try and understand if these protests reflect the whole community or not, but it's still worrying that there's an assumption that it does. Particularly in Britain.

Even in countries under religious laws, it's well worth distinguishing between the state and the laws and the people.

If it takes comparing with other religions to make the point, then I'll keep doing it.

Which is different from saying that other religions also have similar behaviours so it's ok.

M4J4 · 30/03/2019 11:43

@StoneofDestiny

it's that fear of being called Islamaphobic that stopped various investigations taking place into the activities of some Muslim men who were abusing children.

This is often trotted out, but it's not true. The police simply didn't give a shit then, and they don't give a shit now about those poor girls. Blaming it on perceived Islamophobia is a nice little cop-out for the police, who are institutionally racist and don't balk at arresting minorities.

Sweetlittlepug · 30/03/2019 11:44

Comparing with other religions doesn’t tend to happen though when it’s a thread criticising Christianity. I’ve noticed if, on the rare occasions, Islam gets brought in, people are accused of Islamaphobia. There really is double standards. However, in this case, the only reason that I see to bring other religions into it is to try and minimise the accusations against the Muslims in question.

Lweji · 30/03/2019 12:21

Comparing with other religions doesn’t tend to happen though when it’s a thread criticising Christianity.

But that's because people don't tend to equate one group of Christians with the entire Christianity.

When was the last time we had a thread asking about how the Christian community (and think that it includes from Catholics to Lutherans and what is currently called as "Christians") views gays?

Most people in the UK are probably not even aware that there are two main derivations of Islam, let alone the various other. So, we (society/media) keep equating these protesting parents with all or most Muslims.
Comparing with other religions can be used to pass the idea of the diversity and differences that also exist within Islam.

Tunnockswafer · 30/03/2019 12:35

Is there a liberal strand within Islam in the same way that there is within Christianity? There will obviously be liberal individuals, but is there a specific group that could be pointed to as the liberal one? I ask really as the position in Christianity can arise as people interpret the bible in lots of different ways, even down to the translation of it. But my (limited, clearly) understanding of Islam is that the Qur’an needs to be followed as originally written, since it’s not the word of a human but the word of God.

Limer · 31/03/2019 14:11

Not sure about liberal wings of Islam. Muslim opponents of these extremist views seem conspicuous by their absence. I’m struck by the fact that on all the interviews I’ve seen, the parent being interviewed talks about “we think… we believe… we say…”. Presenting the religion’s/community’s viewpoint, rather than their own.

The whole situation reminds me a bit of the reaction of some old-fashioned bits of Christianity to the release of Monty Python’s Life Of Brian. Archaic attitudes which were roundly condemned and mocked by the media. The media’s a bit more frightened of mocking Islam though, look what happened at Charlie Hebdo.

M4J4 · 31/03/2019 20:23

Muslim opponents of these extremist views seem conspicuous by their absence.

Or they're just busy living their lives? They don't have to justify themselves to you.

Anyway, countless Muslims have spoken up, you just don't want to listen.

Mummyshark2019 · 31/03/2019 20:26

Well we were at a school's church mothering Sunday service and the priest said that at this school they don't condone two boys or two girls hugging and kissing! So it is not just a Muslim thing op!

StoneofDestiny · 31/03/2019 21:42

Mummyshark2019
What denomination and what church was that? I'm sure if it's their confirmed view, they'd be happy to advertise it.

Sudofuckoff · 06/04/2019 18:02

@Mummyshark2019

Given that you have no problem with the laws in Dubai, where it is illegal to be okay, I'm guessing you fully support that.

iloveham · 23/09/2019 17:43

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MrsMaiselsMuff · 23/09/2019 17:46

Zombie thread

jechtsphere · 24/09/2019 20:40

It really is a problem

FrankSlater · 20/01/2020 03:48

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