To think the world has a big white supremacy problem?

[GardenVariety]

Is anyone actually surprised that this has happened? It is shocking and sickening, but let’s face it, it has been so acceptable for so long to vilify muslims, to abuse muslims, to attack muslims - politicians have made careers out of this. Is it any wonder that yet another white supremacist has murdered muslims and has received praise for doing so by keyboard warriors on various platforms.

I (and most muslims in the West) have been dealing with the aftermath of 9/11 by being held responsible for every terrorist atrocity. Dealing with knee-jerk reactions and responses became the norm for me since then. Every terror attack, grooming ring, extremist preacher became my responsibility to explain, condemn and apologise for. I was asked why muslims don’t put double-page ads in the paper to apologise and condemn. I was told that I shouldn’t be surprised at the hostility towards muslims because the few give everyone a bad name.

So here I am, wondering if those people (all white) who were quick to vilify my religion and me and demanded an apology and explanation for the latest newspaper headline will now explain today’s headlines to me. Will they explain why white people do this? Will they give me a full breakdown of his manifesto, explain each name listed on the white terrorist’s guns, explain the choice of music on the video, explain why he filmed it, explain why he had so much support (white terrorist supported by other whites, therefore all whites must be terrorists) and take out ads in national papers apologising for being white. After all it was a white person who did this and just like all muslims were held accountable, will all whites be held accountable too?

I have noticed that everyone who was quick to scream "ban the burka" has had absolutely nothing to say in this case.

Also, they haven't overly used the word terrorist. It's been mentioned, but not as much as if the religion role were reversed.

Had it been a Muslim man in a Christian church, there would be a much bigger uproar.

I'm barely a quarter way through my life and I'm so ashamed to live in such a judgemental and naive world.

Personally, I think much of it is to do with the socialisation of men to suppress emotions other than anger Indeed, I also feel that for some men fault or blame doesn’t lie with their actions but the blame is shifted to others & hence the need to hurt “them”. I don’t know how we stop it

A lot has to do with the fact that men have power - and in the same way that white people do - and their success and power is often on and over the bodies of women. This includes in Maori culture where women are second class and where Maori men beat them and terrorise them with guns. DV is rife in Maori communities. Don't want to derail because I agree about white supremacy, but there are gendered elements that should not be ignored, including that those doing the raping and pillaging in colonial times were men.

No the issue being discussed was whether the world had a problem with white supremacy.

I can't see where the OP ask if there is a problem with white supremacy which is unsurprising as it is pretty obvious there is hence the attack in NZ in the first place. OP is asking whether "all white will be held accountable" in the way Muslim are following attacks by Muslim extremist.

Jessica started talking about her culture before anyone else so if anyone derailed it was her.

10IAR, your support and the support of other posters means a lot.

It tells me that humanity can transcend barriers regardless of colour or creed.

Just saw this and it made me so happy:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-47595582

Can’t attach the picture, so providing the link instead.

I think the world has a big problem with free speech.

YetanotherSpartacus, this thread is about white supremacy, please do not derail with issues of domestic violence and start another thread. I know that last year (or was it the year before) 139 women died in the UK due to male violence.

Here is another link regarding white supremacy violence in the last few years.

www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/16/a-history-of-recent-attacks-linked-to-white-supremacism

I agree with FriarTuck that the UK isn't a total hotbed of white supremacy.

However, the racist and islamaphobic far right are a growing problem and their ideas are being normalised. Unfortunately, too many people are at least partially sympathetic to their views.

To be fair I wasn't derailing with domestic violence, I was responding to the posts about masculinity, pointing out that there are gendered elements present (and that male power and violence is cross cultural and exists in Maori communities too). Men are mainly responsible for violent attacks whether these be against Muslims or anyone else, and this is about male power.

@TheDarkLady

I have to see that labelling as "the far right" is appalling. What makes it the far right, and not the "far left".

How does this extremism always attract a "right-wing" label.

I have never noticed the USSR being especially solicitous of the rights of minorities. The German party we dare not name was "National Socialist"

Well that's the label used in this country and others and I prefer it to white supremists myself. What label do you think should be used?

As I say, I don't see why it's "far right". In this country the labour party are showing plenty very threatening and scary racial hatred of their own. How is that different? How do we know which way this guy voted?

The one thing we can all agree on it is is just about always men to blame.

I haven't read the later part of this thread so this may have been covered, but OP you said islamsphobic hate crime constitutes half of all hate crime - that's not true. The latest stats (for England & Wales anyway) show that race crime makes up 78%, sexual orientation 11%, religious hate 7%, disability hate crime 7%, and transgender hate crime 2%.

There's a crossover between the groups so some of the race hate crime crosses with religious hate crime. There was also a huge spike in hate crime after the referendum, and smaller spikes after the London Bridge, Westminster, Manchester arena and Finsbury Park mosque attacks.

So a clear corollation but islamophobic attacks are not half of hate crimes. Islamaphobic hate crime is also made up in almost equal measures with anti Semitic hate crime too.

• where I've just put "crime" I obv meant hate crime btw!

Just as Muslims don’t and shouldn’t be expected to apologise for acts of extremists acting today. British people don’t and shouldn’t be expected to apologise for the specific acts of colonisers hundreds of years ago in another country. We do learn about the British Empire in school and mainly about its negative impacts.
Well in that case you weren’t listening or you weren’t taught very well or very much. India only became independent in the 1940s, Hong Kong in 1997. The British empire was thriving for half of the 20th Century – not exactly hundreds of years ago. The industrial revolution that contributed to Britain’s economy for a long time after was given a boost from the profits made in the slave trade and the trade with slave-owning nations. Also interesting that you talk about Muslims and British people in a manner that suggests they are totally separate, maybe you also have failed to notice that there are a number of British Muslims, born and bred! In addition, the attitudes towards other countries/ethnicities that were part of the ideas that justified grabbing other lands were linked to misleading/patronising/racist labels such as ‘primitive’. Many parts of the world are still suffering from the fallout of the British Empire and the ways in which it was ended – the British played a huge role in the way Israel was created/land carved up and the tensions that now exist, similar issues re: India and Pakistan, the list is long. Try reading more recent work on the consequences of Empire and its link to racism Akala’s ‘Empire: Race and Class in the Ruins of Empire’ for example.

I’ve been thinking of not saying anything. I don’t want to be misquoted or misunderstood. Happens a lot on MN.

So I will say just this. What on earth is wrong with with people that they think that opening fire on other humans is ok. What’s going wrong in the world that people like this are still being socialised in this mindset.

Dottie... do you really think that’s enlightening information? I learned that at age 11!

What I am saying is that I am not responsible for it. Not that I agree with it.

Yes the world has a problem... but I don't think that problem is
white supremacy ... it has collectively a problem with groups of mad, deranged and brainwashed people that are filled by some misplaced beliefs of superiority allowing them to take lives of other people (lesser beings according to their teachings). And let's not forget, all this is as old as humanity itself.
I don't think it's healthy for whole nations or religious groups to walk around apologizing for some deranged persons / groups crime, just because they have a common denominator or two. (Like skin colour, calling their God by the same name or coming from the same geographic region.)

Had it been a Muslim man in a Christian church, there would be a much bigger uproar.

And yet not many people mention the Roman Catholic cathedral bombings killing 20 in southern Philippines in January. Or near constant attacks on Christians in the Middle East.

Let's not make this a Christian vs Muslim argument. This is a racist white supremacy terrorist attacking a Muslim church. Just as attack on Christian churches are from religious extremist terrorists.

No, that would be ridiculous. Just as any demands for an apology you may have received were ridiculous.

Nope, it's not ridiculous.

I am discovering that it is an uncomfortable feeling “responsible” for outrages committed in the name of people of my ethnicity and culture. A feeling Moslems are familiar with. It is never fair to blame a particular race, culture or religion for the actions of an extremist few.

“British people don’t and shouldn’t be expected to apologise for the specific acts of colonisers hundreds of years ago in another country”

But maybe white British people should recognise the legacy of that colonisation (and worse).

Recognise and acknowledge white privlige (and understandcwhat it actually means... before someone pops up and says ‘I’m White and poor and not privileged ’), make a stand against racism, shut up with the whining about ‘why can’t we sell Gollies, you can’t do anything these days’ and stop stereotyping people.

Yes I get the legacy. However, I refuse to feel personally guilty for the acts of some elite men under direction of rulers of the time. And hence understand the position of Muslims when they feel angry when they are called to action when there is an extremist terrorist act. I am addressing the points in the initial OP.

Muslim church
Mosque!

what