To ask what's so great about private school

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So my friend was privately educated, and so was her partner. They put their school aged children in a very prestigious private school but then had to take them out and move in with her parents. I don't quite know what happened but I think they overstretches themselves financially.
Now her two children are happily settled into the local state school but she still insists that she will be moving them back to private school in the future. My question is why would you decide to do this if you can't really afford to?
I was state school educated from a single parent family and went to a terrible primary school, but I have great memories. My friend and I actually do the same job, we are both admin assistants on a few quid more than minimum wage. I don't think that her private education has actually benefited her at all.
I tried to ask her what exactly she felt that a private education gave you that a state education didn't. She used the example of writers visiting the school, inspiring children to write and improve literacy. I have a creative writing degree, nothing would have prevented me from writing stories, it's all I've ever wanted to do since I learnt to write. My best friend has a 2:1 degree in Literature from Oxford, she also went to a state school in a 'deprived area' and was raised by a single mum.
I honestly don't understand what a private education gets you apart from possibly helping you to make contacts. It's certainly not more important than trying to buy your own home, in my eyes.
Fully expecting to get flamed.

However much people pretend and make excuses, the primary reason for sending a child to private school is snobbery.
If you are going to privately educate your child then go ahead, but please stop lying to yourself and your friends about 'musical or sporting opportunities' (all of which can take place out of school btw) and just admit it's because you think little Jenny or Johnny are better than all those 'common children' and you'd really rather they didn't have to mix with them.

I was state educated myself, and (back in the Stone Ages) I remember one of my friends at grammar school saying that her father saw no point in paying for her to be educated privately while she was receiving an excellent education in the state system. I realise that things might have been very different if I had not passed my 11+, but this was in the dim and distant past when "grammar school oiks" were causing something of a stir when they got to university, giving the privately educated elite a run for their money.
When I trained as a teacher, it never occurred to me to teach anywhere but in the state system (and yes, I got a grant!) and was there, fully committed for nearly 20 years.
Then the cuts started biting, and budgets became an increasing issue. I basically found that I had "priced myself out of the market" by wilfully becoming more experienced and better qualified (I studied part-time for a second degree, to be better qualified in my specialist subject). Putting it bluntly, hard-pressed heads could have the option of me, or two younger teachers, past the expense of the induction year, even if they were likely to leave after a short stay. Crunch time tends to be when they want to live more permanently in the school's catchment area, maybe start a family.
Quite by chance, I ended up doing supply work in an independent school, something I had never contemplated.
As well as having a smaller class, adequately equipped, I found that my experience and specialist qualifications were seen as positive assets; parents valued the stable staffing and well-qualified staff.
So when a permanent job came up, I applied and got it, and rather guiltily "ratted out".
I am well aware that everybody is already paying for their child's education, through their taxes, and it is wrong that they should have to pay for it twice.
But what can you do when experience and expertise come to be regarded as liabilities?

There are 33,000 state schools in the country. How can you possibly say “state schools are......”?

There are 2000ish private schools- the one thing you can say about them is that they are all, to varying degrees, selective.

@Grumpyoldpersonwithcats - no. I absolutely disagree. We are not snobs and I take offence to you calling us that. Such a simple way to think.

'However much people pretend and make excuses, the primary reason for sending a child to private school is snobbery.'

What a complete load of shite

Certainly doesn't apply here either

Seeing the Eton Alumni in action in Parliament has made me think about the confidence & elitism public school education offers.
Can't see our local state school proudly putting Boris Johnson in the local paper.

I was privately educated because it was the right environment for me. 12 years in a small, friendly girls school and then two years boarding at a public school. The two years at the end especially were fantastic and I'm so grateful for them.

It's not a privileged bubble. There was a real social mix at my girls school and again at my boarding school; people were there on hefty music scholarships for example. My parents scrimped and paid my boarding school fees in instalments. My friends now are a real mix.

I was a straight A student although I didn't go to schools that hot housed or made rigid academia their mission statement. I found uni harder though, (I did the wrong degree, in all honesty) and I don't have the most stellar job now. My parents, when I asked, said that they don't consider the money wasted at all because education is never a waste, I was in the right environment for me to do well and I was happy. Plenty of people I went to school with have average jobs now, but they're happy and they seemed happy at school. I understand the confidence thing, too. I'm not especially confident in some ways, but I am in others and it often fools people. It's just a comfort zone, I think.

Private schools aren't perfect though. There were naughty kids who didn't want to be there and acted out and my public school had a druggie set. We knew who sold pills, who sold weed and who could get coke, but plenty of us didn't touch them. It's just called being a teenager. Ampleforth school is also famously druggy. Also, to the poster mentioning dick pics earlier, my school had a revenge porn incident before revenge porn was a thing. It can happen anywhere.

People on here who say that unless you go to one of 5 public schools, social contacts aren't a thing have too simplistic an understanding of social nuance though, I'd say. I've seen it in action and I am fairly well connected through school, uni and a hobby I have that I got into through that world (not polo) and being at home in that world is a social advantage. I do alright, I suppose. DP went to an okay comp and an okay uni, did much better than me at uni and has a better job. He's polished himself up on the way, too and is a good networker. But I am the person who taught him to pronounce certain words properly and he experienced London members clubs through me first. Silly examples but they've been of help to him professionally.

Selection, resources and parental support set independent apart from state.
Not having to take behaviourally or academically challenging students ( and the ability to remove those who are), more specialist teaching and having everyone onboard with the best possible outcome for the child.

I have taught in schools where families have put more than holidays on hold to send their children. It is staggering what people are prepared to do for top education and shamefull that the state can't provide adequate provision.
I wonder how indie staff retention compares to state?

“It's not a privileged bubble. There was a real social mix at my girls school and again at my boarding school; people were there on hefty music scholarships for example.“

Can you really not see the irony of this paragraph?

I used to feel like this OP, thought it was entirely down to the drive and talent of individuals and not education. However, I wanted to be a doctor when I was at school, got just about good enough GCSEs but really struggled at A level. I'd stayed at the local sixth form college and in hindsight they were crap. At the time I just accepted I wasn't clever enough and applied for nursing instead and loved it, still do. Butttt, all the doctors went to private school/colleges. So I think there lies my answer. If I can afford to send my DCs to private school I would.

If we could have afforded it I would have sent all 3 of my children to private schools. However, whilst the middle child and possibly the youngest would have thrived, I think the eldest would have really struggled. Whilst I don't think the quality of education is necessarily any better, I think that at private school, you don't get the option of failure if child can't be bothered. The whole ethos is geared to success in one way or another which may or may not be a good thing depending on your point of view.

I do think that private education opens doors that state education cannot in terms of connections made but also believe that if a child is going to do well, it will do well whichever school he/she attends although the path to success may well be smoother through private education.

I was bullied and didn't enjoy either of my private schools. No ambition to replicate it. I don't have a high income either.

There is another parent at my daughters state primary, and she loved her private education, and planning to move her daughter from 8 or 9.

I think it's based on your own experiences.

No Bertrand, but I think you can't see the huge classist chip on your shoulder in a lot of your own posts. People were there for a variety of reasons, but

Private school is a choice. It's one that gets people far too hot under the collar.

*but it was usually what people had deemed best for their child.

I would have sent my kids to private school if I could have afforded it.
I’m not a snob but just believe in getting the best education possible.
Education isnt just about books and school however, so we chose not to privately educate so we could afford to go on days out and holidays to interesting places, pay for activities and even tutoring if they need it.

Like most parents, I just want my kids to be happy and I think a good education and the choices that brings, will contribute to it.

My experience tells me ( and statistics bear it out) that those achieving exceptional rresults from state comprehensive schools have learned far more about themselves, are more resilient and maintain their internal drivers. The independently educated are more entitled, care less about achievement but are very good socially and confident in grander or foreign settings.

Which statistics show that the privately educated are more entitled and care less about achievement?

just admit it's because you think little Jenny or Johnny are better than all those 'common children' and you'd really rather they didn't have to mix with them.

Ok I’ll admit it? So what?

“No Bertrand, but I think you can't see the huge classist chip on your shoulder in a lot of your own posts.“

It’s not classist to acknowledge that most (not all) kids who are in a position to apply for music scholarships will be from the privileged middle classes. Nothing wrong with being privileged and middle class of course, but suggesting that a school is not a privileged bubble because it has
musical middle class privileged kids in it is a a bit of a stretch!

@Dapplegrey- plenty of my peers were really ambitious although I'm not as ambitious. I am in my own way, just not necessarily aggressively so.

I think it's more the traditional clientele like the landed gentry who fill that statistic. They're comfortably off, they want their son to do well enough to get a decent job, make some firm friends and access some good opportunities. They're not necessarily bothered about him being the next nobel prize winner and he'll inherit a tidy sum. A public school education for them is not a huge investment that has to produce a stellar result. Tim-nice-but-dim can get ABB at a school that has a good reputation but isn't a brains factory, do art history at an RG but not Oxbridge uni, be a star on the cricket team and still play socially, become a solicitor in the local county town and have a good friendship circle- and he'll have done well.

Ah I see- music perhaps wasn't the best example (I was a chorister at school so I knew more of the music scholars which is why it sprang to mind first) but academic scholarships, all rounder scholarships and art and sport scholarships had diverse uptake.

DSHathaway.
Thank you for answering my question.

From reading many of these threads it seems those who oppose private school (ie Bertrand) think its elitist and a waste of money but should be taxed at corporate rates not a charity, that it doesn't provide any discernible benefit as the number of "private school" students in universities and politics is fewer than "state school" students and so those who pay are idiots.
Those who like private education (me) choose it based on our feelings of what is best for our kids and perceive a real value to it and so are willing to pay for it.
That seems to be where discussions peter out after about 800 messages in my experience

@Dapple, you're welcome. I know it's not the stats answer you want, but I think that probably is an explanation for a percentage of people. I know quite a few Tims!

“Today 09:32 Grumpyoldpersonwithcats

However much people pretend and make excuses, the primary reason for sending a child to private school is snobbery.
If you are going to privately educate your child then go ahead, but please stop lying to yourself and your friends about 'musical or sporting opportunities' (all of which can take place out of school btw) and just admit it's because you think little Jenny or Johnny are better than all those 'common children' and you'd really rather they didn't have to mix with them.”

**Grumpyoldpersonwithcats
Please explain when I became a snob? Was it when, as I explained above, I sent my DC to State school, or when DC came home with a black eye from bullying and school were not dealing with it and I moved him to an independent? I am unaware of any local orchestra who allow kids to join who aren’t very accomplished at their instrument. In school everyone who wishes to be can be in orchestra. My DH grew up in a council house and my family are immigrants please explain what you mean by “common children”.