Anyone with a quiet child? - upset at what teacher has said at parents eve

[Afternooninthepark]

Dd is 10 and in year 6.
Tonight was her parents evening. Each year we are told that dd is very quiet which is fine not a shock as I know she is one of the quiet ones, the world is full of different personalities, we can’t all be loud and super confident.
However, tonight the teacher made a real issue about it. She told me she thought dd was too quiet, never participated and that she thought her self esteem was extremely low. She even went on to say that she thought if dd had her way ‘she would crouch into small ball and hide under the table’! She also suggested she should speak to the Relate counsellor??!!
I told the teacher this was a bit of shock to me. Dd is quiet but at home she is witty and funny, always happy, very very arty and creative, has a big love of animals and just a lovely, loving, kind & wonderful daughter.
She never says she hates school, always goes in happily and very rarely complains about much.
I’ve asked dd if she is happy at achool and she says she is and doesn’t understand why the teacher is saying this.
I’m upset and worried now. It’s as though the teacher thinks being quiet is a major flaw or that there is some underlying issue as to why she is quiet. And why on earth would she think that just because she is quiet that it means she has low self esteem??
Anyone else with a quiet child?

They always said this about dd1 at primary. I got the impression sometimes that they thought she was a bit odd. Part of it was that some kids in the class weren't that nice to her. Dd2 they loved and said she had good social skills.

The teachers at secondary are really positive about dd1. They find her well behaved and she's happy socially. She contributes in class now. Dd2 is showing signs she may start getting a bit naughty at secondary!

In many ways wish I taught more students who were quiet! However, in some subjects at secondary school (like mine - MFL), talking really isn't optional. I'm not really an extrovert (in spite of being a teacher) and I do understand how hard it is for quiet students to speak up. An oral exam is even more traumatic for them than for everyone else, but it's so much worse if they have barely ever spoken the language out loud in front of teachers or their peers. Now that languages are not compulsory at GCSE, I think many able but quiet students are put off taking them, which is a real shame.

I also think your comment about “loud, brash and vacuous” people a bit off.
I’d be very wary you aren’t sharing that attitude with DD because it was be horribly smug.

If you are shy, the worst thing is when people keep on about it and tell you that you are too quiet. It is actually their attitude that is causing the problems. If they would just relax and wait until you have something to say, that will be fine. Nothing shuts a quiet child up more than someone scrutinising them and urging them to 'say something'.

yoga of course I don't share this with dd! But I stand by my words, the world is full of loud, brash, vacuous people these days. You only have to look at Instagram and YouTube to see (and hear!!) that.

I was always a quiet shy child. I think I probably lacked self esteem and self confidence but I was happy. I hated being asked questions in class or having to read out loud or take part in assemblies, plays etc. I got more stressed being forced to do these things - I much preferred staying in the background.
I have got much more confident as I've got older - if your daughter is happy then she is fine - the teacher needs to remember that all children are different. X

I was the quiet kid but seemingly happy at home. It developed into anxiety, incredibly low self esteem and depression. I wish I'd been encouraged into drama classes. I loved drama as a kid but was never allowed to take part or be in plays etc because I was too quiet.

I still remember that when I came home from school with my Year 8 report, just about every teacher had written that I was a quiet pupil. My mum wrote a note back to say she had known that for the last 13 years and could they please tell her stuff she didn't know, like how I was doing academically. Your daughter sounds lovely.

slowknitter - I didn't particularly enjoy oral exams, but got through them and got A*s in my MFL GCSEs. Selective mutism is a different kettle of fish however.

Definitely recommend Susan Cain's book.

I have arranged to see the teacher next week. I’m going to look into after school clubs of some kind for dd. She already goes to youth club and horse riding. I’ve ask but she doesn’t want to do drama or dancing.

Not RTFT but I'm a teacher. Absolutely nothing wrong with being quiet but if she is quiet to the point where she doesn't participate/answer out in class then it is something I would bring up too. It sounds like the teacher hasn't phrased it particularly sensitively though.

If a pupil isn't happy raising their hand or taking an active role in group activities by this point in the year, then it usually (not always!) indicates more than just being 'a bit quiet'. It's something I would definitely make parents aware of, as their personality at home isn't always the same personality we see in the classroom.

Some of the 'quiet ones' will be eaten alive in year 7. It's impossible to spot it happening 100% of the time. Partly because a lot of things are picked up on via hearing something as they/you walk past.

So it can be a problem to not be able to speak up or make a fuss in school, even if they're loud and confident at home.

Brilliant response from your mum @GhostsToMonsoon

It can be harder for teachers to see what is going on with quiet pupils, but they don't usually have to rely on just what the child says in open discussions.

I think the best feedback I got from a teacher was when I was 14 or so. The teacher said that she thought I must be quite selfish. My parents were shocked because I was usually described as a diligent quiet little mouse. The teacher elaborated that it was clear that I knew and understood so much, and it would be kind if I would share what I understood with the rest of the class. That hit home, and I did join in a lot more after that.

holy when you say something ‘more’ than being a bit quiet, what do you mean by that? Learning difficulties, emotional issues? I’m at a loss to think what she really was getting at (hence the meeting next week) I don’t think the teacher was even going to mention any of this. I just happened to ask at the end ‘oh btw, how is she doing socially?’ then all of this came out!

Hi Op, I could have written this exact post about my DD! I've come to the conclusion that some teachers just cannot get their head around introverts and don't really know how to get the best out of them. My DD goes through spells of trying to be more outgoing - volunteering for things, putting her hand up, auditions and all sorts. After a while of not being anywhere near chosen (because actually Teacher if you're going to make a Thing out of this and my DD then does the very brave thing of volunteering then you should damn well give her a chance and pick her occasionally!) and seeing it's the same old faces that do she just goes back to keeping her head down, working her socks off and being happy.
Sharpstick you sum it up perfectly.

She's very excited about starting secondary school this summer and at the open evening we spoke to the deputy head of Year who told me how they work on resilience and they (in a gentle way!) don't just accept and "let" any child shy away from new experiences, coming out of their comfort zones, taking part in debates and expressing opinions in a discussion. I'm feeling really optimistic that she will blossom sobs that my DD is growing up

Disclaimer - I promise I'm not having a go at teachers generally here merely expressing annoyance at our one! I have massive, massive respect for the profession and actually think secondary requires bloody superpowers. Mrs Keats there's really no teacher bashing going on though. Green Tulips I didn't realise there were targets as you have said so thanks for sharing, that's useful to know. However as a learning professional this teacher should be recognising different learning styles and adapting her approach accordingly.

OP I think the meeting to talk with the teacher will be really helpful so you can hear evidence based reasons why she is thinking this and not just comparing DD to the louder pupils. It also gives you a chance to explain the other side of her that you see at home and socially. Then depending on how the discussion goes you can then explore together if there may be underlying issues.

I think it sounds like you are doing a great job. Is she excited about secondary?

Woolly I love how your teacher said that!

As @woollyheart said it's other people's attitudes towards quieter personalities that make an issue out of it. This has had a hugely detrimental effect on my self esteem and anxiety levels over the years. You would expect teachers to be more sensitive to it.

Outside of my small family circle I was incredibly quiet and shy as a child. It didn't help that I blushed profusely when drawn attention to!

I found that people, especially loud ones, had quite a negative attitude to me being quiet. Even though as I got older and moved on from school I became more comfortable socially people would still go on about how quiet I used to be even years later after I had made real progress! I'm never going to be as loud and extrovert as the majority but I don't see that as a negative quality. I also don't see any people should hold it against me.

Your daughter sounds lovely and it sounds as if she has a very supportive DM to help her build her resilience.

I was like that as a teenager (although confident when younger). A teacher suggested counceling and I was shocked that he suggested it. In hindsight I really wish I would have reached out for support at that age. I would have understood myself a lot better and possibly had more confidence today as an adult.

Thank you magnificent that means a lot.

tell me the school your dd is going to sounds great. I hope ours is just as supportive, haven’t had the open evening yet, I’ll be asking quite a few questions.
Dd is very excited about going over to secondary school, she doesn’t show any wobbles and is really looking forward to it.
Dd really doesn’t show signs of such shyness anywhere else, I’ve alway encourage her do be independent from a young age, I’ve always done things like give her the money in shops and she will pay for the things or go up to people to ask for directions etc. It’s baffling.

I have a quiet DD with oodles of self esteem and a loud DS with very low self esteem. What a crock of shit.

This sounds like my mum at many parents evenings when I was a kid.

Some teachers loved the fact that I was quiet, and some thought it was a massive problem - my mum just had to keep repeating that there's nothing wrong with being quiet.

I did have phases of being excruciatingly shy - now that is NOT fun, BUT (massive 'but') having loud people keep pressuring you to "talk more" or "be louder" with no empathy certainly does not help.

If your daughter is lacking in confidence then perhaps she could do with some help, but it's very possible that she's just quiet, and that is absolutely FINE!

My daughter's very early teachers often said she was quiet in the class - no-one ever said it was a problem but I was puzzled how people saw her as quiet in school when at home she was fun and funny. She seemed to develop in confidence and in year 6 was a school ambassor where she would speak infront of groups of people including parents - very self assured or so we thought. She also did a lot of drama out of school and would often perform on stage.
Cut to high school and she literally feel to bits - the quietness was a symptom of her anxious nature that has now evolved into OCD.
There is nothing wrong with quiet people - I am an introvert myself. But the distinction you need to please work out is - is she quiet because that's her personality...or is she quiet because she is anxious. For me - if a school/the doctors offered me free services in terms of Relate to find this question out - I would grab the opportunity with both hands but that is really for you to decide. The only thing I would say - anything that is happening with your child now gets so so so much worse when they hit puberty and start not only being hormonal but wanting more independence and choice.

This has made me very cross actually.

I also have a quiet and considered DD1 who was known throughout primary school for being pretty quiet and studious. However, rather than blaming her or ignoring her, the teachers worked hard on enabling her to speak up and grow in confidence - a comic part in the school play where she unexpectedly shone, a chance to join the debating team, an opportunity to read a short prayer in church, a chance to show a potential new teacher around the school etc.

She has recently gone into Yr7 at a secondary school where she knew no-one else. She's still very quiet but yesterday was voted by the rest of her classmates to be form vice captain. I couldn't be prouder of her. Being quiet is not a flaw that needs to be 'sorted out'.

I think my tack with the teacher meeting would be to say that you are concerned to get to the bottom of what was said at parents evening, particularly the comment that the teacher often forgets she is there.

I would also be asking the teacher, now she has raised this 'issue' with you, what measures she is putting in place to encourage your DD to speak out that you can support at home. And keep asking the same question until she either admits she isn't doing anything or comes up with some sensible suggestions - have some suggestions of your own up your sleeve. It's not your DD's responsibility to change her personality but the teacher's to encourage her more. A calm and sensible discussion might just prompt the teacher into thinking about it a little harder.

Good luck.

A little more quietness in the world certainly wouldn't go amiss.

The difficulty with very quiet students is that the whole system revolves around a certain amount of being extrovert. Teachers are expected to demonstrate that they are involving everyone in a lesson, aware of how progress is going and to know their pupils well. If you have a very reserved child in the room, those expectations can be rather challenging especially in secondary subjects where there is one hour per week. It can take much of the year to get to know some of the quietest members of a class as there is only a maximum of 38 hours, and probably several less with INSET, off timetable, trips etc.

Quietly confident is a positive characteristic. Quiet and anxious, not so much, but it can be hard to break through to know more. Obviously far easier at primary than secondary.

There is also the personality switches that some children have at school... my hyperactive, foghorn Tigger, is a placid mouse at school!

This irritates me beyond belief. Through all my school days and early stages of my working life 'quiet' was included in my school report/work performance review as something that needed to be addressed. The assumption always seemed to be that a quieter personality must mean that I was lacking in confidence or social skills. In fact I was very confident in my own abilities and perfectly capable of making friends but chose not to compete for air time in class etc with the louder children. I knew that I was smarter and knew the answers so why on earth should I battle to answer all the questions etc. Similarly I was very good at finding people with shared interests to befriend so had no interest in playing the popularity game against the louder brasher girls.

I would, however, watch out to make sure that your DD's quiet nature is not used by teachers etc who don't understand it as a reason for her to miss out on CV enhancing opportunities. For example, in my case at school I regularly applied for house captain/head girl/team leader etc positions and the only reason ever given for turning me down was that the teachers felt I lacked the confidence needed for the role (public speaking etc). My view on this was that actually I would be perfectly happy doing this but had never been given a chance to show anyone (and in fact, if they felt confidence was a problem surely they should have encouraged me when I wanted to have a go). In later life I went on to have many paid and voluntary roles that involved public speaking/dealing with the public etc.