To think being slim should be normal for most people.

[DevilishDebbie]

By slim i mean sizes 8 to 12.

Obviously you get a minority who are not in this range naturally but for 80% of people this size should be natural, say they eat a reasonable diet of between 2000-3000 calories.

Im so sick of people at work making out i am abnormally thin for being a size 10. I watch what I eat but dont deprive myself. The same people making me out to be lucky to be slim eat fried chicken or pizza for lunch and seem to be able to demolish a whole pack of biscuits at 3 o clock.

Aibu to think that the normal human man/woman should be a size 8-12 and that to attain or maintain this does not require super human discipline or strength.

@talkingpaece You do understand that those are unusually strict rules? Egg is an emulsifier, and pectin (ie, apples, some other fruits) is a stabiliser.

What do you actually eat?

Also. Yes, obesity costs the NHS a fortune, BUT I deliberately avoided talking about this old nugget because all sorts of self-inflicted diseases cost the NHS a fortune. Obesity, however, is a bit unique in how it affects the staff and the patient. The obese often require special equipment because they've outgrown it - ie. bariatric chairs/wheelchairs, special machinery, reinforced beds. Sometimes life-saving procedures become difficult or impossible. It's hard to find veins if they're covered in layers upon layers upon layers of fat. Surgery (and anaesthesia) become far riskier and far more difficult to carry out. And the sheer physical strain on the staff. The obese require more people to lift, to transport, and to provide personal care. What would only require one or two nurses (washing, for example) becomes a very difficult job for at least 4 people. I feel sorry for those who have to lift up these obese bodies, risking serious harm to their own.

The OP mentioned sizes 8 to 12. You do know there are a hell of a lot of sizes between a size 12 and someone who needs this kind of help dont you?

e,g. someone who is a size 14 16 18 would not need that kind of help . and yet you are talking as if when someone goes over a 12 they need bariatric help. Fucking batshit

oh and as we are moaning about what its costing in taxes perhaps i should start moaning about some posters DCs As im child free by choice. As my taxes are paying for it i guess i can tell you how to parent.

Dont mean you Buffalo or any of the other nicer posters

HelenaDove. Yes your taxes may well go towards the cost of educating our DC but you never know, you might need one of our DC to wipe your backside when you’re in that nursing home? Or treat you in hospital if you have a stroke? Support you through dementia? Sort your body ahead of your funeral with care and respect? Or, depending on your age, do all of that for a member of your family or a close friend instead.

It’s all relative in terms of weight which is why using dress size is not the best indicator. However, it is an ‘average term and dress size is based on roughly 12lb steps eg to go from a size 16 to a 14 would mean the average person would need to lose around 12lb.

The average dress size in the UK is a 16 which means to be just within the average healthy BMI I.e under 25 you would need to be at least 6ft 2”. ONS stats show the average height for women in the UK is 5ft 3.

Now I fully appreciate these are all averages and it doesn’t take account for body shape, muscle mass etc but that’s how averages work and it certainly indicates that with an average size of 16 and and average height of 5ft 3 there are a LOT of overweight people in the UK.

As a country, we are getting fatter and fatter. Fact.

We need to do something about it. Fact. Some of those changes are complicated. However, many are not and those people can make changes by stopping all the excuses and taking personal responsibility for their health.

This calculator is quite interesting. It works out if your weight is average for your region and age group. 66% of women in my region/age group are overweigh, obese or very obese. I think that's quite a significant majority
www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-43697948

@feelingverylazytoday. That’s really interesting. It shows in my region that 64% are overweight/obese/morbidly obese. 1% are underweight.

Wtf 2000-3000 cals? I’m a 12 and I burn around 1600 per day according to Fitbit. I lose weight in a strict 1300 cal diet.
If I ate 2000 cals a day I’d be piling on the pounds.

67% of women in my region - and only 31% are a healthy weight (4% underweight)

That's not good. Interesting calculator -thanks for posting foreverlazy . I might print it off and show it the next person that asks if I have worms, or live on lettuce. I'm healthy, not underweight.

"@Gwenhwyfar I smoke, I drink. I vaguely eat healthily. I’m 37 and I got ID’d at Christmas.
Smoking is a horrible habit but it doesn’t age you as much as people say."

Pink. I was talking on average, not just you.
I can usually tell when someone is a smoker, although I think there are other factors that make guessing it easier.

Helena, your strawmen are really quite silly. The fact remains - obese patients are a huge strain on the NHS and not just financially. HCPs are leaving the profession in their droves - I can't see many people going into nursing, what with the obesity crisis. I sure wouldn't want to have to haul 200lb + bodies day in day out.

What's going to happen to these patients if there's no one to take care of them, hm?

A lot of HCP are overweight and obese themselves. Not the majority or in as quite high a number as the general population but still a lot. You'd think if all it took was education,awareness of outcomes and consequences and plenty of physical activity there wouldn't be any.

It was hard keeping a straight face when a nurse twice my width kept banging on and on that I'm overweight (my weight was irrelevant to the appt).

@CoffeeMilkNoSugar

I agree obesity is a problem, there's no doubt.
But no one should be having to haul anyone, 200lb or not. Because of the damage it does to those lifting and those being lifted. There's equipment such as hoists, slide sheets, stand aids and wheelchairs - and bariatric versions available. Now if you said lack of this equipment is a problem due to budget cuts in the NHS and greedy owners in private care homes I'd wholeheartedly agree.
There's also a lot more to people leaving the nursing and care sector than a percentage of patients being overweight. To be honest in my days of being an HCA I'd have rather cared for an obese, non violent patient than one that is of healthy weight but bites, scratches, kicks and punches. That's far more of a problem.

It’s interesting that some posters on here rely on whataboutery (we know we’re overweight but what about those who smoke, what about those who drink...).

Fact is that smoking in the UK is declining, alcohol consumption in the UK is declining, particularly amongst the younger generation. Obesity is still increasing.

@Dorsetdays

It's also interesting that the posters who insist that being overweight is purely down to laziness, and lack of will power and people just use excuses, avoid answering the question that myself and a couple of others have posted -

If that's the case then it must follow that people who are underweight and are also lazy, lack willpower and just use excuses to not keep themselves healthy. Because in both scenarios it's about the way the person views and uses food and eating. You can't simplify one without simplyfying (I'm not sure that's even a word but I'm tired!) The other.

Brilliant - yes some people will be underweight because they lack discipline to organise their eating habits. However at 4% (in my area) it's hardly an epidemic. Obesity is.

But the point of the OP was that we are now seeing "normal" weighted people as too skinny when they're not. I agree with the OP -normal should be average.

@brilliantidiot. I’m not sure which posters you’re referring to but I’ve been clear thoughout that there are lots of medical reasons for people being overweight (and I include MH in that obviously).

There have also been posters on here clarifying themselves that they are/were overweight simply because they eat to much, eat the wrong things, don’t take any exercise etc so those are the people I refer to.

Tbh even if there’s a medical reason, particularly emotional issues, there is still support out there available in many cases which can help. You have to choose to access it though.

And actually, yes, I will be blunt and say that sometimes it IS down to sheer willpower. I could quite easily polish off a family size bag of crisps or a second cake as much as the next person if I didn’t physically put them away or make a conscious decision to stop. It’s not always easy but you have to take responsibility for your own actions. If you slip up and have a bad day food wise (or choose to have a day ‘off’ for a special occasion etc) that’s OK too but you make the decision to not do the same the next day, and the next...it’s a balance.

For context, occasionally people annoy me so much that I’d actually quite like to slap them, I don’t because I’m an adult and it would be the wrong thing to do so I make a conscious effort to control my actions and take responsibility for my decisions...

Anorexia, bullemia and indeed compulsive eating are recognised mental health disorders. Being underweight (or overweight) as a result of one of those conditions is is no way the same as being overweight or obese because a person fails to adequately monitor their diet over a number of years.

I’m also dismayed at how so many people are reluctant to confront their children being overweight because they are so terrified of doing some kind of emotional damage to them. Is the mental health of our children so fragile that they can’t cope with a simple message to eat more healthily, and why are we more scared of emotional damage than the massive effects of obesity?

@ShePutTheHamsterWhere - I've got as far down this thread as reading your comments on Thursday and I just wanted to say I am shocked that anybody could be as heartless as you seem to be for keeping on with your arguments around Buffalo's daughter. Even though you've been told that your assumptions were wrong you've come up with the excuse that you don't have time to read everything posted. Seriously think about this, you think it is OK to mock and be rude to a poster whose daughter is seriously ill and not even have the decency to apologise when you've been told that your assumptions are wrong? The internet may be faceless but this is a real human being you are speaking to. Just try to be a little kinder.

@OllyBJolly

Yes, but the repeated 'fat people just use excuses' 'move more eat less' get trotted out over and over. That it's all so simple etc. When it is as complex as undereating and the associated health risks. For me, I've already said it's a case of priorities, and using the calculator a pp posted I'm overweight, there's a whole host of reasons why someone is over or underweight. It's just when someone is overweight those reasons are deemed excuses and scoffed at (pun intended!) None of it is taken seriously and just dismissed - which is harmful. It's not right, no more than dismissing a person's reasons for being underweight and not eating enough to keep themselves healthy.

But the point of the OP was that we are now seeing "normal" weighted people as too skinny when they're not. I agree with the OP -normal should be average.

And I totally agree with this too as I've already said. But I think the obesity epidemic is more than just laziness and lack of willpower.

In a lot of cases obesity is the symptom of a problem, rather than the problem itself.

Help the person, help the problem, then hopefully that person can make changes.

All the willpower in the world won't help if you haven't got access to the right information or support.

You know there is so much wisdom on this thread, I mean posters REALLY know what causes obesity and they are not afraid to name and shame. It's admirable.

I cant help thinking though that this knowledge should be shared with doctors? I mean I was talking to a surgeon the other day and he was telling me about all the research that's going on in teaching hospitals and how close he feels the medical profession is to a breakthrough - for example identifying a hormone that causes some people to process calories in an entirely different way, you know, an shit like that.

What a loon. All he needs to do is read this thread because people herein have ALL the answers.

@Applesaregreenandred

I wished Buffalo's daughter well, I truly hope that she can recover from her demons, her physical weight is purely a symptom of obvious underlying issues. I say that from experience.

Buffalo has been, on the whole, rude and aggressive- although no one was to her.

I used the situation as an example....healthy weight, food knowledge and body positivity is something we should show everyone from a young age through example and education. If this was the case, more people would have the tools not to fall into a spiral of bad eating habits or using food as a way of control. That goes both ways. Too much food or too little.

I understand that her weight as a child was excessive due to steroids. It was Buffalo herself that described her daughter as fat.
Perhaps some early education and intervention, the girl understanding her situation and that other people's opinions and thoughts on her weight were not important, would mean that she wouldn't have had such a negative self image that she felt she had to go so far the other way.

I don't know her so I don't know her full story- only what her mother has chosen to share with the internet (but rebukes any opinion), but I hope that she gets well and this is a situation she can recover from and go on to thrive.

@dishingoutdone. Think you’re missing the point somewhat. No ones saying that ALL obesity is caused by the same issue. Clearly the NHS, including your surgeon friend, also don’t believe that otherwise they wouldn’t channel so much funding into healthy eating and exercise campaigns, offer clinics to educate people about healthy eating, refer people to weight loss groups and gyms etc etc.

There have been plenty of posters on her confirming that the reason they are/were overweight was purely down to simple facts. They ate too much, ate the wrong things, did no exercise.

THOSE are the people that are being referred to here.

Look people - when over half of all UK adults become underweight, then we'll have an anorexia epidemic and we'll probably want to tackle it. As things stand, we have an obesity epidemic which is a far bigger problem so let's concentrate on that.

And yes I agree with a PP re. children and 'emotional damage'.

"A lot of HCP are overweight and obese themselves. Not the majority or in as quite high a number as the general population but still a lot. You'd think if all it took was education,awareness of outcomes and consequences and plenty of physical activity there wouldn't be any."

I think 12-hour shifts and low-ish wages have a lot to do with that for nurses and assistants.