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Why are people still deluding themselves about Michael Jackson??

999 replies

waxahatchee · 26/02/2019 18:54

If any grown man I know invited children to sleep in his bed with him there would be absolutely no question about what was going on. I am sure that most people would agree, why are so many people still deluding themselves about this?? Makes me so cross, why do they even play his music on the radio??

OP posts:
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BertrandRussell · 07/03/2019 10:53


Usually, though not always. You can have paedophilia and not sexually abuse kids, and you can sexually abuse kids without having peadophilia attraction (much like raping a woman does not necessarily require attraction to her, more getting off on the power).”

Ah. MAP propaganda.

Pk37 · 07/03/2019 10:57

BlooperReel The maid then denied she saw anything and even stole stuff from his house to sell which unfortunately discredits her as a believable witness .
Again, I am not saying he was innocent, I just think more evidence is needed before we can say he is guilty

TheClitterati · 07/03/2019 10:59

the people speaking out about the abuse they suffered is evidence.

HowlsMovingBungalow · 07/03/2019 11:00

What evidence?

It is a historical child sex abuse case, with the offender being dead.

BertrandRussell · 07/03/2019 11:02

Fuck me, Jackson was good at this grooming stuff!

Absurditi · 07/03/2019 11:04

Ah. MAP propaganda.

Hardly, of course they can exploit that if they wish, but it is a fact that not everyone who abuses/molests a child is specifically attracted to them, as we already know that sexual assaults and abuses do not always involve orientation, but can be about power and control. That does not excuse it in the slightest, not does it make peadophilia "OK" either. In most cases, they go hand in hand, but there is a distinction in some cases.

I'm also not saying MJ wasn't a peadophile and child molester, I think he was.

SpiritedLondon · 07/03/2019 11:09

Ah. MAP propaganda

That’s a bit unfair - some attacks on children are opportunistic ( offenders may also attack an old woman if the opportunity arises) and not every paedophile goes on to have direct contact with children ( but they’re still paedophiles by virtue of the attraction). Problem is they’re living with that urge the whole time. I still wouldn’t invite one to tea.

Springwalk · 07/03/2019 11:13

I truly hope he rots in hell.

How those kids find a way to forgive their parents for their part in all of this is beyond me. How those kids now adults live with what happened day in and day out is beyond me.

It is one thing being abused in private, and quite another to be abused in front of the world, and the world remained silent for decades and decades.

We ALL have something to learn from this, we all need to know that standing up and saying something is not right, looking out for our kids, having a voice even when everyone else is silent is the only way to stop this.

Absurditi · 07/03/2019 11:14

Orientation, complete wrong word there. Attraction. You can sexually abuse/assault someone without finding them attractive, sexually appealing in the physical way. This is known in adults who abuse other adults, and it's known vulnerability of the person being abused in a big power play for them, so why do we discount it as merely propoganda when we consider this could carry to seeing a child's vulnerability as "the ultimate power play" so to speak, rather than specifically being attracted sexually to their bodies.
For MJ, power was definitely a big thing, he was so famous and loved, "The" MJ."

I'm actually sorry, I didn't mean it to be "noMap", this was something a forensic psychologist was talking about on a documentary, your comment reminded me of it Bertrand.

Absurditi · 07/03/2019 11:16

I still wouldn’t invite one to tea.

Yes. No disagreement there.

ElektraLOL · 07/03/2019 11:46

What did Sean Lennon say about MJ hurting animals?? It just gets worse 🙈

Slazengerbag · 07/03/2019 12:14

I’m truly aghast that people are still defending him!

When there is a high profile case in the news where a woman has been raped, if the accused is found not guilty everyone on here is frothing at the mouth saying we believe her. And rightly bloody so.

When the Jimmy Saville accusations come out everyone on here without a doubt believed his victims.

Why are people questioning these men? He has been accused countless times. It’s been proven that he shared a bed with children! People close to him have said his voice was deeper than the childlike voice he put in in public. He may of been one of the most talent musicians but it doesn’t excuse what he did.

If John next door spoke in a childlike voice and was having lots of children round and sharing his bed would you honestly believe it was innocent?

I am just disgusted that two of his victims have come forward and people are treating them the way they are. I hope to god that this doesn’t have a long term affect on other victims who are too scared to speak up.

Weirdwonders · 07/03/2019 12:19

Hands up - i was completely if the opinion that he was innocent a few days and pages of this thread ago. That documentary really changed my view.
If it’s all true, I still feel sorry for him. He had a shit childhood himself and it’s awful how that can echo down the generations and affect lives. I get the impression he created and believed his own version of the truth.

recrudescence · 07/03/2019 12:29

I suppose, theoretically, there’s a chance he’s innocent but I’m not buying it. In the same way, I am sure the Holocaust actually happened and men really landed on the moon.

BlooperReel · 07/03/2019 12:31

BlooperReel The maid then denied she saw anything and even stole stuff from his house to sell which unfortunately discredits her as a believable witness .
Again, I am not saying he was innocent, I just think more evidence is needed before we can say he is guilty

Granted, but she also says she was threatened, with losing her job, and her life. As for her stealing, being a thief, or tempted by fortune, does not also mean you never tell the truth. No witness is pure and virtuous.

As for evidence, it is historical sex abuse, as others have pointed out, what more evidence, other than witness testimony, would you expect? If it was just MJ and a boy in a room alone, many years' ago, there will be no physical evidence.

I think what needs to be looked at here, is probability. MJ admitted to sharing beds and rooms with young boys, we know that much, and we know it is not usual for a grown man to do this.

We have a maid who says she saw and found things that point towards overly sexual behaviour towards and around young boys.

We have more than one accusation from those who were children and spent copious amounts of time alone with Jackson, even now when the statute of limitations ahve passed meaning they cannot go after his estate for monetary gain.

We have those same men, speaking out despite knowing there are hardcore MJ fans mocking them, vilifying them, calling them liars etc.

On the balance of probability, which is more likely to be the truth:

A grown man is this ethereal, childlike lover of children who just wants to relive his lost childhood.

Or a grown man who was likely sexually abused himself, has a tonne of money and power, has an unhealthy sexual appetite for young boys, grooms them, their families and those around him with lavish gifts, holidays etc, earns their trust and abuses them?

I know where I'd put my money.

Aeroflotgirl · 07/03/2019 12:32

It seems for MJ it was a big act, portraying an image of a childlike person who just enjoys the company of children. What made me very uncomfortable seeing the Neverland documentary, was the inapropriate things he said about very young children, and his body language towards them. It gives some indication to the type of person he really was, and his superstar status rendered him untouchable and unquestionable. If he was ordinary Joe Bloggs from Number 56, he would have been banged up ages ago or people would be openly questioning his behaviour and trying to avoid their children going near him. They would be on their guard. Parents certainly would not be handing care of their children to him! It is amazing what perks superstar status brings.

Just because the maid was corrupt, and MJ was found innocent, does not mean he really was. It is amazing that money can buy you a red hot lawyer to get you out of things, if Hollywood was rife with paedophilia, he was a very busy man indeed. I do actually believe them, their accounts are similar, with similar abuse happening. James Safechuck showing the special rings and expensive jewlery MJ bought him to keep him sweet. I believe that they thought this abuse was normal, and never questioned it as they had never encountered it before and they did not know what is abuse, and what to look out for. Not like now!

Aeroflotgirl · 07/03/2019 12:33

They were awstruck with MJ satus, gravitas, and wealth.

ALannisterInDebt · 07/03/2019 13:06

I'm now completely convinced he is guilty.

He sounds like a sad, lost man, who had convinced himself he was in love with these boys. He was very very good at grooming them, and the trappings of fame and wealth made him a very successful molester.

I lay a lot of the blame with the parents, how could you ever allow your children to share a bed with a grown man (and a weird one at that!) disgusting.

ElektraLOL · 07/03/2019 13:15

I'm watching the documentary now too and am now of the opinion it's very unlikely he didn't abuse children.

I still think Wade Robson does not seem to be a decent or trustworthy character. But that's beside the point really. And the other man looks visibly damaged. As others have said there have been so many accusations that it's hard to see how he could be innocent tbh.

ElektraLOL · 07/03/2019 13:20

Is anyone else wondering what on Earth kind of childhoods his 3 children Prince, Paris and Blanket have had??? 😨

I remember him saying he snatched Paris from the delivery room and ran home with her still covered in placenta. I think that shows how disordered and selfish he was.

EnthusiasmIsDisturbed · 07/03/2019 13:25

MJ also creates a persona - a weirdo that seemed to be enternally young

It threw us off what he really was

Very much like Savile, Glitter, Woody Allen and many others

IrmaFayLear · 07/03/2019 13:33

In these cases I think that the parents should be vilified. All this "grooming" business... of course you can influence or dupe a child, but the behaviour of a lot of these parents whose dcs fall prey to famous people is disgraceful.

Elvis Presley, for example, had a penchant for young girls. Mothers would queue up where he happened to be to offer up their dds. Perhaps they didn't know the full extent of what might go on, but all the same all they saw was $$$$$ and a brush (so to speak) with fame.

ElektraLOL · 07/03/2019 13:41

Yes why did Safechuck's mother just accept that her hotel room was getting further and further away from theirs? She should be ashamed of herself tbh.

BertrandRussell · 07/03/2019 13:43

He was an excellent groomer.

IrmaFayLear · 07/03/2019 13:52

But I think that some parents find themselves a lot more susceptible to grooming when the groomer is rich and famous...

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