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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

SN Son shouted at by woman in cafe

184 replies

missmama12 · 23/02/2019 15:10

My family and I recently went out for a meal and my youngest DC has autism which causes him to be very hyperactive and agitated in public spaces and as a result of this, the woman on the table beside ours leaned over and shouted at my son due to him being too loud! I am at a loss what to do because I don't want my DS to miss out on days out with the family due to his disability. Any advice would be greatly appreciated, thank you!

OP posts:
cricketballs3 · 23/02/2019 17:19

As PP have said you will learn the main triggers and settlers. For DS19 (MLD & ASD) his settlers are lego, a card game or tablet; we have learnt over time the situations he struggles in but we have also gradually put him in difficult situations with our support and over time whilst he struggles he is not completely overwhelmed especially as he is aware that we will take steps to aid him/take him away.

Whilst I understand that a instant solution would be preferable unfortunately with ASD it's a long haul which is never over

Ellie56 · 23/02/2019 17:23

We always used to go early before it got too busy so 11.45 for lunch and 4.45 -5 pm for evening meal. That way we could get a corner table out of the way which suited DS.

We used to take books/ drawing stuff/lego/nintendo etc to occupy him, and we invariably went to child friendly places like Mcdonalds, pubs with play areas etc.

And next time some rude person says anything, I would glare at them and say, "My son has autism. What's your problem?" Angry

crimsonlake · 23/02/2019 17:25

This is a tricky one as I can see both sides. You want to be able to take your child to public places such as you have done, but equally other people have a right to enjoy their meal in peace. Generally taking little ones out for a meal is hard work and something I more or less gave up when my 2 were small as there was little enjoyment to be had trying to entertain them whilst waiting for a meal. What I am saying i that this is an issue for most parents of small children, not just those with special needs and you do have to be considerate of others and aware of the situation if they become a little noisy and impatient. There are plenty of fast food outlets where you can eat quickly or drive through even picnics so your son still gets the same experience, just quicker service.

importantkath · 23/02/2019 17:28

@missmama12 I feel your pain. Son is now almost 10 and we went for a late, simple cafe lunch today. He cried a lot because a) they didn't have his first choice of meal b) they didn't have his first choice of dessert. He was so stressed by the whole situation of going out for lunch and the things he likes to eat not being available that we just had to let him get it out of his system. (Thankfully we didn't have anyone around paying us the slightest bit of attention).

We tend to stick to mcds or have a picnic tbh, and save the restaurants for our once or twice a year dates.

ThanksThanksGin

ProudAS · 23/02/2019 17:29

I have autism and could (depending on my mental state at the time) find sitting near your DS in those circumstances distressing. I would be understanding if you explained it to me though.

ShowMeTheKittens · 23/02/2019 17:29

She sounds pretty horrible... but did you try to control his agitation and was it a cafe where everyone is squashed up? Loud noises really p me off, but I would maybe move.

Jaxtellerswife · 23/02/2019 17:30

@clairemcnam thankyou I am quite delightful. I just won't tolerate somebody thinking they can tell my child off. By all means they can speak politely to me about it but other than that they can do one Smile

importantkath · 23/02/2019 17:30

Ps: have things that he likes close to hand as a reward for finishing the meal in a quiet and socially acceptable way. For example, today's reward was, if you finish your lunch and don't make too much noise, we will go to look at the robot vacuum cleaners in the near by electronic store.

Your DS is only 3, but planning our day around these little treats are often a great way to keep focus.

Sleepyblueocean · 23/02/2019 17:33

anniehm your child's autism is not the same as all children's autism. My 12 year old will probably never have the cognitive ability of a 3 year old - and add the issues of severe asd onto that.
We were in one of our regular cafes this morning and ds did a bit of shouting, kicking and banging. He also did some spitting but we managed to distract him out of that. We always leave or sit outside if we can't.
My experience is that most people are reasonable if they can see that you are trying to contain the situation and as ds has got older and it has become more obvious that he must be disabled we have has less tuts and pulled faces. I think it must be harder if you have a child that presents more 'typically'.
Of course there are always a few haters of severe disability but they are not worth any consideration.

txtbreaker · 23/02/2019 17:33

Sorry to hear about the rudeness of person who decided to judge a situation she had no right to. I don’t even think it’s legal to shout at someone in a restaurant. (Child is a person - after all) And to the posters who seem to think it ok to do this. Check your privilege. Child is young and needs to learn to cope with different environments- autism is not even an issue here. But to the poster - don’t get bowed down by ableist crap and don't feel you have to apologise or justify your child’s existence. They have a right to be in that restaurant. If person can’t cope with noise why are they dining in public.

mooncuplanding · 23/02/2019 17:34

Odd question to ask possibly, but was he quiet after?

I was wondering that too

starsparkle08 · 23/02/2019 17:37

My son was also diagnosed at age 2 years of age he has autism adhd (adhd diagnosed later) and Ld . He attends a specialist school . When things are severe they are easier to diagnose younger .

My son has extreme challenging behaviour and is 2:1 when carers take him out ( he’s 7 now) it does make life very very hard and I have had to accept we mostly cannot manage restaurants . We do drive through with McDonald’s .
If we were to visit a restaurant I ask for quietest times and ask to be seated as far from others as possible as I no that he can be disruptive . Also I do leave places when his behaviour escalates .

I still get the horrid comments though and stares .
He lashes out mostly at me and it’s surprising when this is happening and he’s in full melt down people will let their toddlers wander over , which is madness .

JustTwoMoreSecs · 23/02/2019 17:37

If person can’t cope with noise why are they dining in public
Disablist much? Hmm

starsparkle08 · 23/02/2019 17:41

Also it’s so easy for people to judge but it’s important to remember nobody knows what lies in the future - the person you judge today could be you tomorrow . Life is very hard caring for someone with disabilities

Sirzy · 23/02/2019 17:42

Ds can cope with the normal level of noise is quieter places. What he can’t cope with is unexpected additional noises so before now he has been known to shout “turn peppa pig off” when someone at a nearby table has an iPad without headphones. That extra noise to have to process is just a step too far for him to cope with

AmICrazyorWhat2 · 23/02/2019 17:45

I'm sorry this happened, OP, like PP's, I can see both sides but I still don't think she should've spoken to your DS like that. Perhaps quietly spoken to you instead.

It's so tricky, I witnessed an extreme example a while back when I was with a friend. A family with a teen with SN came in. He suddenly vomited in the middle of the meal and they cleaned him up and carried on eating! I was gobsmacked, because although they were v. quiet, it was unpleasant for those of us sitting close by...I have a bit of a phobia about sick and would def. have left if my child had done that.

I think sometimes families are so used to certain behaviours - (perhaps this boy had a sensitive stomach and vomited frequently without warning) that they don't realise how upsetting it can be for others.

Awwlookatmybabyspider · 23/02/2019 17:46

Where did op say her ds hit anyone, though.
Sadly a lot of people if they've got prefect saints for kids and grand kids and have never encountered an issue. They lack the compassion. The saying my nan always taught and installed in us was. There but for the Grace of God.

MadMillie · 23/02/2019 17:49

It depends on the situation I suppose OP. I like the idea of a little sign for the table that someone upthread posted.

Did you get the situation resolved with the school trip? I read a thread you posted last night but you never returned to it.

Yura · 23/02/2019 17:53

for us, a combination of ipad, ear defenders, asking for a table awayvfrom everybody else, avoiding peak times and busy places works. order quickly. we’ve eaten in a pub garden in january - just bring warm clothes (not autism, but sensory processing issue - noise hurts him).

IHateUncleJamie · 23/02/2019 18:03

@txtbreaker Wow. If a person can’t cope with noise why are they dining in public Yes, get all those people with sensory overload/anxiety/pain back indoors where they belong; how dare they want to go out.

Also, AFAIK there is no law in the UK against shouting in a restaurant. 😂😂

perfectstorm · 23/02/2019 18:04

@missmama12 never, ever post on AIBU on disability. Trust me. It's soul-destroying reading comments on posts on the subject when it's not your own issue - when it is, ouch, and you have my sympathy.

People can't help you when their assumption is that autistic people have an off switch, and can behave like anyone else if they choose. The concept that autism is a variable condition (both between individuals, and in any one person in different circumstances and on different days) also seems impossible for the general public to grasp. Just don't waste energy. Post on SN children, instead.

Sadly, the general public's uselessness is something you need to accept, and planning meals out needs to be done really carefully and with an eye on what your son can manage. Mine has sensory processing problems so his resilience needs to be completely factored in, and then we need to go somewhere familiar, when not too crowded, and when sure the menu will suit him. And it can't be too echoey, and he needs to have his chair back against a wall to reduce sound directions. Booths are great for that. You just need to work out what he can manage, so his own anxiety is reduced.

And part of having a child with ASD is accepting that fuckwits will always, always assume your child is spoilt and rude if they melt down. They'll assume it's a tantrum. Gets worse when they reach 7 or 8 and 'too old'. My son has beautiful manners - school always used to comment of how incredibly polite he is - and hates anyone paying him attention, but when acutely stressed he does speak loudly, and if it's too much he'll try to bolt, or just freeze in place standing and not be able to move.

Our biggest revelation was that a tablet allowed him to calm and centre himself. So now when we get somewhere new he has it at once, and then when the food arrives we remove it. He's good with that as it's the rule. But now I get judgemental looks because I'm a lazy parent who gives my child tablets at meals out to shut them up.

When you're the parent of a child with invisible additional needs, you're in the wrong. Just about everywhere. I currently have cancer and it's been a shock, how lovely and kind and supportive and helpful people are with someone clearly bald, and a bit peaky looking. All very sweet, but I don't really need it half as much when negotiating the world on chemo as I do when with a scared and dysregulated child. And then, I've been met with irritation and judgement.

Should say that it's not universal. I've encountered amazing staff members at quite a few places who have absolutely gone out of their way to understand something wasn't right, and he wasn't being spoilt, and to create a situation where he could cope. But the British public, on the whole, are awfully convinced they know all about autism and that autistic people could just stop being autistic if they tried hard enough.

If only people with those attitudes could just try harder to stop being ignorant fuckwits, instead. To educate themselves, so they understand what they're spouting bollocks about and then desist from so doing. But alas, it seems unlikely. Sad

perfectstorm · 23/02/2019 18:08

@Yura cross posted. That's pretty much exactly what we do, except my son struggles with ear defenders, as he finds them uncomfortable.

rainbowbash · 23/02/2019 18:10

Also, AFAIK there is no law in the UK against shouting in a restaurant. 😂😂

that's indeed very funny if you have a child with SN who is at the receiving end of the shouting because of their disability.

Cuntforthebutter · 23/02/2019 18:14

Jeez. This is why I never post on AIBU about SN even though those boards are quieter.

Sorry it was shit today OP. Flowers

Things we have used are: lots of social stories about what behaviour is expected, if in a group we order then my daughter and I don't sit until the food arrives because she can't keep still for long, ear defenders, something to do like a fidget bag, colouring or tablet, or just go for a picnic! Less stress! X

starsparkle08 · 23/02/2019 18:14

Perfect storm well said agree 100%

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