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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

NDN wants to use our driveway for building work - AIBU?

563 replies

NigellaAwesome · 20/02/2019 21:12

Having quickly checked that the thread titled 'Twat Next Door' wasn't about us, I hoped to get hive mind views on our neighbour.

This might be long, but I don't want to drip-feed. For background, we have lived next to them for about 10 years. She's OK, but he is a complete knob. We call him Gobby Gordon. We've had a few issues over the years. The first was when one of their young relatives threw stones at our car repeatedly and caused substantial damage. When I told the wife what had happened, she was very apologetic and said she would pay. The dealer quoted £800 to repair, but I got a contact to do it at knockdown price for £120 + vat. However when I went round a couple of weeks later to let her know how much it would be, the husband arrived round later ranting and raving and threw a cheque at us for £120 but giving off severely. We were a bit Hmm about it, especially since he drove a Maserati and I doubt he would have appreciated the same being done to his car. That somewhat set the tone, but we have pretty much ignored each other over the years, with a couple of exceptions.

Our driveway is between the two houses, and beyond our fence they have about a metre passageway before their gable wall. A number of years ago I arrived home to find a workman on ladders in our driveway doing work on their chimney. They hadn't let us know, and I was shocked to find him there because we have electric gates and he must have climbed over the gates / fence to get in. I almost knocked him off the ladder because I was reversing in and only saw him at the last minute. When I asked what he was doing on my property he was really abusive. He refused to leave, and police were called and I think there was some sort of warning given. Gobby Gordon gave off to my DH about it afterwards, calling us crap neighbours. When we pointed out that he hadn't had the courtesy to ask us beforehand, he said that the workman had rung our doorbell but there had been no answer (no shit Sherlock, we were out).

A few months later I saw the wife and we had a chat. She was ok, and I explained that whilst we were happy in principle with access being given, it needed to be by prior arrangement, and with one of them - not a random builder, talking to us beforehand. This has been the case since for the last few years, and we have provided access on about 3 occasions since then. The wife has always called with us, provided details of the builder, and everything has been fine with minimal disruption.

Last week we were out and we got a call from the gates (gates connect to our phone when they are called). It was a builder asking to get onto our property to look at doing some work. We were out, had no idea what he was talking about, and said it wasn't really convenient. We didn't hear anything more.

This evening we were out again, and got a call from the gates. It was a builder asking if he could speak with us. We were out, but coming back in 15 minutes, so I said if he could hang on we would chat with him. When we got back home, he was waiting for us. He knew our names, and knew a lot about us including what we do for a living (which I'm not very happy about).

The builder said he wanted access to our driveway to build scaffolding on it to rebuild the neighbour's chimney. I was pretty pissed off that I was having this conversation directly with him, and that neither of the neighbours had spoken to us about it. When I told him this, he said that he had never even met the wife, only Gobby Gordon. He told Gordon last week that he needed to speak to us about access, but Gordon hasn't bothered his arse.

When I asked about what needed to be done, he said it would be scaffolded for 7 to 10 days (so realistically likely to be 3 weeks). Our driveway will be out of action for that time, and we have 2 cars that can't be parked outside on the busy road. I'm not thrilled at the prospect of bricks being brought up and down scaffolding which could land on our driveway, our pets, or our children. I'm going through quite a stressful time in work at the moment, and I also have professional exams coming up, so really could do without 3 weeks of building work. There's more, which would be a bit outing, but it was clear from what the builder said that Gobby Gordon had discussed a lot of private information about us - information that we didn't even know that Gordon knew, so that has really, really pissed me off. The builder also laid it on really thick that he had travelled a very long way to discuss this with us. The conversation ended with me telling the builder that I was sorry for his inconvenience, but this was an issue for the neighbours to speak to us directly about, not him, and the neighbours knew the score before they sent him round to discuss it with us. DH feels a bit sorry for the builder, but I just think this is Gobby Gordon being a cheeky fucker and sending the builder round to lay it on thick rather than having the manners to speak to us directly.

This is more a WWYD rather than AIBU. MN WWYD & AIBU re CF NDN?

OP posts:
Twolittlebears · 22/02/2019 18:53

I would say no.

NigellaAwesome · 22/02/2019 18:58

Justaboy Their house is about 1955 and detached with chimneys on either gable. I do recall that a large chunk of lead flashing blew off their chimney into our driveway a number of years ago. I suspect that some of the work has been bodge jobs on previous occasions (I'm pretty sure I saw someone with a sealant gun & a ladder at one stage - that was the time the police were called), but that's the sort of Gobby Gordon - it's all cash in hand to people he's met through the course of business - nothing in writing.

Ours is just over 100 years old, and we have never had any bother with our chimney. If we did, we would be speaking to our neighbours about it.

OP posts:
Ellie56 · 22/02/2019 19:01

DH has said he doesn't know why I'm asking here as MN is a bunch of vipers who don't care if we get on with our neighbours Shock Shock Grin

DarlingNikita · 22/02/2019 19:02

TBF we have a Victorian house and have had chimney issues, so it can happen even with solid Victorian builds and lead etc.

StayingWithAuntySue · 22/02/2019 19:03

This may have been suggested - I’d say YES IF you get to use their drive to park safely for the duration

BrizzleMint · 22/02/2019 19:14

We call him Gobby Gordon

OP, we met his wife on holiday last year. I can't remember her name but she was nicknamed Gobby by other people on the holiday Grin

greytoosoon · 22/02/2019 19:28

Absolute CF. I’d say no considering the history, but if you did give them permission I would only do it with a solicitors indemnity agreement to make good any damage, photos taken before and possibly a deposit held by the solicitor for payment of any said damages. Obviously solicitors costs to be paid by them.

TriciaH87 · 22/02/2019 19:39

Draw up a contract for terms of using your drive if you decide to let them. Eg must be finished by.... and if not compensation to be paid daily at an amount. Request that if your drive will ne out of access for their benefit you should be able to use theirs

Allways123 · 22/02/2019 19:45

YANBU.. You have gates for a reason so how dare he keep sending people round when your not in and allowing them on your property, he should ask you first, that's common courtesy and you have the right to say No. Why should you be inconvenienced by their DIY projects. I think there is a security issue here as well as the nuisance neighbour issue...he's clearly got issues..I woukd keep a note of things because even after this mishap I bet you there will be something else that will need doing..

emmskie03 · 22/02/2019 20:32

I'd be asking for both the homeowners insurance details and the builders upfront just in case you do need to make a claim Nigella.

BeatriceBee · 22/02/2019 20:36

No you are definitely not being unfair, it's a really risky situation and you seem to be the only ones being asked to take the risk. As others have said, there are other ways to remove a chimney which would not involve disrupting you. Unfortunately I have neighbours just like yours and they think they own the Close and can do what they like. I also came home one day to find they had put a ladder in my garden in order to carry out repairs to the side of their house. They hadn't mentioned it to me and I thought the least they could have done was come straight round to have a word with me as soon as I arrived home, but nothing. Personally I wouldn't give your neighbours any inch, otherwise they will take a mile and I know that from my own experience. BTW we take great delight in referring to our neighbours as Mr & Mrs Shitter!

jcyclops · 22/02/2019 21:34

It's a bit late now, but in a similar situation I have seen scaffolding erected in a big "h" shape which would totally span your drive leaving a tunnel through which you could have access - even for a car if the tunnel is wide enough.

Justaboy · 22/02/2019 21:39

large plates drilled into his wall Ah, said they might do that!

1955 no real age that, if a lump of lead did blow off and some bozo went up there with silicone sealant then no wonder its leaking.

If its just a Lead reflash then half a days work or less for a compent roofer or bricklayer if they really are to rebuild it then well more fool GG for being hoodwinked then!.

WanderingDaffodil · 22/02/2019 22:09

Good work OP. And Vipers!

Tistheseason17 · 22/02/2019 22:17

Nice CF NDN thread!

Iflyaway · 22/02/2019 22:50

Bottom Line...

Not my building work. Not my problem...

ChasedByBees · 22/02/2019 23:25

Ah finally a thread with an OP with a backbone. Wine

ScienceIsTruth · 23/02/2019 01:48

We had scaffolding including a tin hat roof for a while and they managed to do it all within our land, our walkway on one side of the property was 90cm and 1 metre. It caused no issues at all, and they didn't encroach on ndn at all.

RockinHippy · 23/02/2019 02:10

I'd be quizzing their builders more about the work that is to be done. Damp, scaffolding, 10 day job all suggest they might actually be re rendering or re pointing the wall or if not, maybe doing work on the roof. The first is very messy. We lost most of our plants when we had ours done. Sorting out a chimney from the outside sounds unnecessary & more expensive given the extra cost of scaffolding. Pretty sure it can be done from the inside, so that sounds odd.

Legally you should look at party wall agreement law. If it's major work they should be appointing someone such as a solicitor to write up an agreement between the 2 households, including compensation to cover extra expenses & inconvenience to you. It's up to you how much rope you give them, but from neighbours building works here. That's how it works. All at their expense not yours, basically you get it all in writing.

They sound awful though, I wouldn't be making it easy for them after that lot !

NigellaAwesome · 23/02/2019 02:20

RockinHippy the scaffolding is right up to our boundary (we own the fence). I'm not really au fait with this area - if there is no wall, can there still be a party wall, and therefore a party wall agreement? Some of the scaffolding is extending out over our property at about 5 metres high, but isn't actually on our property.

OP posts:
justilou1 · 23/02/2019 05:29

Time to contact your insurance company with photos and ask questions about what would happen if there is any damage to cars, etc.... You still may need solicitor’s letter to cover you.

Funnyfive · 23/02/2019 06:08

A party wall is simply the boundary line, it doesn’t need to be a wall or a fence or physical feature.

I’m surprised you allowed them to project the scaffold out over the boundary line above the ground? They still need your permission for this - you own all the land within your boundary both above (the air above) and below ground (within reason) so although they may not be physically touching the scaffolding on your land, if it projects over the line they are still erecting it on your land.

beautyguru · 23/02/2019 06:37

Not place marking at all, nope, not me Grin

Halo84 · 23/02/2019 07:11

I don’t think you have to contact your insurer at this point. You may want to ask your solicitor to write a letter to the builder to put him on notice.

Collaborate · 23/02/2019 07:25

A party wall is simply the boundary line, it doesn’t need to be a wall or a fence or physical feature

A Party Wall is a physical structure, and does not include a fence (at least by the definition under the Party Wall Act). The Party Wall Act is not engaged here.

Had the neighbour needed to go on to OP’s land to do the works the Access to Neighbouriy Land Act might have applied, but clearly it seems like the neighbour and their builder were being CFs. They wanted to reduce their own inconvenience and were happy to inconvenience OP in so doing.

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