MIL - ladies first rule...

[Summertimeandlivingiseasy]

AIBU to feel that is not necessary lesson for a 6 year old. Staying at MIL for 2 week holiday. She encourages kids to eat healthily and behave on promise of a sweet treat. (Which I don't mind) my 6 year old gets all excited when she gets the sweet box out but then MIL insists his 8 year old sister can choose first as it's polite to let 'ladies to go first'. He then gets upset as his big sister always gets things before him. We've always taught them guests first and have occassionaly mentioned ladies first. Is it something everyone teaches their sons from a young age? Is it fair with siblings?

What is the alternative fgs?

That you teach your son to be a decent person to everyone, rather than genitalia being a deciding factor on manners.

It’s reassuring to think we’re still bringing DC up to have some self-respect in society today, as there are so many clueless people about unfortunately.

That would be equally case if we were bringing those boys up to say “one at a time”.

Teaching girls first or boys first goes entirely against teaching that good manners should be in place all the time and that boys and girls are equal.

While teaching manners and etiquette are important we used to swap between ladies first and youngest first as I have boy/girl twins and he would never had gone first for anything. That way they both learnt to take turns and put others first. They are 16 now, polite, considerate teens.

@Minxmumma

I agree, taking turns between siblings is always going to be the fairest way (particularly when, like you say, one will always be youngest/oldest etc.)

I think 'ladies first' is a fairly old-fashioned expression but, as it's only at the mother-in-law's house, it's not like the son will miss out all that much and not really worth causing an issue over.

That you teach your son to be a decent person to everyone, rather than genitalia being a deciding factor on manners.

Agreed, I don't go slamming doors in men's faces but I don't think that giving up your seat, pulling a chair out etc. for a woman is a bad thing. I'm very aware that women are perfectly capable of opening doors/standing on buses/pulling out their own chair but it's just a nice thing to do.

Do you suggest that we drop all 'traditional' gentlemanly behaviours? (This is a genuine question, not a loaded one) as I think that would be a shame.

Do you suggest that we drop all 'traditional' gentlemanly behaviours?

I think we stop peddling they’re the desired state.

Just be a decent person full stop. I don’t respect you anymore if you offer me a seat I don’t need or pull out my chair.

I’m telling my DD “treat others as you want to be treated”. She doesn’t need special treatment because she’s a girl.

@JacquesHammer

That's fair enough.

Obviously priority has to be respect and kindness to everyone and I don't think anyone will argue with that.

As I said in my post, I never doubt that a woman is perfectly capable of standing/pulling out her own chair, it was just something I have always considered 'gentlemanly'.

I appreciate your daughter doesn't need special treatment and teaching independence (or boys and girls) is, I believe, an important part of parenting. I just don't think that this has to be an either/or situation. By all means teach independence but that doesn't, in my view at least, remove all value from chivalry.

*for, not or

Well I see the ones who were reared to be 'equal' and the ones who were reared to be gentlemanly while trying to get on a packed tube for e.g. You've got the BIG MAN bashing through everyone to get on and on a rare occasion, you'll have a gentlemanly lad who will say 'after you' or something. It's an ugly trait in men to see them stand their ground as 'equal'. And it's a lovely trait in men to see them respecting women.

Such silliness.

Rear your sons to be gentlemen. Not 'equal' thugs.

Rear your sons to be gentlemen

No. Rear your sons to be decent people.

Don’t ascribe the qualities you’re looking for to being a “gentleman”. They’re qualities ALL people should display regardless of sex.

Christ, so I can't even mention the word gentleman now Jacques?

Christ, so I can't even mention the word gentleman now Jacques?

Why would you when it’s not necessary.

Jacques - if vourse you should raise everyone to be kind and considerate. That goes without saying. But there is a different dynamic between men and women, as a general rule, and there’s no point pretending otherwise. Why does this aggravate you?

But there is a different dynamic between men and women, as a general rule, and there’s no point pretending otherwise. Why does this aggravate you?

Why does perpetuating gender stereotypes aggravate me....? Have a think.

But what can’t just dictate that men and women should be gender neutral because that’s not realistic. It never has been and never will be really.

It's not a gender stereotype. Women are physically weaker than men. So a bit of manners and chivalry wouldn't go astray.

And I've seen boys, very young boys, young male adults and fully grown men bullying their way to the front literally and metaphorically. So it's perfectly good manners to teach them to hang back.
You don't like it when transgender females compete against females right?

But you think it's going to be a fair race if it's a free for all for the sweets?
The fact that the DGM had to tell him 'Eh no, ladies first,' means that the DS was of course rushing in first. As the male of the species is prone to do.

Women are physically weaker than men. So a bit of manners and chivalry wouldn't go astray

So we only show manners to people weaker than ourselves?

Rather than, you know, teaching everyone to be courteous and mindful of those around them?

Us poor weak women, how do we cope

You don't like it when transgender females compete against females right?

Yes because that's the same.

But you think it's going to be a fair race if it's a free for all for the sweets?

There are countless ways you can get kids to be fair around turn taking. If the only one you can think of is "ladies first" it doesn't show much imagination.

We cope by surrounding ourselves by men who are gentlemen, not thugs.

Let me guess Jacques. You only have sons?

So you acknowledge that transgender females have an unfair advantage? Why? Because they're male!

We cope by surrounding ourselves by men who are gentlemen, not thugs

We cope by teaching children to be decent.

Let me guess Jacques. You only have sons?

Absolutely incorrect

I'm willing to wager that you're lying honey. That, or you've a gender neutral girl thrown into the mix there somewhere. And you'll be complaining when she grows up and decides she actually feels like a boy

Why ladies first though? Generally rather than specifically? I was always told ladies first on the basis that they were the weaker sex. You’d get your arse handed my most people if you said that though. So why? There was a funny joke made by a comedian who tried to justify the gender pay gap on the basis that if you’re on the Titanic you were the one told to stay put