DS and DD Wage Difference Surprise

[Thatstuffedbear]

DD, 29, is a nurse, went to uni, did placements of 12 hour shifts in various hospitals as a student, all for zero pay. Fast forward and she is now a band 6 nurse on a busy nhs ward doing 13 hour day and 12 hour night shifts, often gets verbally abused by patients but loves her job.
She gets free uniform but has to pay to park. Her salary is now 28k after 7 years.

DS, 21 decided uni wasn't for him and was lucky enough to be offered an apprenticeship straight from school. Got paid from day one and will be a qualified gas engineer in the summer. He has a permanent job lined up, he has free uniform including shoes, a phone, all paid for, a van, and an allowance to buy tools. His starting salary at age 21 will be 36k.
He works 8 hour days and admits a lot of time is spent in the van drinking tea waiting for the next job.
I love both my DC equally and am so glad they are in jobs they love but AIBU to think a nurse should surely earn more than a gas engineer?

My dad made very good money laying bricks. He did an apprenticeship and was considered one of the best bricklayers in town. Not many women are willing to do that kind of work, especially not until they are 65 years old as he did.

Nobody is stopping women from doing traditional men's jobs. Most women don't want to do the work.

RN's make over $100,000 in California btw.

We are in the South East.

36k starting for a gas engineer in very high .Different employers pay different rates in your daughters profession she is not working for one of the highest payers.
DW used to be a staff nurse for NHS pay, pension ,holidays and sick pay all miles better than mine working in engineering for massive national company .

comefromaway I was surprised at the council paying such high wages too. Seems like all the tradesmen/women (there is a lady electrician) are well paid within this council.

I was a high street, family Solicitor in a Cathedral town. I never earned over £36k.

DH doesn’t have a degree. He’s always worked in the oil industry. He’s currently earning 6.5 times as much.

Money doesn’t make you happy. Really.

I’ve been a journalist for two decades. I’m award-winning, good at my job, have a lot of responsibility, have a post-graduate qualification and multiple other vocational qualifications. I put in 50 hours a a week. I earn 26k.

My husband is a tradesman. He left school at 16. He earns 50k for a 37 hour week and could send double that if he chose to work weekends.

We’re both incredibly happy in our jobs. Wouldn’t do anything else. Yes, I’d like more money but as long as there’s enough to put food on the table it’s fine. I’d advise my kids to do what they love. Chasing money is not going to make anyone happy.

All my siblings have degrees I just have GCSES and earn more than them.

I haves worked my way up in a profitable industry, where my siblings (both Male and female) work more in schooling or social areas.

It’s the way of the world (sad as it is) companies making profit can pay more.

Saying that surprised at that wage from a council 😬

Just out of interest- I was looking to go in to trades, specifically plumbing. I'm 26 with a CertHe in psychology as my highest level of education. Can I still get in to a trade through an apprenticeship? I feel I'm too old

@dragonsfire what do you do?

@Queenoflaughs work in construction (in commercial)

@Queenoflaughs never too late btw I changed careers from retail to construction at 30 years old in 5 years I have had got to a level earning over 10k when I started with company car etc

Money doesn’t make you happy. Really

Nope, but to quote Granny Weatherwax, it is a way of keeping score.

Public sector jobs are all pretty low paid. Nursing, midwifery, teaching and the like. All of these people work really long hours with little monetary reward. The only good things about public sector jobs are the pension schemes and the unions. These days it really pays to have a skilled trade such as carpentry, electrician, mechanic, gas engineering etc. Some of these people are making as much if not more than doctors and surgeons! I agree it’s not fair when you consider that many public sector jobs are taken by women and many trade jobs are taken by men.

I know what life I'd rather have for my kids.

I'm sure you do. The more pertinent issue, however, is whether they know what lives they'd rather have for themselves ....

Yabu, a gas engineer is just an important as a nurse, both are unrelated professional roles however in my opinion no lesser of value.

Your dd train further if she wants, or retrain in another profession.

I’m not sure why your shocked at this tbh, I know factory workers on more money

"This isn't a girl/boy thing."

Really? Which sex traditionally filled/fills those roles? Of course it's sexist! To say otherwise is completely disingenuous! Just because there's a minority of male nurses and female gas engineers doesn't make that not true. Also true of other traditionally female careers that they tend to be lower paid, teaching, childcare, care work, certain retail roles, certain garment manufacturing roles, secretarial type roles...

Nursing is and always has been massively underpaid - not because the work doesn't have value but because women tend to be the ones doing it and traditionally they weren't valued!

A - because women were expected to be financially supported by a man - father or husband

B - because women were thought (mainly by idiot men) to be doing it for the love of the job and so weren't interested in decent pay

With nursing it's also partly as the earliest nurses were largely nuns who'd perhaps taken vows which meant they could only accept the bare minimum to live in and they were living in church accommodation anyway and had no bills!

But as a society we - ridiculously so - haven't yet moved on from these ideas. Drs are still seen as "professional" while nurses are still very much not, despite it now BEING a graduate profession - and has been for around 20 years!

"You don't appear to have given any consideration for the unsocial hours uplift your daughter must get? I'm band 6 NHS and my 28k salary is more towards 35k with unsocial hours." She's comparing BOTH her children's basic salaries that makes sense, pretty sure gas engineers get overtime pay too.

"I know a mum who is a qualified nurse but doesn't have a degree" I find that hard to believe given Sen training ended Iirc in 1990 and had been being phased out long before then.

Unfortunately "nurse" is not yet a protected title - it should be!

www.theguardian.com/healthcare-network/2017/nov/08/what-nurse-baffling-number-job-roles-leaves-patients-bosses-confused

But I question the person you're referring to's qualifications given the rest of your info about them.

"Many trades people work alone. I think women prefer social contact through the day sochoose care work, shops. Just my theory." What has any of that got to do with pay?!

"Be proud because your daughter does a worthy job and your son earns a good crust." Wow - do you think the daughters bills are cheaper because her job is "worthy"?!

"This is why councils are now facing pay discrimination cases on job equivalence issues and quite rightly to. One wonders what the Equality and Diversity officers in councils have been doing all these years when the pay differential issues are so obvious." Totally agree - huge case recently won (though my cynical and realistic mind realises this is just the beginning really) in my birth town of glasgow where female council workers recently won an unequal pay claim.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/women-equal-pay-glasgow-city-council-strike-gender-sexism-feminism-scotland-a8734246.html

JaniceBattersby I highly doubt you would feel the same if you were to become a single parent and not have your husbands large wage coming in. No money isn't everything but it IS a necessity for living and at a certain amount too. Your post smacks of "money doesn't matter" coming from someone who doesn't have to worry IF they can pay a crucial bill!

Lots of posters commenting "X jobs were always low paid" seemingly not realising the jobs they're referring to are traditionally filled by women!

That is the way it is. That is why I am not fussed if my dc go to uni or not! Would be very happy if they could go into a trade, as that is where the money is it seems.

Oh Janice money may not make you happy but the amount you have would make me happy. It's one of my most hated phrases as lack of money is the bloody hardest thing!

Also the difference being is that, a Nurse wages are funded by the NHS so the pay is not good, whereas a gas engineer is private, you can command what you want.

Yes money does make me happy, as it ensures we have a roof over our heads, and the bills paid and food in my kids stomach.

Trade jobs are great if you enjoy doing them - or dont care whether you enjoy your work or not - but I spend too much of my life at work to do a job that I'm not bothered about for higher pay.

I thought £28K would be bottom of band 6 (I'm a new band 6 in NHS). It will rise to about £38K in about 3 years for existing band 6's I think, plus DD will get extra for shift allowance which will bump it up quite a lot.

It's still low though for the hard work and responsibility involved. But there's job security, good pension and holidays compared to private sector. I've work in both private and nhs healthcare and definitely prefer the NHS.

@Mrstraveller

I worked in IT for many years. Very male dominated (still) and also well paid. I have advised young women for years to go into a male dominated profession as they will automatically earn more by virtue of that fact even if the job itself is not as hard as, say nursing.

But they will still earn less than their male colleagues.
See what @Zwischenwasser wrote above, this applies to IT too very much.

This really doesn't surprise me. I have a degree, masters and PhD in an applied science, and work (at a relatively senior level) in the civil service. My sister (1.5 years older than me) left school with only 1 GCSE (in drama). She earns more than me as a manager in a high street shop.
However, I'd say my job is probably more rewarding (from discussions we've had) and more flexible, so I'm not complaining (too much!).
The same situation exists between DH and his brother. We'd definitely not push any of our children into higher education unless they were really sure it was for them. More qualifications certainly doesn't equal more pay - but when we were at school that was the only message we ever got.

Women can stop nursing being a “woman’s job,” by not taking it up.