Over 8s in the changing rooms

[HenweeArcher]

I’ve started swimming just before swimming lessons at my gym recently as it fits in well with the crèche being quiet. I’ve noticed that no matter what day I swim, I can always count at least 2 or 3 boys who are almost undoubtedly over 8 (which is the rule) in the female changing rooms just before lessons. Sometimes they use the separate cubicles (there are a couple in the corners) to change themselves so are more than capable of changing alone! I’m aware that some boys might need extra support for whatever reason but I fail to believe that a handful every day at a small health club do.

AIBU to mention it to management? It doesn’t necessarily affect me a great deal as I’m fairly relaxed about nudity and don’t see it as my responsibility to all of a sudden start changing under a towel or anything but I do feel it’s unfair for younger girls to be put in this position.

arethereanyleftatall

Im sure you're right re the coordination. But I also think it's a mindset, and just doing what everybody else does.
At our swim pools swim lessons, the norm is for mums to go in the changing rooms with their dcs right up to about 10 yo.
At the same pools swim club, the norm is for parents to sit outside the changing rooms and wait from 7yo.
And, ironically, it's only the swim club who swim at the same time as the public, not the other way around.

There will definitely be localised cultures from pool to pool and by type of session.
The other thing that occurs to me is that staged swimming lessons won't have the team spirit. Many posters have mentioned friends through the thread. There's not really chance for friendship to develop in our rushed 30 minutes per week. People move in and out of the classes all the time and swap days according to class avaliability.

I would be a lot happier with DS changing if he did have a reliable friend to accompany him and give him a nudge along.

We end up at a pool in a different city as provision in ours is very poor. People from our school end up at leisure centres and pools here there and everywhere across a few towns, but not in the local council pool (We had several months where the council shut pool A for several months for emergency structural repairs a mere 3 months after shutting down pool B which is currently a heap of rubble awaiting planning permission for a new complex )

Good point re the camaraderie budgie.

Pidgey not budgie!

I personally wouldn’t be happy for my 11 year old son to get changed on his own in the men’s changing rooms.

I understand you wouldn’t be happy with him in the men’s, but do you mean he uses unisex or are you suggesting you would take him into the ladies?! 11 is ridiculous, at that age even women would feel uncomfortable changing in front of him.

11 isn't even the worst suggested on this thread yet rainbows, awful as it is; if memory serves someone upthread said 13!!

No, there are family changing rooms where I am. Obviously we are lucky, I didn’t realise that most places didn’t until reading this thread.

weetabix, that is simply not what the poster upthread said. She said that the gym let all patrons know, in advance, that they suspend the standard male/female segregation while swimming lessons for children are on and that the rooms were for the exclusive use of parents and children. And yes, I'm far less bothered by that because everyone knows in advance what the rules will be and can plan accordingly.

For comparison, my local sexual health clinic has sessions that are:

• male only
• female only
• under 25s only

It would be wrong for anyone to go to a clinic they weren't supposed to. Not for safety reasons, but for the privacy/dignity/embarrassment of those who have chosen that session deliberately. (I did see this happen once but the staff were really good at insisting that the person left.)

Men/women/girls/boys will all have a million different reasons for wanting a particular changing room set up and most will plan accordingly. And they should not have to justify their choices - they can have whatever boundaries they want. It isn't okay for others to ignore the rules in place and think "to hell with what anyone else wants".

No she doesn't say that. This is her post

My DS attends a small hotel pool for lessons and their rule is that other pool/gym users must leave the changing facilities no later than 15 minutes before kids swimming lessons start.
I'm a mum and I've been taking my 9 yr DS into the boys changing rooms since he was 6 yrs old and if I encounter a man getting changed, I remind him that he should have been out of there by 4.15 or whatever time.

All it says is that gym/ pool users need to leave the changing rooms before lessons.

Then she clearly says she goes into the boys changing room.

Where does it say that they suspend the standard male/female segregation while swimming lessons for children are on and that the rooms were for the exclusive use of parents and children.?

All she says is that normal customers can't be there. Not that boy/girl changing rooms are suspended and become unisex. She is very clear that she goes in the male changing room.

Women on here are very clear that men should call out other men on their behaviour - and I agree.

Women should also call out other women. And this is one such case. An adult woman shouldn't be going into the boys changing room, just as an adult man shouldn't be going into the girls changing room.

Sorry, I misunderstood. If that poster is using the male changing rooms against the published rules of the gym then of course she is in the wrong.

So it’s ok for him to get changed in a room full of naked women?

8 is to young for any boy or girl to be getting changed on their own. The kids are still in year 3! I think 10 is a reasonable age. My son is 7 and when he is 8 I wouldn't feel comfortable sending him by himself to get ready. He most likely wouldn't be able to even use the lockers on his own!

After swimming lessons I put a towel around him if there is no free cubicles for him to dress so he is covered up. If people didn't like having a young boy in the women's changing rooms then I'm sorry but my sons safety comes before a few minutes of awkwardness for somebody else.

My son is 7 and when he is 8 I wouldn't feel comfortable sending him by himself to get ready. He most likely wouldn't be able to even use the lockers on his own

Then you’ve got a year to teach him.

Your sons need doesn’t come before the needs of the females in the female changing rooms. If someone complained, and if it were my daughter he was making uncomfortable then damn right I’d report it, you would be asked to remove him, as he shouldn’t be there.

It’s a female space. That’s all there is to it.

If people didn't like having a young boy in the women's changing rooms then I'm sorry but my sons safety comes before a few minutes of awkwardness for somebody else.

It has been well established by pp in this thread that this is a false dichotomy, there are alternatives.

Why are British children so far behind in general life than other countries?

Leaving aside the paedophilic risk, which everyone has agreed is more of a risk in the men's and something should be done. But, leaving that aside there are many many posters on this thread who have said things like their 8yo son can't gather his clothes, cant find the poolside, can't use the lockers... etc
What the fuck? Come on. An 8 yo NT child should really be able to do these things. In other countries children are leaving the house by themselves and getting buses to school at 6 or 7.
If your 8 yo can't do these things then I would prioritise basic life skills above swimming lessons.

Well yes, in other countries 6 year olds are at work in sweat shops or walking miles to collect water.

Our children on the whole don't get buses to school on their own, schools have rules about letting children walk home alone, we have become very risk averse and so children are given less independence.

The irony is that the mums of girls aren't saying that the girls go and change on their own so it's fine for the boys, they are going in and helping their daughters until however old. It's just the boys who from 8 are expected to be independent.

When I took my dd to swimming lessons the mums would be helping the children get ready, put their caps on, send them to the pool and then collect all the children's belongings up. Then they would be waiting to shower them, help them dry off, get dressed and collect all the stuff. That is hardly independent and these girls were 10ish.

Surely there is a difference between helping your child as you are there and helping because they are incapable of doing it themselves? Any normal 8 year old should be capable of washing and dressing themselves, and gathering their belongings. If mothers want to keep their daughters company and help them get our faster, that’s fine. Fathers can do the same with their older children too. That doesn’t mean the children are incapable of doing it alone.

I often help DC and even DH do something as it is quicker. Doesn’t mean they cannot do it alone if necessary.

YANBU to mention it to the pool management. If there are boys over 8 (excl SN) who have some fear of men in the changing room, this needs to be tackled, but not by having them change in amongst women/girls.

From what I have experienced or heard about, there seems within leisure management a reluctance to act on difficult issues, or to take the easy way out.

RainbowWaffles

It's the sneery tone though isn't it? As though people are being unreasonable if they say an 8 year old might have some difficulty when the 8 year old girls don't have to discover if they have a difficulty or not because they can have their mum there to "keep them company" as you put it?

Maybe weetabix, but speaking only for myself, I wouldn't be helping my child do these things at 8. I think it's really important that they do things for themselves if they're capable of it.
Dd2 was about 5 when I would wait for her outside of the girls changing room. The girls, so little to no 'risk'. I find those changing rooms hot and busy and hell on earth, And I had no desire to add to the crush. But yes, other mums would frown at me as if I was neglecting dd.

Idk why this is a problem it's not like they are inappropriate towards you

I seriously can't believe what I'm reading. You want me to send my 8 year old son to get changed into his Spider-Man pyjamas after his swimming lesson at 1930 as the only boy in his lesson. Surely the risk posed to him by the men in that changing room is far far greater than him seeing a bit of flesh in the ladies changing room? And please tell me what risk an 8 year old poses to anyone?

It's the sneery tone though isn't it? As though people are being unreasonable if they say an 8 year old might have some difficulty when the 8 year old girls don't have to discover if they have a difficulty or not because they can have their mum there to "keep them company" as you put it?

I am sure parents have managed to discover if their children are capable of getting themselves washed, dressed and packed. It doesn’t literally have to be in a swimming pool changing room. Many parents have children of both genders so I don’t think it’s sneery. The rules are they must go to the changing room of their own gender, if girls go with their dads they face the same issue. It may be more convenient and faster to go in with your child and parents may just stay with their children unless they are prevented from doing so.

If an 8 year old boy is not capable then other alternatives have been suggested.

You want me to send my 8 year old son to get changed into his Spider-Man pyjamas after his swimming lesson at 1930 as the only boy in his lesson.

Nobody wants you to do this. They just don’t want you to take him into the girls changing room. This has been addressed many many times, feel free to go back and read.

“Maybe weetabix, but speaking only for myself, I wouldn't be helping my child do these things at 8. I think it's really important that they do things for themselves if they're capable of it”.

Where my children swim squad there’s a sign outside both changing rooms saying that parents aren’t allowed in! Most children are ready by year 4 so about 9 but there are some 8 year olds swimming there and this navigating getting organised and changed by themselves.

My younger daughter swims at lessons and I’ve been waiting outside since she’s been 5. No one has ever frowned at me

I am a bit baffled on this thread by all of these children who need help to get dry and dressed after 8 years (discounting those with additional needs).