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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Over 8s in the changing rooms

999 replies

HenweeArcher · 07/02/2019 20:19

I’ve started swimming just before swimming lessons at my gym recently as it fits in well with the crèche being quiet. I’ve noticed that no matter what day I swim, I can always count at least 2 or 3 boys who are almost undoubtedly over 8 (which is the rule) in the female changing rooms just before lessons. Sometimes they use the separate cubicles (there are a couple in the corners) to change themselves so are more than capable of changing alone! I’m aware that some boys might need extra support for whatever reason but I fail to believe that a handful every day at a small health club do.

AIBU to mention it to management? It doesn’t necessarily affect me a great deal as I’m fairly relaxed about nudity and don’t see it as my responsibility to all of a sudden start changing under a towel or anything but I do feel it’s unfair for younger girls to be put in this position.

OP posts:
HalfBloodPrincess · 08/02/2019 13:48

“I don't have the issue with segregation. I have the issue with I don't have a son and therefore I don't care, that's just his tough luck. That's what I don't like.”

I didn’t ask if you had an issue, I asked why you think there’s a need for sex segregated spaces

Oxytocindeficient · 08/02/2019 13:48

Are we now afraid of children?

are you really framing this entire thread as that? My god...

arethereanyleftatall · 08/02/2019 13:49

Yes, peng;
If the boys parents do not allow him to alone use the space the pool has allocated for him to change in, and if there is no male friend/relative who can take him, and if getting changed at home is not an option, and if they don't drive so cant get to a different pool with unisex changing, and if there is no toilet in the centre he could get changed in, and if he would get too cold on public transport if he didn't have a chance to properly dry, then absolutely, yes, the boy should miss out on lessons from the age of 8 until you're ready to let him do any of the above.
USING THE FEMALE SPACE SHOULD NEVER BE AN OPTION.

nolongersurprised · 08/02/2019 13:49

“So hierarchy of privilege, as ever, Adult males>Male children>Females.”

This. Unfortunately.

goldengummybear · 08/02/2019 13:50

Don't worry. I shall make them leave because my feelings matter.

You can't make anyone do what you want. If you don't get staff involved then you have to resort to verbal and physical abuse which means you go from victim to aggressor.

arethereanyleftatall · 08/02/2019 13:50

Confused - I take it you've failed to read the thread as you haven't posted anything which bears any relevance to anything that's been said.

Limensoda · 08/02/2019 13:51

The answer shouldn’t be to tell girls to shift over and clear some of their space to accommodate males, it should be for their males to find their own option

I would agree....unless the male was a child.
A mother can't take her little into the male changing rooms. He can't go in alone.
She takes him into their female changing room because he's a vulnerable child. This does not make him think males take priority over females unless he's being deliberately taught that in other situations in his life.

Oxytocindeficient · 08/02/2019 13:51

If the boys parents do not allow him to alone use the space the pool has allocated for him to change in
and if there is no male friend/relative who can take him,
and if getting changed at home is not an option
and if they don't drive so cant get to a different pool with unisex changing
and if there is no toilet in the centre he could get changed in
and if he would get too cold on public transport if he didn't have a chance to properly dry
then absolutely, yes, the boy should miss out on lessons from the age of 8 until you're ready to let him do any of the above
USING THE FEMALE SPACE SHOULD NEVER BE AN OPTION

This needs highlighting!

nolongersurprised · 08/02/2019 13:51

the only way boys 8 plus (until aged ???) can be safe is to go into a female only space

What?? NO.

Oxy, I think you’ve misread the tone of my post Smile

Lougle · 08/02/2019 13:52

How do you know these kids are "clearly over 8"? The tallest 'normal' 8 year old boy (98th centile) will be 139 cm, whilst the shortest 13 year old boy (2nd centile) will also be 139 cm. So it could be a very tall child. My DD3 is 9 now, but she wears 11-12 clothes and seems like she's much older at times.

Oxytocindeficient · 08/02/2019 13:55

nolongersurprised

I’m sorry, I sincerely apologise!

nolongersurprised · 08/02/2019 13:57

It’s ok, I’m not doing sarcasm well tonight, it’s late here.

Weetabixandshreddies · 08/02/2019 13:58

Oxytocindeficient

Do what you like.

I'm not being disingenuous, just pointing out the rank hypocrisy.

Girls can do what they like and everyone else just puts up with it?

arethereanyleftatall · 08/02/2019 14:02

Overstory.
That is a really good point. In all the many suggestions put forward by posters actually looking for a solution, rather than just endlessly repeating what they thought at the beginning; no one has suggested the men should change anything.
Mind, I'd like to see how well 'no men without children in the male changing rooms during 4-6pm swimming lessons ' goes down round the board room, of, let's face it, men.

nolongersurprised · 08/02/2019 14:02

weetabix

  1. boys over 8 years aren’t allowed in female spaces. Girls their own age may be starting puberty and be self-conscious about their changing bodies.

  2. some females in the female changing room and some males in the male changing room may act in ways that people in that changing room find discomforting or disconcerting. This isn’t great either.

  3. and 2) are different, in spite of you trying hard to conflate the two.

Imissgmichael · 08/02/2019 14:04

Confusedfornow I don’t live in France so couldn’t care less if the French all swim in the nude with a rose between their teeth.

Oh and yes, I was deeply upset for a very long time about being made to change in front of boys.

Of course boys should be safe, just take them somewhere that caters for them like I used to with my son.

goldengummybear · 08/02/2019 14:05

Girls can do what they like and everyone else just puts up with it?

There is antisocial behaviour in all communal spaces by both sexes. Sometimes it's the girls, sometimes it's the boys. If you want to complain about antisocial behaviour by girls in the women's then make a new thread. This thread is about the age 8 cut off for boys in the women's.
I can imagine that a lot of men don't want age 8+ girls in the men's either. By age 7 my son was changing in private and his school had separate changing for boys and girls. He definitely won't want a female classmate to see him undressing and deserves dignity and privacy to do so.

Clueing4looks · 08/02/2019 14:10

Looks like this isn’t weetabix’s first thread about this issue - they’ve been spouting off their anti-woman crap many times before

PengAly · 08/02/2019 14:11

Weetabixandshreddies its ok, I'm with you on this but I've honestly given up at this point. Society has gone mad. It seems like it has to be either girls OR boys, women OR men. The concept of equality has been lost and young children are excepted to either be put at risk, navigate unknown places without a parent or miss out on simple activities like swimming if their family aren't well resourced. Girls and women have been well accommodated for, men have been well accommodated for but young boys have not been which is sad (where is their safe space? in a toilet? At home not able to swim?).

Ah well, this thread is just going to go in circles- I give up, you all win. May your daughters always comes first.

nolongersurprised · 08/02/2019 14:14

“The concept of equality has been lost “

peng you keep talking about equality, in this context, with this thread, why do you feel that “the concept of equality has been lost”?

HalfBloodPrincess · 08/02/2019 14:14

In a female only space it is women or men, girls or boys. That’s the point. Our daughters (and mums/sisters/nieces/grans) should come first when it comes to female only

Whatafustercluck · 08/02/2019 14:15

I have an 8yo ds (and a 2yo dd). I don't like him going into men's toilets alone. He does it, but I feel really wary for him. I know you have to take the jump at some point, but he still seems so young and innocent to me. And he is.

His feelings towards girls and women are not sexualised, he still baths with his little sister. So I'm struggling with this one and suppose my question is, what is the harm in an 8yo child being in a women's changing room, with his mum/ older sister/ auntie or whoever, where he is safer and is not yet capable of using his penis as a weapon and isn't interested in ogling women and girls?

I get the whole female spaces argument and would understand why an adult with a penis would not be welcome in a female space. But children who have not yet reached puberty? I don't understand the outrage. And why 8? Genuine question - why is an 8yo boy suddenly not acceptable but a 7yo is? Is it to do with sexual awareness?

FrenchJunebug · 08/02/2019 14:16

OP if you mean complain to management because they do not provide family changing rooms then fine, otherwise YABVU. By the sound of your post those kids looked barely old then 8!

BlingLoving · 08/02/2019 14:16

What really annoys me about this is that clubs don't seem to think that 8 year old boys need somewhere to change. Our club has 2 familyy changing rooms, which tend to be busy at all times. DS can't be left in the mens alone (he's not 8 yet, but it's looming) as frankly he is unreliable and will take forever/lose his clothes etc. I concede that this might be because DS has some challenges which perhaps make him less capable in these situations than other boys, but nonetheless, I think 8 is too young for the men's room alone.

But I am starting to be uncomfortable with him in the ladies and while I try to work around it as he's still under the threshold, I will be trying to find alternatives once he turns 8 later this year. But why the club can't provide additional family spaces never ceases to irritate me. I'm planning to address it with them (but am prepared to be ignored, as always at this club. OR, I suspect they'll tell me to keep taking him into the ladies with me. Which, isn't okay because he's too old to be changing where girls and women are naked).

Minglemangle · 08/02/2019 14:17

Luckily we have family changing at our local pool but if we didn’t I would take my boys in the ladies changing. 9 year old boys are not a risk to anyone and boys don’t start puberty until 13ish. If a boy is staring they are obviously rude, they should be getting themselves changed and not be looking at anyone else.