Cleaner is refusing to soldier

[biscuitbrown]

I've been lucky enough to have a cleaner help out once a week since my first DD was born, we pay her well and we've always been super flexible, she works the day that suits her (rather than a Monday or Friday which I'd actually like). I've always thought we we had a friendship based on mutual respect and flexibility. She's not English and I've gladly helped her with insurance claims/mobile provider issues / school issues /hospital appointments etc. We give her a generous bonus at Christmas, we look after her. I've just gone back to work 3 days a week (long hours) and we've taken the huge step of getting an au pair, which is the first time we've had any childcare. Our au pair is brilliant - capable, trustworthy, hardworking, helpful, she cooks when I'm working, keeps their rooms tidy, washes their clothes, babysits etc. We found her through an agency and they explained how it is a cultural exchange, gave us guidance on what you can and cannot expect an au pair to do.

Anyway to cut to the chase, we pay our cleaner well to clean the whole house. But now we have the au pair she outright refuses to clean her room. I am only asking her to vacuum and dust, not tidy or touch her things (and au pair is SO tidy). I asked her why (this was all on text) and she said the au pair is old enough to look after herself. She's 18. But cleaner is paid to clean all the rooms and has been doing so for years... AIBU?!

"Why doesn't the 18 year old with a part-time job clean her own room?
Why the hell should someone else do it for her?

Because it’s her job that she is paid to do...?"

Sorry, if I missed it, but has the cleaner been given a pay rise to cover another room being occupied? If not, then she's not paid to do it is she? It was presumably also not what was agreed when the cleaner took on the job.

"So all of you saying the cleaner shouldnt clean the au pairs room.Would go in to work and refuse to do a task cause you felt it was beneath you that day.
Even if you had done the tasks previous days.?"

That's not what happened. She didn't clean up after the au pair and then stop. She (presumably) cleaner an empty room before so a lot less work.

All she’s doing is dusting and vacuuming, which she did previously, presumably.

The OP is asking her to hoover. Thats all, just hoover.

Which she should have been doing before anyway, empty rooms still get dusty.

This has nothing to do with workload (the OP has already said the cleaner actually has less work to do now the AP is there), but about attitude and her attitude stinks.

"All she’s doing is dusting and vacuuming, which she did previously, presumably."

Is the au pair sometimes in the room while the cleaner's working. That would change thing for me.
Also, when she started the job she wasn't told about the au pair because she wasn't there. so there has been a change in what was agreed even if the amount of work is the same.

The cleaner needs to decide if they would rather continue cleaning the au pair's room or have their wage reduced by £X amount to cover the reduced work load. You are the employer, and so it is you - not the cleaner - who should be deciding which rooms/tasks she needs to complete every day. If she doesn't want to do the work required then she is no longer suitable for the job.

She didn't clean up after the au pair and then stop. She (presumably) cleaner an empty room before so a lot less work.

The OP isn't asking the cleaner to "clean up after the au pair" though. Whether or not the room is occupied it still needs dusting/airing/hoovering and none of those jobs are changed by it being empty (it isn't like the Hoover becomes lighter and it takes less time to cover the area if the room is unoccupied).

If the au pair was leaving the room in chaos - clothes on the floor/make up and stuff all over the desk - then I could understand the cleaner refusing to clean the room as the au pair's behaviour would be making their job harder. However, as the OP has said the au pair has not done this, then there is no excuse for the cleaner to not continue their regular tasks.

When I lived in Madrid I had a lovely cleaner and for a year I had an au pair (after ex DH and I divorced he moved back to the UK so I needed extra childcare and an au pair was the most practical option)

My cleaner (a Spanish lady in her 50s) never had any issue with me (English mid 20s) asking her to clean the au pair's (American 18yr old) room. My cleaner made/changed beds and did laundry as well as other general cleaning tasks and was more than happy to do the same for the au pair. The au pair preferred to do her own laundry/bed etc so the cleaner only had to mop the floor, dust/wipe the surfaces and air the room. This meant the cleaner's job was actually made easier as she had to do less work despite there being an extra person. Not only because the au pair did her own stuff but because she also kept DDs stuff more tidy/organised and tidied up after activities (as well as getting her out of the apartment and out of the cleaner's way as much as possible) this made the cleaner's job easier as she didn't have to constantly pause hoovering to fish out a doll shoe or crayon or hair clip that had clogged the hoover pipe

It takes me back a few years. I had help with the children. One day the girl told one of the boys to tidy his toys and keep the room tidy. He told her it was her job. She got very uptight and told me. I said I would have a word with him (only about 6). I told him later that he should not have spoken to her like that. He said 'well it is her job''. He was right. I had a little help so I would not have to nag at them. I told him he was right but said he should not have been cheeky to her.

You really have to draw up a contract nowadays and make sure everyone knows what they are doing. It is no different to any employment terms. The cleaner should clean all the rooms if that is what she is employed for. I do not know how much you pay her. I am disabled and pay £23 an hour and the duties are written down and signed by both of us. If the au pair is there for the baby and to study English that is her job. If the cleaner objects then she should find another job. You should not have too much difficulty employing someone.

its pretty simple really,
just tell her you pay her to clean and you would like the job to be done as you have asked and if cleaning the room is too much for her then you will look into finding a cleaner who will do the job as you expect it to be done
it really is that simple
do the job get paid.... dont do the job.... dont keep the job

Iilize..i clean to make ends meet...whilst your son is right it is her job it was very rude of him to say so. But slso you should be encouraging him to tidy his own room.

I clean for two lovely families and the kids rooms do get a bit messy but the parents are embarassed sbout it and fet them to do a few jobs so they are not awful teen rooms.

Your cleaner is being unreasonable op and very odd. Luckily my clients keep their mess to a minimum as they don't want me thinking they are total slatterns.

And i do clean the kids rooms as my attitude is if im getting paid then im going to do a good job and get more work. Your cleaner is a snob.

You really have to draw up a contract nowadays and make sure everyone knows what they are doing

What, like we all do for window cleaners ? Cleaner is just take no the piss

I’m actually shocked at the number of people here saying it’s demeaning for the cleaner to vacuum the au pair’s room or that the au pair should do it yourself.

OP, you pay the cleaner to clean your house, she is refusing to clean a room because of her beliefs. What if she said she’d clean your son’s room but not your daughter’s because she’s a girl and should do it herself? That’s no different.

Tell the cleaner. “Your work has been a real help to our family and I’d be sorry to end that but I do need a cleaner who will clean all the bedrooms, including au pair’s. If that’s not something you’re willing to do then we will regrettably have to find someone else.”

I think you have to get tough with the cleaner. You pay her to do the job you want. She doesn't get to pick and choose, she cleans Au Pairs room so you give her notice.

I'd wipe the floor with any age child of mine who spoke to a cleaner like that. Rude little bugger.

£23 a hour for cleaning??????

If the cleaner won't clean the Au Pair's room then you will have to deduct the amount for that room and pay it to the Au Pair. Give the cleaner the choice.

RuggyPeg and me. That is unbelievable. Reminds me of a time at school when someone in my class didn’t pick up litter and when told off said the cleaners were paid to do that. I think he got about 5 detentions...

My cleaner doesn’t tidy anyway- she cleans.

I don't get why someone who helps you in your house, has your keys, you trust with all your things should be treated as anything other than a close personal connection

Really OP? So all your close personal connections are paid to wipe your crap off the toilet rim?

She is an employee. You should respect her. And she respect you.
You are not asking for anything unreasonable and she is being unreasonable. Simple as that

Lilize, you are not really helping your son by agreeing with him that his mess will always be cleared up/the job of a woman (some woman, any woman)

We don't have a cleaner as I think it would not be good for my boys to think like your son!

Wow lilize your son was exceptionally rude & you shouldn't have agreed with him! Your 'help' is still a person who deserves respect.

Blueshoes...whatever. Perhaps re-read your entire set of comments before calling anybody else for theirs!

The thread that keeps on giving. I have an au pair and a cleaner. The au pair tidies and cleans her room and the children's room. The cleaner does the rest. It's part of our agreement with the au pair. BUT if I told the cleaner to do the au pairs room she bloody well would or she'd be gone.

Having been both a cleaner and the au pair many years ago I get the cultural conflict. A long standing cleaner doesn't want to drop down the pecking order below a young au pair, another foreigner who just arrived in the country. And that's a thing too among us immigrants by the way 

And all those perks over the years like being flexible around work times and helping her out with life admin is a factor. It means that you went above and beyond what's required from an employer. That's invaluable to someone who needed that help to settle here and it should be appreciated accordingly. I say that as someone who had an employer like you many years ago and did not take that sort of relationship for granted. Your cleaner is prioritising her sense of status over duties required for which she is getting paid for. It's very human but it is irritating, not to mention she expects you to pay her for work she doesn't do. And I get what she's saying about your house being nice to clean - it is a definite perk. I hated working for people who seemed to think that the cleaner was to scrub week's worth of dirt in 2 hours.

Good au pair is tricky to come by and yours seems fab. For what it's worth when I was an au pair, the cleaner who was with family for many years would avoid cleaning my room. I didn't ask why. I just cleaned my room myself. When she went for an extended holiday in her country, her cover cleaned my room, and I was surprised. When she returned, we went back to how it was. I sensed that this was an issue and didn't rock the boat.

Looks like you like the cleaner and you bonded over the years so it is a hard choice to be harsh and make her do it or sack her. However, if you feel very strongly about it and this has marred your view of her, tell her this straight while reminding her that you have been a good and supportive employer over the years. If she doesn't reflect and decide what is more important: status or the job, you have two options. Have a chat with the au pair and say that you want to keep the peace so could she take care of the her own room (which she seems to not mind) OR fire the cleaner because the relationship no longer works for you.

For those grandstanding on the whole au pair/cleaner situation - reverse snobbery is as unattractive as actual snobbery. When I was an au pair and a cleaner later I could see your sort miles off. You were the people who'd come in and patronise the face off me as if I was one of the oppressed so you could indulge your petty jealousies towards people who employed me. I wasn't one of the oppressed. I enjoyed doing both and getting paid for it with families that treated me well.

Answer the question. Why doesn't the 18 year old with a part-time job clean her own room?
Why the hell should someone else do it for her?

By those lights, why don't the OP or her kids clean their rooms? Why the hell should anyone else do it for them?

I'd fire her so fast her feet wouldn't touch the floor.

Someone with such exorbitant sensibilities that they want to be able to decide which household occupant is worthy of receiving the service they have been paid to deliver, is probably not well suited to being a cleaner.

If you've told the cleaner to clean that room, then she cleans it or her services will no longer be required.

She is paid to do a job and should. Do it.

Wow why all the hate for the armyisms? They are not hard to comprehend a lot of the time.

OP - you are now in a difficult situation. This au pair from the way you describe sounds like she would be mortified if she caused you the grief of loosing the cleaner. However I definitely think this is an important principle. If an ultimatum was given which would be nice and clear - either clean the full house or collect your P45, which way do you think she will go?

I think you'd be better finding another cleaner, but it might not be something so easy in your area...

So completely on the you should sack her side, but be cautious of upsetting the au pair.

She needs to do her job