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AIBU?

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Original poster

AIBU to be upset/angry at older man complaining about children in restaurant.

431 replies

Wakingwillow · 26/01/2019 22:52

Just that really. This is my first post but I've been a long time fan of AIBU. We're visiting the UK for a family event.
We're a family of 6, four kids age 11, 9 and 15 mth twins. Staying in a chain family friendly hotel for the weekend. Extended family here also.
After activities today everyone was tired so we decided to have a group family meal in the hotel restaurant. Total 7 children and 8 adults. 5 of the older children (age 8 to 11) sat at a table together next to us. All were very well behaved stayed seated, coloured pages and chatted. The twins sat with adults and made usual toddler noises but nothing too disruptive imo. We had items to keep them entertained and also took them out to lobby area several times.
We arrived at 6pm but due to under staffing there was a delay taking orders and getting food to the table. Kids were served food about 7.20 pm. Adults at 8 ish. (That needs another thread 😐)
After the toddlers had eaten my husband and I took them upstairs cleaned them up, got their pj's on then went back down with them to eat our own meal.
Just as we started eating an older man came over to our table and said that we had ruined his and his wifes night with all our noise.
I really didn't know what to say. I felt an array of emotions, embarrased, upset and finally annoyed/angry. We apologised for the toddlers being disruptive, explained there had been a long delay in them getting food and said we were doing our best to keep them occupied. I also asked him what else could we do, they had to eat to which he responded they should be feed in the room.
I'm so surprised and upset by this. I've never had this happen before and I'm usually very considerate of other diners when we're out as I'm quite shy and don't like to draw attention.
This has really upset me.
I'm just wondering what others have done / would have done in this situation.

OP posts:
echt · 27/01/2019 20:11

So what if a party of disabled people were there making noises?

Not are what you mean there. But anyway, they weren't.

Nice one with the assumption that the older are "grumpy", i.e. naturally, and by inference unreasonably sensitive. That's part of how ageism works.

oblada · 27/01/2019 20:16

I think the children are a red herring. A party of 15 is bound to be noisy. And yes most people don't like being sat near a big group but that's life!
Having said that i think I'd rather have a party of 15 with some children in the mix, especially older children, than a party fully comprised of adults! The latter are the noisiest ones often in my opinion. Before i had children i have vivid memories of dinners out being 'spoilt' by large groups of adults being sat near me and DH. I actually don't remember being bothered by young kids.
I can very well believe that the 5 older kids would have been fine at the restaurant and certainly not louder than 5 adults. My oldest 2 are 5 and 7 and are perfectly fine when out for meals, i can't imagine any issue going forward. My 2 yr old is a different story...I'm looking forward to him being a couple of years older so that i can enjoy eating out again.

Fishcakey · 27/01/2019 20:27

I have children and I still hate listening to kids making noise in a restaurant. If it's family friendly pub type place then you have to put up with it though and don't eat there if you don't like it. Very adulty place then he was probably right to be narked if he paid good money for his dinner. I'm not kid friendly and some people just aren't. I appreciate I have to tolerate them sometimes though.

AleFailTrail · 27/01/2019 20:38

Did he arrive after your DH took them to get changed but before he returned? The kids returning in pyjamas (which I loathe people in public doing no matter their age) could well have been the straw that broke the camel’s back, as it were.

Guineapiglet345 · 27/01/2019 20:40

We specifically choose those types of restaurants to take DD to because they’re family friendly (I wouldn’t eat in them under any other circumstances!) and if she gets bored or makes some noise other people should be expecting it because of the type of restaurant and also because I can’t imagine anyone would go to them for a “special” meal. If he wanted a quiet meal he should have gone somewhere a bit fancier.

WithAllIntenseAndPurposes · 27/01/2019 22:01

Echt but the gentleman in question was older and was grumpy Confuseddunno why that's an ageist rather than factual statement

ChiaraRimini · 27/01/2019 22:10

If the service in the restaurant hadn't been so slow there probably wouldn't have been a problem at all, fault lies with the restaurant.
But YY to those who point out that older men expect children to not exist, I've come across many of those in my time...

BertrandRussell · 27/01/2019 22:19

“Echt but the gentleman in question was older and was grumpy confuseddunno why that's an ageist rather than factual statement”
Why is it OK to say that the man was older? Would you be happy with a factual statement that he was black or fat or disabled?

rookiemere · 27/01/2019 22:39

Goodness I must be getting old myself ( if I'm allowed to say that) if there's something offensive about mentioning someone's likely age.

BertrandRussell · 27/01/2019 22:46

Rookie- what is the relevance of mentioning his age. Would it be OK to say he was black?

mathanxiety · 28/01/2019 00:46

Age has relevance as it suggests he doesn't spend his days dealing with babies or small children and may therefore have
1 - unrealistic expectations of their behaviour or anxiety in their presence, and/or
2 - an attitude toward children and their behaviour that is no longer current (eg. 'children should be seen and not heard', or 'children shouldn't be allowed in restaurants') and/or
3 - a sense of entitlement as a white man brought up at a time when it was acceptable for white men to put others in their place.

echt · 28/01/2019 01:53

Echt but the gentleman in question was older and was grumpy.dunno why that's an ageist rather than factual statement

The OP didn't say he was grumpy. She said he made a complaint. His age has nothing to do with the situation.

echt · 28/01/2019 01:58

Age has relevance as it suggests he doesn't spend his days dealing with babies or small children and may therefore have
1 - unrealistic expectations of their behaviour or anxiety in their presence,

A massive assumption.

An attitude toward children and their behaviour that is no longer current (eg. 'children should be seen and not heard', or 'children shouldn't be allowed in restaurants')

Another massive assumption

a sense of entitlement as a white man brought up at a time when it was acceptable for white men to put others in their place

What the fuck. Was he white? If so, so what? As a man he might well have the confidence to make a complaint, which is not the same as putting others in their place, by the way. He actually did what so many MNers are advised to do about situations they find unsatisfactory, i.e. why didn't you say something at the time?

Mummylife2018 · 28/01/2019 02:22

Personally I think it was unfair going into any restaurant with that many kids all at once. It's ALWAYS going to be noisy. It's unfair on anyone around you. Even that many adults would be noisy, never mind kids

Patroclus · 28/01/2019 02:30

The grumpy old sods have been off on one since the referendum.

olympic19 · 28/01/2019 02:31

Sorry, I'm with the complaining man.

You said that everyone was tired after activities which to me would be the first indication that taking toddlers to a restaurant might not be the best idea. They were sufficiently noisy that you felt the need to take them out "several times" and then - after 90 minutes when the poor bugger thought he was finally getting some peace - you brought them downstairs in pajamas.

What were you thinking?

olympic19 · 28/01/2019 02:36

*I think one of you should have taken the toddlers up to the room when you knew it was a long wait, and have the food sent up to you. There's no need to keep toddlers in a restaurant that length of time, it's unfair on other diners. Toddlers are noisy, no matter what you do to entertain them. People want to eat in peace.

I think you taking them up to the room then bringing them down again (in pjs) so you and DH could eat was the last straw for the older man. He would have breathed a sigh of relief when they went upstairs, finally able to enjoy dinner with his wife, only for you all to return so you and DH could eat together! Why didn't you or DH stay in the room and have your food brought up??

We travelled a lot when our DD was between 1 and 2, we often packaged our food halfway through a meal and took it up to our room because she was noisy or restless. There's no need to disturb a whole restaurant just because you want to eat at the table together.*

Exactly this.

Italiangreyhound · 28/01/2019 02:36

Wakingwillow it sounds like this man was incredibly rude. You did nothing wrong.

Mummylife2018 are you saying that people should not go out for meals in groups?

Interesting that he spoke to you OP, are you female?

If so I wonder why he didn't speak to one of the males looking after the children.

echt "The OP didn't say he was grumpy. She said he made a complaint. His age has nothing to do with the situation."

grumpy - bad-tempered and irritable. I think going up to a total stranger in a restaurant to make a complaint is pretty grumpy.

I like people wanting to tackle discrimination of people on any basis, but surely just stating the fact he was older is description, not discrimination, it's not saying that was the reason.

We do not know why he did it so we really cannot say whether his age played any part in it or not.

olympic19 · 28/01/2019 02:38

But assuming her toddlers were loud.... what was she supposed to do to prevent? Ditch rest of her family & order room service when she found out about the long wait?

Yes, that's exactly what she or her husband should have done.

Italiangreyhound · 28/01/2019 02:50

"The twins sat with adults and made usual toddler noises but nothing too disruptive imo." So not loud.

echt · 28/01/2019 02:57

grumpy - bad-tempered and irritable. I think going up to a total stranger in a restaurant to make a complaint is pretty grumpy

No it isn't. A complaint can be made with complete politeness. The being a stranger is beside the point. They're in a restaurant, no time to swap details and cosy up. as. comparison, f someone talks persistently in a cinema I speak to them personally. If they don't pipe down, then I'll go to the management.

I like people wanting to tackle discrimination of people on any basis, but surely just stating the fact he was older is description, not discrimination, it's not saying that was the reason

Sometimes, yes. But the juxtaposition of children and "older man" implied a host of assumptions associated with age which this thread has borne out, and is ageist.

Italiangreyhound · 28/01/2019 03:04

"Sometimes, yes. But the juxtaposition of children and "older man" implied a host of assumptions associated with age which this thread has borne out, and is ageist." Have those things been said by the OP. Because it looks like the OP made a simple statement, so you see 'juxtaposition of children and "older man"' but the situation was, presumably, he was older and she was out with kids, so factual.

Also what was the point of the complaint?

He could have complained formally to the restaurant about serving children after a certain time. He could have asked for a refund because his meal was ruined. He could have spoken to the OP during the meal in an effort to get the group to quieten down the kids.

"Just as we started eating an older man came over to our table and said that we had ruined his and his wifes night with all our noise."

Ruined, past tense, it suggests he was on his way out and I think that was just a mean spirited thing to do. So I think 'grumpy' sums it up even though the OP did not say that. I think his age is probably not relevant. What he did was unpleasant and unhelpful, IMHO.

mathanxiety · 28/01/2019 03:08

A massive assumption.
Echt

No, actually. He clearly does harbour completely unrealistic expectations of the behaviour of babies and small children, or he wouldn't have done what he did, or said what he said.

He is a man of a certain age, and therefore he was born and grew to adulthood in an age when it was fine to smack children and to openly disparage women. Yes indeed, he did have the 'confidence' borne of that, and clearly he had the mindset that somebody as important as him should not have to put up with children, the people you could smack into submission back in the good old days, but who now don't know their place, thanks to the milquetoast, indulgent parents who don't pay enough deference to people like him and therefore deserve an earful which was basically about his entitlement.

echt · 28/01/2019 03:15

No, actually. He clearly does harbour completely unrealistic expectations of the behaviour of babies and small children, or he wouldn't have done what he did, or said what he said

We only the OP's word for the reasonableness of the noise, and many posters have been at pains to point out that the size of the group on its own would have generated a lot of noise. The man did not mention the children in the OP's OP.

He is a man of a certain age, and therefore he was born and grew to adulthood in an age when it was fine to smack children and to openly disparage women. Yes indeed, he did have the 'confidence' borne of that, and clearly he had the mindset that somebody as important as him should not have to put up with children, the people you could smack into submission back in the good old days, but who now don't know their place, thanks to the milquetoast, indulgent parents who don't pay enough deference to people like him and therefore deserve an earful which was basically about his entitlement

Astounding assumptions as the man's upbringing, attitudes and thinking. Again.

Vixxxy · 28/01/2019 03:24

After the toddlers had eaten my husband and I took them upstairs cleaned them up, got their pj's on then went back down with them to eat our own meal.

This sounds so..pointless? Not understanding why this was done really but thats not the question I guess.

It really depends on how loud the kids were. I do think parents get immune to their own kids noise sometimes. But there also seems to be a lot of people who complain about kids making the slightest noise..

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