Social services..

[CandyCreeper]

Posted recently about my sons school referring me to SS. I had a phone call this evening at 6pm on my landline from what appears to be the LA phone number. Im taking it its social services? (not expecting anything else) but aibu in thinking it is an odd time to call? I missed it as have been in bed with flu this also means my house isnt at its best because im ill, can/will they turned up unannounced??

Yes Artfullydead your totally right. They’re not a babysitter service as some make out, if they felt that a parent would always need their help then I think that they would eventually remove the child.

There’s been cases where before the baby is even born then they’ve wanted to take babies from mothers who have emotional development problems and they’ve said that they fear the child would be at risk of ‘emotional neglect’, this is really really unfair, why not give a mother a chance to prove them wrong rather than assuming that she will do a bad job of being a parent, stories like these are why people are distrustful of them.

especially when the care system is barbaric and churns out hugely damaged and dysfunctional adults,

Exactly!

I would bloody love it if someone offered to record all my visits and meetings verbatim, it would save me a hell of a job

Filming I'm less keen on, but that's possibly because I've twice had pictures put online where people have incited violence against me (one when working in mental health services and one in children's). That and I've been held hostage twice and threatened with a stabbing. I don't really like to give people extra opportunity to try that stuff in the age of social media.

Posterbook there you go then you agree, are you a SW? Voice recordings would probably be enough and if necessary, you could then put it into a transcript and obviously keep the recording, your parents or whoever it is that you see (don’t know if your criminal justice/child etc sw) could also have a copy so that when the reports come in the post, then there’s no disputing about who said what and in what time or whatever, I genuinely think this is the way forward for Social Workers.

what time should read what tone

I’m a social worker; I have no issue with audio recording.

Someone above would have to okay that I think, or would it be up to the SW themselves?

Really? Said who? There were all kinds of cover ups all over that case.

Bollocks. The forensic reports clearly stated that there was no human bones present. The only suspicious thing appeared to be the determination of politicians to avoid bad publicity for Jersey and the then police chief to hype up the investigation into murder - which ended up with him being investigated by a UK police force for abuse of authority. He was informed of the forensic findings and ignored them. Teeth were found but they were found to be deciduous teeth which had fallen out naturally, perfectly acceptable in a place where a large number of children had lived and passed through.

From testimony, it would appear that the home was abusive but abusive in a similar way to homes in the UK and Ireland into which enquiries have been and are being held. The Jersey States did not have the stomach to look under that historical stone.

@scotshit try typing out a transcript of a voice recording and see how long it takes, then get back to me.

And no, I don't agree to being recorded. Because I've spoken to adults about their adult issues and then found they've recorded me and played selected parts back to their children. Abusive and shit. I wouldn't take that risk. If a parent is prepared for me to have a laptop in front of me while we talk I will type notes (summary, not verbatim) go through them with the parent, agree and amendments and sign and print them. Equally if a parent wants to make their own notes I'll do the same, but funnily enough noone ever has.

Yes Artfullydead your totally right. They’re not a babysitter service as some make out, if they felt that a parent would always need their help then I think that they would eventually remove the child.

SS can't remove a child without either police involvement (emergency, short term) or agreement of a judge (longer term, has to be reviewed regularly with a plan to aim to return the child asap)

There’s been cases where before the baby is even born then they’ve wanted to take babies from mothers who have emotional development problems and they’ve said that they fear the child would be at risk of ‘emotional neglect’, this is really really unfair, why not give a mother a chance to prove them wrong rather than assuming that she will do a bad job of being a parent, stories like these are why people are distrustful of them.

Why wait for a parent to damage a child before stepping in to intervene? How long do you give someone to prove that SS were wrong and they are actually capable of parenting a child, despite have one / two / three children who they have already failed to keep safe?

For the sake of disclosure, I'm an adoptive parent to a child who was removed at birth. She wasn't the first child that the birth mother had had removed - she had been given chance after chance after chance with the older ones, who ended up in long term foster care because it was agreed that adoption was not the right route for them. I'm incredibly pleased that the birth mother (many years later, and after completing the Freedom Programme, amongst other things) has now got three children that she has been able to raise herself. She has said that she knows now that she wasn't able to raise our DD at that point in her life, although it was incredibly difficult at the time that she was removed. Even removing a child at birth doesn't make everything OK - DH and I deal daily with the consequences of the decisions that were made by DD's birth parents, and it's bloody hard going sometimes.

Sorry for the derail - as you can tell, I loathe the complete minimisation of "it's only emotional neglect, it's not fair that the mother didn't get more of a chance to prove that she was adequate"

Well I disagree, what’s more important, how you’d feel if a parent was allowing their child to hear certain bits of what as their SW said (and I’m sure that’s quite rare) or a child being taken from their parents due to a SW lying/altering what a parent was really like? I didn’t get my DD taken but I’m talking about instances where it does happen, my SW said plenty about me and made out that I had said things in certain ways and I disagreed with it, so many parents do, a recording would put a stop to that.

Also I’d expect that a secretary could type up a transcript of a recording, not the actual SW.

Well said OlennasWimple. x

Scotschic... what secretary 😂😂😂

Emotional neglect? When I mentioned that I said that the child hadn’t even been born yet and yet SS said that her unborn baby was at risk of that, that’s not fair to either baby or parent, although fair and justice isn’t what some SW are about.

Also the judge agrees on whether a child has to be taken into care because of what the SW has told them, this is why recording should be allowed.

The law is the law and yet they have to audio record when they’re interviewing people, in case of coercion and things like that, so why shouldn’t SWs? Police even have to use body cams now due to cases of planted evidence and such like.

This is an issue I no longer want to discuss, I had a bad SW and due to this then this is why I’m all for audio recordings, it’s not rocket science, it’s common sense.

scot The Police don’t all record people they are “interviewing”. Witnesses dont get recorded as a matter or routine and police don’t “have” to wear body cams. And body cams aren’t because of planted evidence ffs.

I hate these threads on here. Social workers aren't the devil, 99% of them do the job because they care. Yes they male mistakes because, guess what - they are human.

For what it's worth .. I'm a social worker. I have medicated anxiety, MS and epilepsy - as such, my house isnt always spotless.

We don't care about dirt or about a bit of mess. People with gardeners, cook and cleaner can be abusive!

I'm not getting into the rights and wrongs of exactly when removal is the right thing to do (although we are the only European country who go down the route of forced adoption.)

However, SS are not a supportive, hand holding service for parents who may be struggling. That isn't intended critically or positively, it's a simple statement of fact.

The dealings I had with them were horrible.
The sw did nothing but lie to the point even my hv called her out about it.

Make sure you have another adult present to take notes.

I know there are some good sw out there but it's not worth the risk you'll get one of the bad ones.

Why wait for a parent to damage a child before stepping in to intervene?
Very true, chances have been given in many cases whereby the DM had a 2nd chance with a new one, after previous DC removed.
Those cases have ended in tragic circumstances for the DC or if they are lucky and then taken back into care.

@scotschic we don't have secretaries. We dont have admin. We're not even allowed to ask the receptionist to let us know that people have arrived for a meeting, we have to give our mobile numbers for people to call us directly. It takes approximately four times as long as the recording to type it, I have 3 or 4 visits/meetings a day on top of emails and calls, it just isn't and never would be possible, because sadly not enough people care about children's services enough to fund it.

I'm sorry you've had a bad experience with social services. I have my own reasons for not accepting recording due to the impact that I've seen with young people which has caused irrevocable damage. I do sympathise with the position though and do my best to mitigate that with the parents I work with, in other ways. I would hope that other SWs so the same but I can appreciate the are variances in any profession and I can only account for my own practice.

In respect of court, the SW tells the judge what they think. The parent(s) tell the judge what they think. The guardian tells the judge what they think. In that scenario, the judges are notoriously anti social workers, the guardians typically are (because the guardians and judges both work on the basis of what should happen, not what does happen, eg in an ideal world where preventative services would be plentiful, housing and benefit services would work in partnership etc) The judges also have a legal responsibility to avoid taking action unless neccesary ('no order principle'). So it isn't as simple as SW tells the judge something and the judge rubber stamps it. There are plenty of judges who take steps to publicize where they feel social workers have got it wrong.

I'm going to step away from the thread now but wanted to put in a plug for a fabulous website called the Child Protection Resource

childprotectionresource.online/

It was set up by a MNer lawyer who is deeply involved in child protection issues. It aims to provide clear, unbiased information to everyone who might be involved in child protection issues, including parents, SW and lawyers. If anyone on the thread or lurking has an questions about SS, they might find this site useful

I have a sen 2 year old and have self referred to sociak services for help, they arent as scary as people make out, unless there is reason to think kids are in danger or being neglected

In my experience the disability team are a whole didn’t ball game to CP. Self referral for support as oppose to allegations being made, are 2 different teams.

I too have a child with SEN, the disability team are excellent. The CP team trying to investigate something they have little or no experience of is totally different.

oleannawimple is that Spero? She was amazing, I sent her copies of everything and offered to represent me for free!

Yes, Claw, it is