People that have been in Jail.

[firsttimedad79]

I was just reading another thread about someone who had been in jail and was surprised by the negativity.

It wasn't mentioned what he had been in for or anything, it just assumed he was a bad person.

I've been inside twice in my youth, but I wouldn't consider myself a bad person. I made mistakes when I was younger but it doesn't dictate who I am now.

AIBU in thinking people automatically assume your bad because you've done time?

I've known loads of people who've been to prison, mostly men. The thing to bear in mind is it's a very demographically skewed thing. Offending peaks in the mid/late teens, especially for boys/men. Mostly they don't carry on, by they time they are mid 20s they have no interest in still burgling (which was the offence some men I knew had done time for) or anything else that risks prison time. The saddos who get locked up after that age range are carrying on with it, whether because they are nasty piece of work (knew one like that, pretty sure he was abusive at home, kept getting done for driving while disqualified, hence prison after about the 5th time caught), or doing it for drugs money or a drug dealer lifestyle because they are addicted and selling to support their habit. Be different if they were done for more serious crimes, but none of those people made me feel scared or unsafe around them, some were friends, one a lover who was a very sweet lad who'd had a shit time growing up. He was basically going straight when I met him.

Ribbonsonabox Sun 20-Jan-19 23:34:27
Overly proud? I posted on a thread in which the op asks about our relationship with people who have been in jail with what I thought was relevant to the subject. What have I actually said which implies I am 'overly proud'? I think you are being overly defensive and hostile tbh. 'Jaunty anecdote' lolz

My ex actually did try to kill me for what it's worth and I moved across the country and cut all contact with him. Because hes a violent abusive bastard. Not someone who made a mistake (albeit a horrific one) then did their time, directly apologised to me and backed up that apology by adressing thier problems with the help of professionals, never behaving that way again and living a decent life.

So you are used to accepting abusive relationships and people trying to kill you. Your idea of a healthy relationship is someone trying to kill you and apologizing but really meaning it. Your standards are very low and you're pretty defensive about it. Like I said, what I'd expect.

And of course friendships can be abusive and coercive to whomever said they can't. I mean that's pretty scary that people would deny that.

Women are generally (over)praised for martyrdom and forgiveness and that's one of the reasons that domestic violence is so prevalent. You always women furiously defending men "he's done is time!would never hurt a fly" etc nonsense. Even the Clare's Law advocates have stated that many women "don't want to know" when they are offered info through the law.

It doesn't surprise me that some people extend this low self esteem out to their friendships as well.

@canifoitnow I am sorry, I did misunderstand you. I agree with you totally and think you have good insight into the choices you made. I do have sympathy for you and hope you’ve been able to move on and make the best of things. Do you mind saying what support you’ve had since your release? Was it helpful on a psychological level to help you cope with the incident as well as prison?

@canidoitnow as per above post. :) Misspelled your username.

I'm not saying friendships can't be abusive, I've had such friendships myself before. But I didn't get the sense from what Ribbonsonabox said that it was a controlling friendship. Her best friend had been in a very dark place when she attempted to kill her, but got help and turned her life around. Hence she felt able to forgive her.

She's clearly not a mug, she's been able to get away from a violent partner.

I made mistakes when I was younger but it doesn't dictate who I am now.

A mistake is something that you do unintentionally by accident. I don't think you go to prison twice for making mistakes. You go to prison because you have intentionally done some bad things. So you can't say you were a good person then because the bad things you did then say otherwise.

However I do believe you can turn your life around and that you can say you are a good person now if you have shown remorse and made amends and lead a good life now.

I can understand people being cautious and suspicious of someone who has previously been in prison especially more than once because prison is normally the consequence of frequent or serious crime. The nature of the crime is also relevant to how people judge anyone who has been in prison.

I think people do deserve a second chance though as long as they have made a significant change to their lives in a good way and the passage of time has shown evidence of this.

It's actually 16% of the prison population that have been convicted of sexual offences, the increase is thought to be related to the increase in reporting of historical sexual offences.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachmentdata/file/633154/offender-managemen-statistics-bulletinn_-q1-2017.pdf

1/8 (2%) were convicted of raping a child
1/5 (3.2%) were convicted of sexually assaulting a child
1/6 (2.7%) were convicted of sexual activity or incest with a child over 13
6% (1%) for sexual activity or incest with a child under the age of 13.
1 in 11 (1.5%) were convicted of vouyerism or making sexual images of children.

www.civitas.org.uk/content/files/whogoestoprison.pdf

So by my calculation that makes 10.4% of the prison population....

Not if someone has been out of prison many years Lizzie , move e.g. Served a prison term he's been out from 17 yes s and has been in his current employment for over ten years

Nelson Mandella served a long prison sentence. Even so, I would have given him a job.
For most offenders imprisonment is a waste of money and time. What is needed now is a revival of transportation: offenders to serve their time assisting with the recovery of war and conflict devastated areas of the world. On their completion they return and are given financial resettlement assistance.

Yes it would colour my judgement

My DH has been in prison. He is def not a bad person and is actually very respectable. He was a bit of a wild child in his youth and got caught for drink driving (2nd offence). He was sentenced to teach the other (posh) college students and himself a lesson. He was made an example of. It has made him a more rounded person, he can get on with anyone from any walk of life.

“A nice guy who got in trouble for having a bit too much cannabis on him
(not a very large amount at all) and was unlucky enough to get searched (and to be working class...)”

You don’t get sent to prison for having a “not very large amount” of cannabis on you!
You need to have a shit load! Or loads of previous.
I think he’s telling you porkies!

Lizzie48 Mon 21-Jan-19 16:06:58
I'm not saying friendships can't be abusive, I've had such friendships myself before. But I didn't get the sense from what Ribbonsonabox said that it was a controlling friendship. Her best friend had been in a very dark place when she attempted to kill her, but got help and turned her life around. Hence she felt able to forgive her.

She's clearly not a mug, she's been able to get away from a violent partner.

People get away from abusive partners and go straight to new ones all the time. People run away from abusive parents to get with abusive men. They leave abusive men and move back in with abusive parents. There is no law that says leaving a violent partner means you can't have other abusers in your life.

And frankly, "forgiving" a violent offense doesn't necessitate friendship. That's what a lot of ex offenders don't seem to get and it seems the mugs people defending them on this thread don't get it either. Just because you were punished doesn't mean the victim is made whole. It doesn't require the victims (i.e. society) to roll out the red carpet. Employment discrimination is illegal and unfair (unless the role requires it) but that doesn't mean people don't have the right to personally treat people with caution.

"firsttimedad79" is just your typical ex con. Remorse remorse remorse but as soon as there are consequences they immediately play the victim. It's the same entitlement that led them to commit crimes. Putting themselves first always.

I dont' even know why everyone is so scared. Mumsnet is FULL of women who date and marry offenders. Batterers, abusers, child molesters, thieves, murderers - they're never lonely. There's aways some idiot morally superior human being happy to take them in. Shamelessly defending them.

Why can't these thugs leave the rest of us alone?

Another person I know went for illegal images sad He s a very messed up person, he is not all bad but he went very wrong at some point.

You do understand that for these pictures to be made children have to be abused? That makes him a horrible person. Illegal pictures don't accidentally end up on someones hardrive.

I would be wary of being involved with anyone who has been sent to prison.

darkriver if that is Ribbon you are quoting then the sex offender she is referring to is a friend of hers and Robbon has no issue with that person being around her children. She has posted about it on another thread today.

Shocked me.

@nickynacky ! That is disgusting!!

But no it wasn't ribbon. It was someone else.

Nicknacky

thank you for posting that! Women like this will act like butter doesn't melt but then on other threads will reveal their true colours.

This is the kind of woman who "forgives" ex cons.

Apologies if it wasn’t Ribbon however she has posted about that friendship. It wasn’t clear who darkriver was quoting.

@Lonelyheart2020

You are talking about John McAvoy

He was sentenced to five years for armed robbery. He was released and went to live in Spain. He returned to London. Was then found guilty for conspiracy to commit armed robbery and was sentenced to life.

Two very serious crimes.

It’s when people get sent to prison twice is where I begin to lose sympathy. Once? Absolutely there can be scenarios where it is unjustified and doesn’t represent the person’s true character.

Second time? Hmmmm

I am bery surprised and shocked at the amount of negitivetity to people who have been in prison. People make mistakes. Sometimes very big ones. Yes some things are inforgivable but others are not.

Some people totally turn their lives around and its not fair for you to judge them just because they were in prison

There are two types of people good people who have done bad things and bad people who do bad things. Not eveyone is lucky enough to be raised by good people and unfortunately some people dont stand a chance. Prison can teach people new coping stratergies, give the counselling about abuse they may have suffered and give them an education. Offer drug and alcohol addiction services etc All things that can completely change a persons life that they may not have had before.

If we dont give anyone a second chance how do you expect people to change

@Seb19521710

There are another two groups.
Good people who don’t do bad things
Bad people who don’t do bad things

I agree, i never even got a detention at school let alone commit a crime. But i had a very good up bringing some people dont know any better until they are taught better and sadly often they are not taught until they reach prison. Do you judge people who cant write because they were never taught, or cant drive because they were never taught. Bad parenting is responsible for alot.

Plus i a fually ment two types of people in prison.

I missed that post from darkriver. I have to say that I wouldn't have anything to do with a former friend who had been caught with illegal images, as a victim of SA myself that would be a red line.

I am also aware that victims of abuse often get involved in other abusive relationships. My DSis's first marriage was abusive, so she moved from an abusive family background to an abusive marriage.

What I objected to was the insistence that Ribbon must be a mug. Yes she might be, but I said I didn't get the impression that that was how it was. At any rate, shouting at her on this thread is hardly going to convince her, is it? My DSis wouldn't let me say a word against her abusive ex at the time, she kept blaming herself, that was so frustrating but she worked it out for herself eventually. (She's in a very happy second marriage now. )

And no, obviously there's no obligation to befriend an abuser just because you've forgiven them. I wouldn't be at all happy if it was one of my DDs in that position.