Accused of being racist

[Montagu90]

Hi all

I have NC and don't want a potential flaming tarnishing my TTC posts!

Had an upsetting run in today that has made me have a long hard look at some assumptions I made and question whether I was in fact, being racist.

I don't consider myself in anyway racist and am not one of those 'I'm not racist but...' people. However, please tell me if in the below scenario IWBU

DH and I are avid foodies and like to try foods from various parts of the world. We really enjoy Asian, Thai, Vietnamese food but although love Indian food, we can never seem to master it at home. Over Christmas I attempted my fourth Biryani only to fall once again at the right balance and texture of rice.

So I decided this weekend to try once more. I went to a really good local greengrocers who happen to be run by an Indian couple and therefore have a good varied range of Indian spices and things I can usually never find (ghee for example). I picked up the ingredients for my recipe but noticed a few other customers had bought these packs to make up various Indian curries which have all the bits you need in them. So I picked up one of these too.

When I got to the till I asked the man whether they were any good. He replied they seem to be popular but he hasn't tried them himself. I then laughed and said I've never quite managed the perfect Biryani and I don't suppose he has any tips for the perfect recipe? He got visibly cross and said 'why, just because I'm Indian I must know how to cook a good curry?' I stuttered and apologised if I'd caused any offence, I was just genuinely asking if he could offer me any assistance... he then said he didn't go around asking every white person how to make gravy and I should consider what I say before making such racist comments.

I got out of there quite quickly but just felt awful. I've since wondered why I asked him... the fact that he ran a shop which had a specialist section on Indian food was certainly part of it. However, if the shop had been run by a white man, I don't think I would have asked.

So I did make an assumption based on his perceived culture. But I see this as no different to asking my Welsh friend for their best Rarebit recipe (which she happily gave me). I definitely wouldn't have stopped a random man in the street so where he was working definitely had something to do with it.

I am now sitting at home feeling awful that someone thinks of me this way when all I wanted was to make a nice Saturday night meal.

So WIBU?

The OP said it was a specialist shop in that she can find things that she can't get elsewhere, like a supermarket.

Flower, dear me, it was a question based upon his occupation and hopefully expertise in the items he sells.

It was not a random question of a stranger in the street.

@flower777 you've made an assumption about the OP's Welsh friend.

I think it would wear a bit thin if I lived abroad and people were constantly asking me how to cook roast dinners or cottage pie. I don't much care for either (can't bear cottage pie). I would imagine this sort of thing wears him down and, while you didn't mean any harm, I can understand where his reaction might be coming from. It's something that, generally, white people don't need to think about - it doesn't do us any harm to be confronted with that occasionally. Don't beat yourself up about it, but take it on board.

You weren't being outrageously racist but he probably has to field a lot of this low level stuff on a frequent basis and you got it in the neck. If he'd already told me he didn't use a cooking product the shop sold I wouldn't have expected tips from him on a specific dish you were cooking. If you'd just made a passing comment about your biryani failing that would have allowed him to respond if he had any relevant advice.

Hummm tricky this...

Just because he is Indian and might stock some specialist Indian ingredients, it doesn't mean he knows much about using them in a recipe, or how to cook a specific meal. However...

You could equally say 'why would you assume I asked you because you're Indian? you might have been asking him because he's selling the product! (that wasn't the case, but he made an assumption of you too).

I live in Manchester. I don't know everything about Manchester, but it's fairly natural for someone to ask me about it, or about Mancunian music etc. It's presumptuous, but not without reason.

I don't believe your question was racist, there's a fairly logical reason why you asked. Is it sexist to ask a woman about a woman's health matter?

Personally, I think he could have laughed 'with you' and said 'I've no clue, I never touch the stuff!' - which would have highlighted that not all Indian's eat Indian food, or know how to cook it, but to deem it racist was just as presumptive as your question was.

Bobobobobo - yes! Good point. Thank you for letting me know!

But if you were selling wool, the question about darning would be fine.

really good local greengrocers who happen to be run by an Indian couple and therefore have a good varied range of Indian spices and things I can usually never find (ghee for example)

Not a specialist shop

I guess he could be third generation and has grown up in a household that never ate Indian food and never took part in Indian cultural activities. But if he runs a specialist Asian food-shop, I really don't think it's racist to enquire about cooking the ingredients that he sells.

I see everyday racism more as 'where are you really from?' types of comments or assumptions that POC can't speak proper English.

It's a normal greengrocers but they are known to have specialist selection of Indian Ingredients and have two aisles specifically for these sorts of things. So although you can go in and get the usual fodder, they are also known locally to be specialist in this area

Relevant quote CrazyDuchess

MY (INDIAN) DH WOULD HAVE BEEN CROSS IF YOU'D ASKED HIM THAT

PLEASE DON'T ASSUME THINGS ABOUT PEOPLE BECAUSE OF THE WAY THEY LOOK
unless he was behind the counter of a shop with a speacilist Indian food section I doubt she would ask your husband .
If she went charging out into the street demanding a curry recipe from the first Indian person she saw then yes racist .But to ask a person in a food shop about food they were buying is no different than asking a lifeguard how to swim .

How on earth did we get to the point where asking for recipe advice is classed as racism?

I don’t think it was totally unreasonable to ask as he works there, BUT you wasn’t asking about products, you asked about a specific dish from his country which is probably why he was upset. It wasn’t racist, just a bit ignorant in that setting. Would have been perfectly fine if he ran a restaurant or was a chef, for all we know he can’t even boil an egg.

I read this almost exact post on Digital Spy, a while ago.

Again the point is the OP said if the power was white she would never had asked him.

OPs post are littered with casual racism

You weren’t racist, but it is annoying for people to make those sorts of assumptions. I’m always being asked if I know how to make jerk chicken and rice and peas - I’m not from the Caribbean, what are you asking?

Why would asking a British person about how to make gravy be racist?

I’m not a Brit, but if I wanted tips on making Yorkshire puddings, I’d probably text my (non-chef) English friends if looking for advice. It wouldn’t dawn on me to ask my Chinese or India or Australian friends.

If owner was white she would never had asked him

NRFT but this is ridiculous - if an Asian, Indian or any other race asked me how to make yorkshire puddings I wouldn't call them racist because they would be assuming as a white person I would know how - so bloody odd

I don't think you were racist OP.

But because of the way he responded to you, he's now lost your custom as you've now decided to shop elswhere. I would too.

Oh ffs what a snowflake he is, im welsh i havent got a bloody clue of a good welsh rarebit recipe but i wouldnt have said ur racist. Hes working in a shop that sells food supplies get over urself man. I would have got really arsey with him. I was accused of racism as a student because i didnt like the way my flatmate would not clean up after themselves but she felt it quite ok to call me a welsh bitch. Im married to a mixed race man and before anyone says yes that is how he defines himself, he says people just use it cos they think they can. Tbh its getting so over used and for stupid stuff i probably would have told him to stuff his supplies. No ur not racist.

If owner was white she would never had asked him It's possibe the OP said this to us, here, as a defence against AN Other Poster.

I would have asked him regardless of his race, his dress code and I'd even have asked if he was a woman, a teenager, a pensioner...

Cos that's what any member staff in any shop is there for!

Hmm. Obviously it’s not extreme racism but I would say it does touch on a racist stereotype and can see why he was upset.

Just don't go there again op.

Life's too short.