To think people who have children are bonkers

[Ichabod2000]

I read threads like these: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3228427-to-ask-what-s-an-adult-problem-that-nobody-prepared-you-for, and a common theme is the crushing relentlessness and thanklessness of parenting (motherhood in particular).

Why do it? Really? It's largely a voluntary choice, and has a tangible negative impact on your time, finances, career, relationships, and often physical and mental health. Not to mention the huge negative impact overpopulation is having on our planet.

I understand people feel overwhelming love for their children, but this is after the fact - you don't feel overwhelming love for children that don't exist yet.

And people talk about how rewarding it is - but there are lots of rewarding things you can do that don't involve propagating your genes.

I'm at an age where people ask me about my plans for children, and I just can't objectively see an advantage to it. I have a brilliant DH, an interesting job that I enjoy, and plenty of free time and moolah. Why would I make the conscious decision to risk these things I have? Why do so many make that choice?

I think it's bananas, personally, and I wonder if its just me that doesn't get it?

There have been a few of these posts over the years. I’ve never understood why anyone who chooses to be childless would come to mumsnet to start a thread about how having kids is a shitfest.

Biology, obviously.

And rather than obsessing about about the planet being too populated, remember on a more local level society needs children- they will be the ones paying your pension, growing up to be the doctors, police, shop workers etc we need. Society needs children, so I wouldn't be quite so obnoxious about it, enjoy your choice and respect others.

I think it’s a perfectly valid choice to decide not to have children

I think a lot of people have kids not because it’s a logical thing to do
But that it’s just an emotional need they want that unconditional love and want to give that unconditional love

I’ve been lucky in that I’ve not really found it that hard and have really enjoyed parenting
But i can imagine eve. If you’ve relaly strugggled with it
It’s so fullfulljgn and rewarding you would still think it was worth it

Seriously...why are you here?

I'm not bashing anyone - I just tried to humourously exaggerate my apparent inability to understand the advantages of having children.

I've come to mumsnet, everyone asking, because I'm struggling with the questions people ask me about my child-having state - and this is a place where people talk about parenting experiences.

Nobody should have children if they don't want them obviously. DH and i have 2 I do not consider that to be ecologically irresponsible. Overpopulation is not a problem in the West, in sub Saharan Afri a women are still having 8 and 9 children, that's the issue. Also some unusual families like the Duggars

My mother didn't have the urge and I wrecked her life (well having sex in 1959 did actually). I spent my childhood being told I was unwanted and how much better her life would be if she hadn't got pg and hadn't had to marry my dad. He was a nice man, she worked, plenty of money and help.

I cannot remenber a time when I did not want children. My life's ambition was to be a mummy.

But, first I had a career (not really planned) in the City. Bought a flat, then a house, travelled a bit, had a fantastic wardrobe, car, freedom. Met DH, had two DC, had several years at home. Went back to work p/t when youngest entered y1. Second career took off.

Having children is wonderful. I had so much fun when they were little: leaf kicking, watching them grow, waiting for Harry Potter books and films, the museums, jumping waves, teaching them to read, their colours, blowing bubbles, looks of wonder and that soft, arm curled unconditional love that comes with it.

Hearing them now chat about philosophy, swap books, coming in from clubbing at 5am (they still keep us awake) is just as marvellous. Taking dd back to uni today - discovering new cities, taking in the Cam.

Seeing them grow and mature and start to travel the world.

It's bloody marvellous op but if you don't feel it, don't do it. My mother should never have had a child but fortunately I was/am resilient enough to get over it and take from it that you never, ever mess your kids about. DD is emotionaly frailer and far more perceptive and would have been damaged so don't do it.

But if my mother hadn't the world wouldn't have the two amazing young people I have nurtered on the brink of living independent lives and contributing to society..........

I can see why you might think this OP after reading the thread that you
mention. Honestly I’ve never read anything more depressing in my life! But that hasn’t been my experience of ‘being an adult’ or parenthood at all!

For me I think it’s being at work and having to be the first to leave and rush to pick up from nursery etc. Yes life would be better and easier if I could finish my work at a better pace and then maybe go for a drink with a colleague or be spontaneous and on the way home decide to pick up a bottle of wine and some takeaway to share. I do miss being able to do these things instead of running for a train but at the same time 100% of me just wants / needs to be with my child as quick as humanely possible because I have missed them in the day more than I can explain.
Then yeah, the evening is chaotic and some of it is lovely and a lot is just mess and annoyance but then they go to sleep next to you and I wouldn’t want to be on my third margharita in a bar right then and not with them (even though at the same time I kind of very much would like that).

I think I also had the primal urge, but I will admit something that isn’t often admitted. If I hadn’t had children I would have gone through life never having anyone who loved me. My own parents were dire, less said about that the better. Due to that I rushed into the arms of the first man who came along, who turned out to be a violent alcoholic. I left him when the DC were very small because he would have killed me if I’d stayed any longer. I never met the right man. Maybe because of my messed up upbringing. I didn’t know what a normal relationship was. I didn’t have a great career to mess up. I didn’t lose a single thing when I had DCs, I only gained.

Now many years later I have a lovely home, a great career and two adult DCs who I not only love but also get on really well with. Everything I became and have now is because of them. They are also doing well in life so all the things we went through haven’t hampered their futures. I acknowledge I had DCs for the wrong reasons to begin with (though I didn’t know it at the time) but I don’t want to even think where I would be without them. Certainly not better off in any way.

If someone feels loved, happy and fulfilled without DC then good for them. I certainly don’t think someone who doesn’t want them should have them just because. But for me personally, my life would have been empty without them.

Before children I travelled a lot and had more disposable income. That was nice and all, but my life is overall more textured and more fulfilling on a deeper level since having children.

Could I afford a bigger house and nicer holidays if I didn’t have them? Well yes, probably. But I could also definitely get paid more in a job that was less interesting and rewarding and that I’d enjoy less than the one I have now, and that doesn’t make me want to move careers.

It’s the most amazing feeling in the world. That’s why. Yes it’s hard but the good bits outweigh the bad 10000000%

I’ve always known that I wanted kids. I think it was partly primal urge, issues with my own parents and that it’s (usually) the “done thing”

I’m 28 now and am 36 weeks pregnant. I went to uni and have always wanted to travel but never could have afforded to (I did Camp America and a few trips to European countries but that’s it). I still feel this would be the case had I not gotten pregnant. I feel like my life is more exciting now than it was pre pregnancy.

Career wise I have never known what I’ve wanted to do and wasted my early to mid 20s in jobs I hated that we’re going no where. I’m now in a trainee position and undergoing a career change so me being pregnant hasn’t halted my career (although the men who are in the same postion as me do get to do more, it’s not a race and I’m more bothered about qualifying at the end).

However, I do see what you mean about people only banging on about the negatives. I do often think to myself when people are whinging “well why have them then?” But I don’t have a lot of patience for “mummy martyrs” so

I don't think I would have felt "complete" if I didn't have children. I've had that urge for a long time, I always knew I would have children. That overwhelming love I have means I'll happily go through all the shit bits and more for them. But maybe I am a bit bonkers as I'm expecting my 5th child

You’ve come to mumsnet to tell us how repugnant you find the notion of having children is...because we’re a parenting site? Just...what?
Again...why have you come to mumsnet to point out that having kids is a poor choice?

That’s beautiful about your children Asta

And you’re not ‘struggling’ whatsoever - you are quite opinionated and sure of yourself on the subject. Don’t lie.

You really have no idea OP why people have children? Like seriously just because it’s not 100% perfect all the time- name anything in life that is. Do we not all save up and spend a fortune on a house only to complain, do we not all slog our guts out at work and complain?! Hit up the infertility threads and see how soul destroying people find the idea of not having children and the lengths they go to try and conceive.

Asking people why they have children is like asking someone why they bother to cook.

Cooking a fabulous, elaborate 3 course dinner is time consuming, expensive, frustrating at times and tiring. Plus it creates a lot of mess. But most people would recognise that it is rewarding to eat that dinner and that there is enjoyment in the preparation of it, hard though it is.
You could save yourself a lot of time, money and energy and just eat a Pot Noodle but that doesn't necessarily make for a more rewarding experience.

So it is with children. For me.

I suspect the reason you're seeing posts that say 'it's so hard, it's ruining my life' is because people are venting or seeking advice about the tough bits of parenting. Those of us who are happy with the choice we made and not struggling aren't posting to say so. My children are adults now so I'm well past that stage. Having children is the best thing that ever happened to me but it's not something to do lightly. I wish more people made the decision not to do it, frankly.

I'm struggling with the questions people ask me about my child-having state

Why though? Just tell them to mind their own. It’s not like you’re required to set out an options appraisal and a business case for not having kids.

I think the answer is some people get a primal urge to have children. This happens to people who have always considered themselves to not want children and to those who have always have wanted to. Sadly it also happens to so many people who cannot become a biological parent.

You are correct in many ways op regarding the negative elements but still it is difficult to describe some of the numerous positive elements that make it so important to many people.

The good thing is that you have a genuine choice. In the past many women couldn't easiliy choose not to have children, as recently as the 70s, most ordinary women had little choice in as much as they were 'expected' to have children by family and friends.

In my experience, pretty much everyone moans about their life. Venting from time to time, especially on an anonymous forum, doesn't invalidate your choices or mean you don't like your life overall.

An ex-friend of mine always used to come out with the whole "children obviously ruin your life because parents are always moaning. My friends obviously all wish they'd aborted their kids. I'm so glad of my superior life choices" stuff (I was childfree myself at the time so it wasn't a reaction to anything I said, just a hobby-horse of hers). Thing is, she was actually the whiniest person I've ever met. I'd go out for meals with her and I'd just be waiting for the moment her mouth inevitably turned down like a toddler and she'd whine "but I don't like this!". She went on exotic holidays with her very pleasant husband then dragged him home because she was on her period and didn't fancy all the foods she'd normally eat, so he wasn't allowed to enjoy the holiday either. She gave up her career to be a writer (which she could afford because her husband earned well), then moaned all the time about not being the next J K Rowling yet, even though she hadn't even started her planned book.

I had boundless respect for her for knowing that she didn't want kids and sticking by that decision. I just couldn't understand her total lack of self-awareness!

They shouldn’t be asking anyway. It’s rude. Just tell them you don’t want kids? It’ll sink in... eventually.

I hate that expectation that because your a woman you should want kids